<p>I’ve always wondered how people argue with others who do not back their points with evidence and always boil down arguments and debates to shouting contests. </p>
<p>How do you get people to argue thoughtfully and with moderation? I’m asking this because I see too much of political commentators yelling back and forth on the television without resolving much or progressing at all. I always thought the point of debates was to progress and develop better ideas.</p>
<p>It kind of always seems to boil down to “my way or no way”. Many of the most vehement arguers also seem to be the ones who never think they are wrong and hence, never have anything to apologize for.</p>
<p>It starts with your kids. How do they see the parents argue (let’s face it, all parents argue/disagree once in awhile, at least)? Is it all doors slamming, foot stomping, plates being thrown, hollering kind of arguing, or is it maybe with raised voices, but turns being taken to state points? </p>
<p>I was raised in a family with hardly any arguments that I remember. My mom so rarely disagreed with dad that the few times she ever raised her voice about anything, he did it. Worked for them (57 yrs so far).</p>
<p>Having said that though, mom’s advice was never talk politics.</p>
<p>It’s a developed skill. Experience in debate helps. Organized, well reasoned points made succinctly. Address the issues or behaviors, not the person. Avoid emotion, apply logic. Often difficult, but not impossible.</p>
<p>There are courses and seminars that teach negotiation techniques as well.</p>
<p>I’m sure others will provide alternate methodologies.</p>
<p>A lot of times, people just tell me to ignore bigots and loudmouths, but ignoring people who influence many others for the worse seems to be irresponsible. I think people who can debate well have a duty to the public to at least face the people who lie and use convoluted sophistry to wash arguments down people’s throats.</p>
<p>Greencloth, anyone who can turn a phrase as you just did, “use convoluted sophistry to wash arguments down people’s throats” has a great future quelling irresponsible speech. You even punctuated it perfectly…</p>
<p>I try to keep my voice softer than theirs. </p>
<p>When I feel they have no evidence, I ask rhetorical, meta-cognitive questions such as, “How do you know that?” or “What’s your source?” or just “Prove it.”</p>
<p>I preface a rebutting line with a tone phrase, such as “I respectfully disagree” to shine a light on the fact that they are not behaving respectfully, even as they disagree. </p>
<p>I take the high road, which can be infuriating to others but wins in the long run. Discuss the ideas, not the person.</p>
<p>If it’s a real bigot/loudmouth, I give them this much time: “You’re wrong” and state ONE point of fact. After that, I usually don’t keep arguing with them. (That does satisfy your thought that they shouldn’t go unchecked.)
I believe it honors them wrongly to debate for a long session.</p>
<p>I trust that silent onlookers have as much common sense as I do and will see through weak arguments. </p>
<p>If it’s just a political debate, you can withdraw from any discussion and still be an ethical person. If it’s racism, antiSemitism, or anything else where I feel the rights of a group are savaged, I never let a comment go unchallenged. I believe silence is a sign of consent. Sometimes all I say is, “That’s never been my experience (with X people)” if I can’t think of anything clever to say.</p>
<p>If an argument is getting entrenched into two irreconcilable positions, I
personally try several tactics:</p>
<p>Mainly I try to bring the discussion back to basic principles: talk about the
problem you both want solved.</p>
<p>Sometimes a good way to do this is to make a summary statement:
here’s our problem, here’s what you say, here’s what I say, our
common ground is x, y, and z, and our outstanding differences arise
because we see a, b, and c differently. Sometimes this just puts
the other person to sleep, which can be useful.</p>
<p>Tell the other person how much you like them, and that you would
like the issue resolved. Think of some other thing that you agree on,
or some personal quality you like. This just helps you to feel that
resolution is possible.</p>
<p>Humor is wonderful to use, although this can be tricky - you don’t
want them to feel that they are being mocked.</p>
<p>Read a lot of threads on CC, there are persuasive posters and belligerent
arguers. I really enjoy dissecting what different people say, how they
say it, and seeing whether it is effective. You will find some really fine
and subtle thinkers here, and it isn’t always the “debaters” who “win”.</p>
<p>I’m curious: what is the argument that prompted the original post?</p>
<br>
<br>
<p>Watch Monty Python’s “Argument Clinic” sketch.</p>
<p>“I’ve always wondered how people argue with others who do not back their points with evidence and always boil down arguments and debates to shouting contests.”</p>
<p>I don’t argue with people like that. Indeed, I don’t think that I even talk to people like that. Waste of time and breath.</p>
<p>
Or grow up with three lawyers (plus others in the extended family). </p>
<p>If the other person shouts and provides no evidence, you will feel the need to keep arguing to try, vainly, to show the other person what you’re saying. This always ends with you frustrated or angry and no progress on the other side. With these people, make a simple point, and leave it. Of course, if you’re feeling the need to argue, feel free to continue. 
Remember, people around you may benefit from hearing your arguments and points, even if the person with whom you are arguing does not. In this forum for example, you may know that the person with whom you are debating an issue will not listen or change, but it’s important (IMO) to make sure you make your point because there are many, many people reading these threads who may be more open to learning more about all sides of the argument.</p>
<p>My father was told as a senior in high school to always argue the opposite position. Fifty years later, he still does it. He will argue any position that disagrees with what the other person is saying. (This is an incredibly annyoing trait for a parent, by the way. :rolleyes:) That way you really challenge the other person to form a succinct argument and you’ll learn more by exploring the other side of an issue. I don’t suggest incorporating this into your lifestyle because, frankly, it’s obnoxious and tiring, but it’s an interesting for every once in a while.</p>
<p>Wow, corranged. I think I would have become mute in your childhood home:) I hate to argue.
There seems to be a general lack of respect today when people disagree. Often the argument ends when one person becomes so obnoxious that the other person just gives up and disengages. The obnoxious person believes they have conquered and continues with this disagreeable habit; usually this involves the constant interruption of the other persons point of view and a raised voice.</p>
<p>So set the rules. “Excuse me, I am now talking” and “please refrain from raising your voice” help to disarm the aggressor. Then stay on topic. Know what you are argueing and do not allow the debate to get away from the original disagreement. " We are discussing topic A; if you would like to discuss topic B we can do that next." Stick with logic and facts.</p>
<p>There are also cultural/regional differences. Growing up near New York,
arguing/debating was a bit of a contact sport whereas in California
disagreement was weak to non-existant (Whatever, dude.)</p>
<p>I don’t get the whole wag your finger in front of the other persons face while yelling and never taking a breath thing. When both people argue like this alll I can think of is a national geographic show with two male birds posturing one in front of the other. Of course, this always came to a physical confrontation :)</p>
<p>Geomom: lots of good stuff. I’m pretty big on personal space and I know that’s pretty cultural.</p>