How small is too small?

College Search & Lists
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Just started visiting colleges with my junior. He’s a very average student and is very quiet so we think a smaller school would be best for him (and he agrees). Someplace with lots of activities going on and definitely not a suitcase school. Would like somewhere with a walkable town nearby. He’s my third and we looked at some smaller schools with my older ones but not this small.

My question is for those that have kids that went to a smaller school, how small is too small? We’ve looked at one state school (around 11,000) which we think is too big and then schools ranging from 1200 to 4000. We feel like schools on the smaller end might be better for him but we’re just not sure how small. Two schools we just toured had 1200 students and 2000 students. It seemed like a lot of the kids we saw around campus were athletes (both Div 3 schools). It seems like when you look at how many kids they need to field all their teams, there aren’t that many kids on campus that don’t play a sport. Just wondering if on a campus of only 1200 kids, he is going to feel like an outcast? I know a lot of kids that play D1 or D3 sports and they seem to spend most of their time with their teammates or kids in other sports. My son does play sports but won’t play in college, except maybe intramurals. Then you add in the theatre kids, and the music kids and whose left that’s not already part of a group?

Anyone have any insight on this? Anyone have a kids go to really small school and have a great experience or a not so great one? I know the adage that you can make a big school smaller, but you can’t make a small school bigger, but he is definitely not a kid that would thrive in a big environment.

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“Too small” may apply to the departments of the student’s major and other subjects of interest, in that there may be too few (particularly upper level) courses of interest.

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My personal experience in attending a very small school (1600 students) and having a student at a small school (2700 students) is that for freshman and sophomore year it is often great. By junior year it starts to chafe a little bit and by senior year, you’re all done :slight_smile:

I received an excellent education at a small LAC, my daughter is having a similar experience. I would recommend a junior year semester abroad to expand horizons a little bit but overall it was the right choice for us.

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So if you look into the statistics on varsity athletes at these colleges, one thing that quickly becomes obvious is that it isn’t just the size of the college that matters, it is also the size of the athletic programs, which is usually a function in turn of what varsity teams they actually have, perhaps what conference they are in, and so on.

So yes, at like a NESCAC college, you could be pushing something like 40% varsity athletes. But Vassar, say, is considerably less, as are many prominent LACs in the Upper Midwest, the Claremont Colleges, and so on.

And then in terms of the culture–club sports, IMs, recreational sports, all that can be ways for sporty kids to interact and make friends without being varsity, and not all varsity athletes will be all that separated from that world anyway. But again, it can possibly depend on the college, indeed, the specific sport/team.

As for group effects in general–I don’t know if being at a larger college necessarily helps. It is sort of a basic truism of human nature that we often bond socially through group activities that get our brain chemistry activated in certain ways. Lots of different group activities can have that effect, but if you don’t do ANYTHING like that in college, I do think you can sometimes feel like you are on the outside looking in on all the kids that are doing something like that. And I think that can happen just as easily at a big college, where sometimes kids report they feel like just a number, that they are struggling to make really good friends, and so on.

I personally think this is part of why most of the more selective colleges put so much emphasis on activities in “holistic review”–they know that various cherished campus activities are typically a big part of kids thriving at their colleges.

OK, so assuming this is unavoidable, I think you can look for colleges which seem to be doing stuff you might be interested in doing. It doesn’t have to be a ton of kids, like in the end a core group of 30 kids doing something you love could be plenty. But you want to make sure there are choices of different activities that will be practically available to you so you can be active in one or more such ways.

So if a college of 1200 people seems to have like 40 groups of 30 you could see yourself enjoying–great! If a college of 6000 seems to be dominated by people doing things you don’t so much imagine enjoying–maybe not so good.

But at least that is how I would recommend thinking of it–less in size per se, and more whether you can see enough people with similar interests being active in ways you might want to do.

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I think this really depends on each student - one kid’s “just right” will always be another kid’s “too big!” or “too small!”

Mine is at a school of ~1600 and wanted 1500-3000 students for the community feel and the close relationships with professors, both of which he’s getting. For him, when he visits his high school friends at their state university - he does not like how impersonal it feels (to him), and talking about his friend’s experiences in their classes he knows that wasn’t the right choice (for him).

Regarding your second question about kids being in different groups. Yes, it’s very common e.g. the swim team to be friends - but it doesn’t mean they are only friends with swimmers. And there are lots of kids—most of them, really—who aren’t only “one thing” - e.g. my kid plays a club sport, sings in an a cappella group, climbs, has significant involvement in the outdoor program, and is in STEM. His closest friend is an English major who does a lot of theater. His other close friends are on the volleyball team, are sociology majors, people he’s gone on outdoor trips with, people who sing, club sport friends, etc. People are not segregating themselves into groups where that is their sole identity.

I think kids that prefer LAC’s do tend to be “not one lane” - it’s baked into the nature of it.

Every kid is different, some kids would find the size of my kid’s school too small, for him it’s just right.

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That’s a good point. Another random thing that can impact perception of size is campus. My youngest toured a 1900 compact campus it was “way too small.” The next day toured a 2300 with a larger campus and was deemed not too small.

Adding, went to a huge school and I was over it and ready for next phase by senior year so don’t think that’s exclusively a small school problem. I have one at a mid-size and another starting at a mid-size next year. We like the Goldilocks size.

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There’s the old saying, you can make a big school small but not vice versa.

I have a 9K and 32K kid so I can’t speak to specifics - but if too small is too small - if there’s not enough kids - you might find you like a bigger school with an Honors College or Living Learning Community.

One thing about too small is if you don’t click with someone, you might be out of options. That can happen at big too if you are not outgoing…but take him to a mid size or large - but ask to speak with an Honors program director and kids in the program - just to be sure you cover all bases.

There are schools - 5-15K with Honors that might be a fit too.

In other words, it’s early - so it’s a good time to explore - and b4 you narrow in on anything, make sure you check most everything - from size to location (is it in a city or does it have a college business area or is it in the sticks). You already noted he at least wants a town - so the sticks are out - but does he maybe want downtown?? How’s the weather?

Look at the clubs they have and reach out to the leaders to make sure they are active, etc.

I’d say - broaden your search at this point as you have time (not sure how much he saw with your other two). - so you can validate your hypothesis of small.

Good luck.

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Great points but this is definitely not a kid getting into an honors college. He is very average and we are looking at very “average” schools. Just really looking for the right fit.

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My kid went to a school of about 2000. He noted that 500 are new every year. He felt like he knew most of the kids in his major AND that he was always meeting new people.

He was an athlete and a musician and his closest friend from college was neither. Most kids on campus are involved in lots of things and happy to involve friends in them – whether roping them into ushering, attending an event, etc.

My kid definitely was excited about going abroad junior year and seeing new faces. I do think these kids start to feel a desire for “more” toward the end with an appreciation of the closeness of the community they are leaving.

My sense is that most kids figure out how to connect and that the barriers to that are pretty low. Even sports teams have needs that don’t involve playing.

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Such a great question, and I have similar concerns as we help build a list for my #2.

You don’t bring up this particular aspect of size, but when I saw your title question (how small is too small?), my mind immediately went to the question of institutional viability. So many smaller schools are struggling for survival, and many, many have closed in recent years. Sadly, this trend will likely continue in the near future.

My kid would likely thrive in a smaller college community, but they also need stability and certain resources. We don’t want them anyplace that will end up closing its doors halfway through the degree. This is one of the key concerns adding more mid-size as opposed to tiny schools to the list.

Ten - or even five - years ago, we might have been more open to < 2,000 student institutions, but it doesn’t seem a safe bet for us right now.

Hope you find some great “Goldilocks” schools that fit your child’s needs!

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Yes, that is definitely a concern of ours as well. We just visited St Michael’s in VT and that was the question that was on my mind during the whole visit. They used to have close to 2000 students and they are now down to around 1200. They’ve closed 2 out of 3 of the freshman dorms. It used to be a popular choice for kids in the MA area but I haven’t really heard of anyone going there lately. It seemed like a good fit for my son otherwise but I’m just not sure they are financially viable, esp with the potential dip in college applicants in the next year or two.

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Moody’s does financial analyses ratings of most of the US colleges. We found it helpful to check financial well being of the schools on our D’s list. Negative or slipping ratings were red flags for us.

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I don’t think size is the thing that determines an institution’s financial health. Brandeis, American, and the University of West Virginia all have faced cutbacks.

What’s too small will depend entirely on the student. One of my sons visited a school with 5,000 undergrads and knew instantly that he didn’t like it and wouldn’t apply to schools that size. He ended up an a campus of 1,000 and LOVED it, though I totally see that such a tiny campus probably is not a good fit for most kids. It really depends on the kid

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The sweet spot for my younger kid was about 4000 or so undergrads. She found that the Jesuit colleges were about that number of students…and they also are great at higher education.

Have you looked at any of those? They are very ecumenical and emphasize giving back to the community.

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You might find he qualifies for Honors at average schools. Many offer - or LLCs.

For example and I don’t know where you are looking but at mid size 7K SUNY New Paltz a 3.65 is the 25th percentile. Or 86. And holistic admissions.

I’m sure there’s many examples.

Best of luck in your pursuit. But this early unless you 100% know, I’d keep an open mind and explore.

Good luck

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Definitely depends on the kid. Our daughter is at a CTTL with about 2000 undergrads and loves it, but does acknowledge that at times it feels too small.

On the other hand, she has amazing relationships with her professors, and told me just last week that she made a new friend with someone she apparently has tons in common with but had never even seen on campus LOL. There are a LOT of activities happening all the time (I follow the school on Instagram) but she is a STEM major and has long labs that conflict with a lot of the social stuff. There is some good and some bad, like every college.

It’s D1 school and there are a lot of athletes and they DO tend to stick together, but she has some in her classes that she has gotten to know and there are plenty of non-athletes as well.

In her case, she decided she was really going to do best in a smaller environment. Not all kids want or need this. That’s ok. She’ll apply to a big university for grad school and will see the other side.

In a case like this, if you can, I feel that touring when school is in session (as opposed to summer/winter break visits) is probably the best way to really get a feel for it.

Good luck!

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I attended Wesleyan many years ago before it was co-ed and about half the size it is now, ~1500 guys and I have to say, the athlete/non-athlete divide was a non-issue. I can’t say I was great friends with many varsity players. However, I knew quite a few of them by name and had no problem exchanging pleasantries with them. In fact, I shared a mailbox with a lacrosse player and we still kid each other about it to this day (the fact that we still recognize each other at reunions is one pleasant aspect of going to a small college.) Most of my close friends were geeks like me and, IMO, that’s bound to be half the school at any given small college.

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Looked at a bunch of LACs with second kid. She felt schools with a student body under 2,000 or so seemed a bit too small - she ultimately attended a LAC with about 2,400 students and had a great experience.

That said, I do know students who thrived at smaller LACs so YMMV.

My best advise is to visit a number of options and listen to your child.

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My kid who wanted a bigger school with school spirit loves attending Syracuse. However, the major he entered into was small and he felt suffocated being around the same people all day every day his freshman year. He has branched out of that major and is exploring others and doing much better.

For my hs senior looking at colleges, at first she thought she wanted smaller student body (as she felt Cuse was too big for her). But now that we have toured a few schools we found it is much less about number of students and more about campus acreage and how much distance between classes. We were looking at colleges with 5k or under students but now her top choice has 11k students. It’s just that the campus layout and acreage feels much more manageable to her than Cuse (although I personally think Cuse is not huge but it wasnt about my opinion).

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We’ve looked at Scranton (he liked it) and have Xavier, John Carroll and Loyola MD on our potential visit/apply list.

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