How much does a good score on ACT/SAT increase my chances whereas I can waive them?

[SiaraAR]

Your life-changing help would be much appreciated.

I’m an international applicant from a country which SAT/ACT are not offered. I took SAT subjects last year, but now our currency has changed so much and traveled abroad for taking the test has some difficulties for my family.

I’m studying to get a 100+ score in TOEFL.

Whereas I’m a medalist of national math Olympiad, in Olympiad summer camp we took the international exam at the same condition and time with the real international contestants and I scored 16/42 which was the score of bronze cut-off!

I’ve studied in the best school in our country for girls which has a competitive entrance exam and although I concentrated to get a math medal in high school and we had different classes than other students, I’ve got a 19.7/20 GPA (I think it’s at least top 5 among 200 -my school doesn’t rank)

my subject scores are Math 2: 770, Math 1: 760, Physics: 750. (I could easily get 3, 800s but I and my mom got sick during travel)

I’m doing a research with one of my young teachers who is a doctorate student now and I’ve done another with my brother (he’s a professor), respectively about computer science and game theory.

I’m doing an IoT project now in the Sharif University of Technology in a competition of a summer school related to start-ups and inventions.

I’m a professional chess player since 7. I’m also a good teacher and mentor for young girls in our schools and I’ve worked with some charities and enjoyed all the moments teaching little cute girls, too.

I’m also a curious, open-minded, book-worm individual who is passionate about mathematical concepts and math philosophy, computer science and coding, music and literature, entrepreneurship and social works and many scientific areas such as genetics, cosmology and cognitive science.

Moreover, I have an inspirational and emotional life story of how seeking for freedom and independent thought, struggling with many kinds of discrimination, led me to an interest in intellectual concepts and finally how I found a way…

Overall, How do you think a good score in SAT/ACT test would help my application to stand out? (I’ve planned for applying to reach, match and safety schools and I’m determinant to go to the USA next year.)

[TheBigChef]

If you are aiming to get into a top US school, I would advise looking at the SAT/ACT this way: It is just one of several keys that you need to gain admission. A great (or even perfect) score alone will not get you in but a less than great score will probably keep you out. A 1520 SAT score or 33/34 on the ACT are great scores but you need a great GPA and ECs as well (which it sounds like you have). Also, FYI, SAT subject tests generally don’t count for much when it comes to admissions.

[SiaraAR]

So you mean It’s better to take the test even if I don’t get a great score and do not waive it?
Iranian/Chinees/ from each country which the tests are not offered in have two options for applying to MIT: 1. TOEFL and subjects 2.SAT/ACT and subjects.
According to the fact, do you still think that waiving the tests may keep me out?
In addition, what do you mean exactly by “FYI”? (first-year institution?)
Thank you so much for your response!

[bopper]

US Colleges might not be aware of the school system in your country. SATs or ACTs help give them an idea of how you compare to US students. Most colleges require them, but there are some colleges that are test-optional…however, I suspect you would need financial aid to afford college.

I would advise you to Check on https://educationusa.state.gov/ for an advising center for your country to get info on applying to US colleges

Are you sure your country doesn’t offer the SAT? https://collegereadiness.collegeboard.org/pdf/sat-international-code-list.pdf

[TheBigChef]

Didn’t realize that you were asking about MIT specifically. As you say, if English is not your native language, you don’t need to take the SAT or ACT, just TOEFL and 2 subject tests (one math, one science). Assuming this is the case with you, you are not required to take the SAT or ACT. If you did take the SAT or ACT anyway and ge a 1520 or 33, I don’t know if it would help you get in or not. Although these are great scores, they may be below median at a super competitive school like MIT. I would also recommend re-taking the SAT 2 subject tests and aiming for an 800 on both. Finally “FYI” is short for “for your information.” In any event, I wish you luck and hope things work out for you.

[Lindagaf]

Yes, getting a good score on the SAT or ACT will help your app. I’m curious as to why you took subject tests before you took the standard SAT. At any rate, you seem to be a strong applicant. If you are thinking of applying to Harvard and similar, you most likely must have a score for either the SAT or ACT. You can email an admissions officer at the college’s you are interested in and ask for their opinion.

There is another possibility. Apply to some test-optional schools which are on par academcially and reputation-wise with schools such as Harvard and Yale. I am thinking primairly of colleges such as Bowdoin, Middlebury, and U Chicago. They will look at your high subejct test scores, but your application will not automatically be eliminated if you don’t have an SAT score. http://www.fairtest.org/sites/default/files/Optional-Schools-in-U.S.News-Top-Tiers.pdf
Many of those same colleges will also have good financial aid for international students.

[skieurope]

my subject scores are Math 2: 770, Math 1: 760

As an FYI, you only needed one. Colleges will not consider these as different tests. Similarly, one would not submit both Spanish and Spanish with Listening or Bio-E and Bio-M.

I’m curious as to why you took subject tests before you took the standard SAT.

@Lindagaf It’s not that unusual. I did all my Subject Tests first. Subject Tests can and should be taken following the appropriate course. So if one took chem as a sophomore, there is no reason not to take it at the end of sophomore year, if desired. It’s seems to be a CC fallacy that one need AP Chem to take the Subject Test.

[lookingforward]

OP said SAT/ACT is not available in her country and now she can’t as easily travel to another, for more testing, at this point.

There are wys to apply without the test, but first OP needs an idea how her current prep makes her a good candidate for a school on the level of MIT. @SiaraAR, are there any teachers or other adults familiar with the US college system? Yes, a good idea to check the educationusa web site and any advice they offer.

Many strong applicants will come from many countries. Part of the first step is to learn how you may be competitive- not just grades ad scores, but for the challenges of adapting to a US university. MIT may not be the right choice for you. We don’t know more about you.

[SiaraAR]

Thank you for your informative response.
On the website that you mentioned, I just found one company for my country and I’m going to call them (but I doubt they can help much)
Yes, I’m sure my country doesn’t offer ACT/SAT (I’m from Iran).

[skieurope]

I’m from Iran

What you need to do is contact each and every college in which you are interested and explain your situation. Some might (and I emphasize might) have a workable suggestion for you. However, you are just as likely to receive a response such as:

We’re sympathetic to the fact that students living in certain countries where these tests are not offered (e.g., the Islamic Republic of Iran) are challenged to fulfill this requirement. However, given the large number of applications we receive from students throughout the world, we very rarely make exceptions to the requirement.

http://admission.universityofcalifornia.edu/freshman/requirements/examination-requirement/index.html

If there are no colleges which require SAT scores offer a workable solution, then your other opportunity, as @Lindagaf suggested, is to look for test-optional colleges.

[SiaraAR]

I took them before because I wanted to waive ACT/SAT and take the TOEFL instead but I didn’t take finally so my application wasn’t complete so I took a gap year. But I know some of my friends have been accepted to Harvard, Stanford, and MIT with waiving ACT/SAT.
@Lindagaf thank you so much for your kindness and advice! I consider colleges that you mentioned, But why they don’t care about tests?

[SiaraAR]

my first reply was to @TheBigChef

[skieurope]

But I know some of my friends have been accepted to Harvard, Stanford, and MIT with waiving ACT/SAT.

As a follow-up to my earlier comment about talking to the colleges directly, this is what Harvard says:

You are only exempt from this requirement if your country does not offer these tests and traveling to take them would be difficult.

https://college.harvard.edu/admissions/application-process/international-applicants

This is what Stanford says:

The SAT or the ACT is required for all undergraduate applicants. If no sittings of these tests are offered in your country, you may request a testing waiver. The request must be submitted by a school official in writing by email (credentials@stanford.edu), mail or fax: (+1) (650) 723-6050. Include your full legal name, school name and date of birth at the top of the letter. No form is required. Requests will be reviewed on a case-by-case basis.

https://admission.stanford.edu/apply/international/index.html

This is what MIT says:

Students from countries where the SAT and ACT are not offered for all students (such as Iran and the People’s Republic of China) will be considered without a full set of required test scores on a case-by-case basis.

http://mitadmissions.org/apply/international/intltests

That said, the odds are long. There are a grand total of 4 undergraduate students from Iran attending Harvard. Therefore, on average, they admit one person per year. Good luck.
http://www.hio.harvard.edu/statistics

[SiaraAR]

@skieurope thank you for your information but I knew what you said. I just took both to send the most! but 760 in math 1 has a 96 percentile while 770 in math 2 has a 70 percentile so which one is better?
I didn’t take subjects first because of what you said, I didn’t even study so much for them because they were too easy for me. I took them first because I planned to take TOEFL and subjects and waive SAT.
Thank you for your response

[skieurope]

760 in math 1 has a 96 percentile while 770 in math 2 has a 70 percentile so which one is better?

Math 2 because it covers more topics and your score is higher (although really, the difference between a 760 and 770 is statistically insignificant).

Don’t get caught up with percentiles. It is important to understand that for several subjects, the percentiles are depressed because so few colleges request Subject Tests, that the ones that do are the ultra selective ones. As a result, it is the high achieving kids taking the tests. No AO is sitting on the floor cross-referencing scores with percentiles.

[SiaraAR]

@skieurope
I know the policies about waiving but I know Iranian students who were accepted with good scores in SAT/ACT, too.
as I don’t want to risk and aim for a good result, I’m considering the difference a good score in the ACT may make in my application.

[SiaraAR]

@skieurope the low number of undergraduate students from Iran isn’t caused by their quality or low chance of admission, the main factor is the low number of applicants and difficulties they should struggle with. Most of the people in my country even don’t know there’s a chance for them to apply for undergraduate!!
But Iran has a very high brain drain rate that is for masters and Ph.D. degrees which shows Iranian students are of high quality.
In addition, I think that I could be one of those rarely admitted students because despite all the difficulties amongst girls in Iran I accomplished and I’ve got a Math Olympiad medal and I’m prepared and strong academically. I also have an inspirational life story to write about in my essays which are so important.
finally, I don’t think admission team care so much about which country you come from, at least it’s what they’ve claimed.

[SiaraAR]

“Many strong applicants will come from many countries. Part of the first step is to learn how you may be competitive- not just grades ad scores, but for the challenges of adapting to a US university. MIT may not be the right choice for you. We don’t know more about you.”
@lookingforward
first of all, thank you for the nice help!
My brother lives in the USA and he studied his Ph.D. at Columbia University.
What do you exactly mean by challenges of adapting to a US university? Could you please give me more information about?
Why do you think MIT isn’t a good fit for me? because its curriculum is so challenging? (My brother though doesn’t recommend it to me so much)
What kind of information do you want to know about me? I would be happy if you give me more advice.

[Lindagaf]

Yes, a good test score is helpful, but I do not think a good score in the ACT or SAT is going to make or break your application, given your circumstances. I would do as @skieurope suggests and contact those colleges’ international admissions officers, explaining your circumstances. I would probabaly let them know about the SAT subject test scores you took, and your grades, just to show that you aren’t wasting their time.

Remember that the overwhelming majority of applicants are going to have very high SAT or ACT scores. You have high scores on subject tests, high grades, and good extracurricular activities. If you are thinking of going to great expense and effort just to take an SAT or ACT, when the odds are very much against you (and everyone) I personally would not bother. Without great everything else, I honestly don’t think Harvard and the like will think “wow, she went to a lot of effort to take the ACT in another country. Admit.”

When tippy top colleges are considering which international students to admit, they are going to take the best of the best. If you are the best of the best, that’s what is going to get you in, not your ACT score. They are looking for the people who will make an impact, and your test scores don’t necessarily reflect that. Your recommendations and essays will be really important. The impact you’ve made in your school, community, church, etc…will be important.

You seem like a good candidate from the little we know about you. There’s a forum here on CC for international students. You can post questions there and ask others what they have done to get started with the process. Good luck to you.

[SiaraAR]

@Lindagaf thank you so much for your kind response.
on ACT website it’s said that ACT is going to be offered in Iran, I called the only test center for the ACT in Iran but they said that there’s not a definite date for the first test, maybe 2 or 3 months later from now. Do you think it will hurt my application if the test is held in Iran this year? do you think they won’t waive my tests?
How do you think can I prove and show the qualities you said to someone like you and admission officers?

• Could you plz give me the address of international forum? I’m not familiar with the site.