<p>Perhaps the white principal of a suburban school didn’t want to be accused of racism or perhaps he was afraid of confronting these boys. </p>
<p>It was intimidating to my kid and I certainly didn’t want my kid adopting that kind of language or thinking that language was okay. But that may have been the message seeing as the administration let it go without any sort of reprimand.</p>
<p>I hope that my kids would have the same sort of relationship with me that I have with my parents – one where I admire their judgment and their morals, and their disappointment in my character fills me with shame.</p>
<p>If you have that kind of relationship, it really is true that you don’t need any punishment besides that slow shake of the head. I’m squirming a bit just remembering it. It hasn’t happened in many years.</p>
<p>I’ve always believed in natural consequences and would probably follow the same philosophy in this situation. The “disappointed” speech would also happen. I can’t see either of my kids participating, frankly. They were raised to be respectful of others and also grew up in a fairly diverse area. The words “Shut Up” were not allowed in my house, but I hear parents saying that to their children or to each other all the time. “Please be quiet” was the allowed term in my house. </p>
<p>I do think there are a lot of mixed messages out there. Shows like Family Guy are really popular and also very blatant with their bashing of others.</p>
<p>Kids who do these bad things have two kinds of parents:
<p>Kids could get involved in these things indirectly, simply by being a member of a frat or sorority that runs this kind of party. While I don’t think any of my kids would knowingly organize such a party or join a frat that ran one in the past, I could see at least one of them joining a frat and then having something like this happen. </p>
<p>I would hear my kid out as to what he thought about this and how the frat decided this was a good idea, but also talk to him about why it is an issue (if they were not completely sure) and listen to their plan for the next time such a party is suggested. The most recent incident was clearly not isolated as the frat had run these kind of parties in the past when it was off campus. In that case, I would not be providing money for frat dues or pay for my son to live in the frat house. If he could afford to stay in the frat and chose to, there would not be much else I could do about it. However, I certainly would not be willing to pay for him to do so.</p>
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<p>Consolation, post 30, really excellent point.</p>
<p>Since my kids have always been into very edgy “comedy” - I talked their ears off during middle school and high school about how this type humor looks to different people in different circumstances. I tried to impress on them that regardless how pure their intentions, and regardless whether their friends from groups being ridiculed found it humorous also, they needed to be really on guard as to what their actions - as white males - looked like to others. I told them they shouldn’t ever be going to theme parties like the one at Duke. It didn’t matter if everyone understood it to be “ironic” I told them it was always problematic to imitate any other culture’s dress, accent, etc. Why take the risk? Just because it is your right? When appealing to their higher nature didn’t seem to really be successful, I made it a very pragmatic argument. You may well mess up your future opportunities with this behavior. We had this discussion long before they went to college.</p>
<p>This is why my kids find me so completely humorless :)</p>
<p>I believe very much in symmetrical treatment. Be nice to whichever group, but if they have a history of throwing rocks at you first, there’s no reason to turn the other cheek. As an example, if my kid had anything to do with the way the female students in Stubenville were treated, I would have been extremely mad. However, if they had participated in an incident involving the Japanese students who got upset in CA last year, knowing what I know about that culture, I would have asked them to focus on damage control, and not necessarily expected true contrition.</p>
<p>DD is a person of color and a vocal LGBT ally who has not hesitated to call others out on issues so this scenario is hard for me to imagine. BUT she has just pledged a sorority (is that how you say it?) with the understanding that she and not her parents are funding this as well as her books, clothing, and incidentals. If something like this were to happen, we would have a long discussion, and I would ask for her plan of action and check back re its progress.</p>
<p>Haven’t read the entire thread, but I just wanted to say to Consolation that you should give Philip Roth another chance! I honestly do not understand the cries of misogyny about him. If anything, the men come off poorly in his books, not the women. American Pastoral is one of the most gripping, moving, wonderful, and horribly sad books I’ve ever read. One of the most amazing books of all time about parenting. And, though I was crying through most of the book, there were times that I laughed so hard that I caused a spectacle in the public place where I was reading it.</p>
<p>Also, I hate to admit it, but I recently re-read Portnoy’s Complaint and a couple of times identified with the mother! <<cringe>> It’s a very funny spoof on helicopter parenting. </cringe></p>
<p>Also, a question for the group: So, if your kid was invited to a party with a Chinese New Year theme (given by someone who wasn’t Chinese), would you forbid him/her from going? My neighbor was planning to throw one for the teenagers in the neighborhood, mostly because a really good Chinese restaurant just opened up in our neighborhood, and she was going to have a bunch of stupid tchotchkes from our local Chinatown, including, probably, some silly hats, Chinese yo-yo’s etc. There was absolutely no racist intent at all, but after seeing these threads, I told her that it was too risky even though I thought it sounded like a nice, fun idea. </p>
<p>She was inspired by the magnificent Chinese New Year decorations at our local high end mall. (South Coast Plaza, if anyone has been there in the last couple of weeks.) They were truly spectacular. Are they not racist because they are beautifully done, whereas a cheap imitation is racist? </p>
<p>I didn’t pay too much attention to the details of the Duke story, but I did see the picture of the girl with the pointy hat and it really didn’t seem all that horrible to me. There are zillions of those hats sold in tacky Chinatown stores; is everyone who buys one a racist? I may have missed the parts of the story that made it an obvious instance of racism, but if that picture was the worst offense, it seemed blown out of proportion to me. I will probably be drummed out of this forum, but that is just my opinion. Are those parents here who are talking about cutting off all financial support of your kids etc. saying that if your kid wore a hat like that girl you would take draconian action? Or are you talking about something else? (Full disclosure: I think I may have one of those hats in the silly hat/ costume closet at my house (along with piles of other silly hats). I am now thinking I should throw it away.)</p>
<p>PS I’m not trying to be oppositional or confrontational; I really am interested in the opinions of others on this topic.</p>
<p>I like your post, nottelling. I had the same feelings, essentially. I had no idea the costumes were racist; and also wondered whether it is possible to ever hold a party with a cultural theme without being considered offensive or racist by some. My understanding is the general response to this is “you know it when you see it,” as far as whether some activity is racist or not. That is a difficult standard to gauge, so I would conclude that one should never hold or attend such parties or dress in a cultural costume, to be safe.</p>
<p>telling, for me, it wasn’t just the hat; it was the hat in combination with the racist invite. If you’re trying to celebrate a culture, you don’t do things like put “Herro Nice Duke Peopre” on the invitations. Like I’ve said throughout, I really don’t think every kid who attended this party was a racist, but the people who sent out the invites likely were. Racist, or ignorant.</p>
<p>Bay and Youdon’tsay – Thanks for the responses.</p>
<p>A bit of a mea culpa – I hadn’t heard about the invitation language, which (to me at least) is obviously offensive. (That’s what I get for jumping in when I don’t know all of the facts!) I won’t defend the kids sending the invitation AT ALL. But, I’d guess that many kids ATTENDING THE PARTY (1) never saw the invitation; or (2) didn’t read it closely enough to notice the slur; or (2) didn’t get the (so-called) “joke” and were just puzzled by the language; or (3) didn’t have enough sense of the historical context to understand that it would be offensive (any more than a stupid “Oo La La” would be offensive on an unsophisticated invitation to a French party or a “G’day mate” on an Australian one); or (4) understood vaguely that the language was making fun of an accent, but didn’t understand that this particular depiction of an East-Asian accent was a common racist trope, and thereby particularly offensive.</p>
<p>Please understand: I’m not saying that that the language is NOT offensive; it certainly is, VERY MUCH SO. But I think some kids genuinely would not understand that it is offensive enough to warrant a “boycott” of the event because of a lack of sufficient understanding of the historical context of discrimination against Asian-Americans in this country. So, for me, if my kid ATTENDED a party with such an invitation (and God forbid was photographed), I would use it as a teaching moment. </p>
<p>If my kid (God forbid) WROTE the invitation, I try to figure out what the hell the kid was thinking and would use it as a BIG teaching moment, perhaps locating first-person resources about the historical discrimination against Asian-Americans in order to provide a BIG education pronto. I know my daughter well enough to know she would want to make up for doing something that I felt was deeply offensive and would honestly want to atone for her mistake (even though I couldn’t legally compel her to). Thus, whether she was legally an “adult” or not wouldn’t affect my response, at least during the college years (and beyond). (Then again, I couldn’t imagine my daughter writing such a thing as the invitation.)</p>
<p>But, can we agree that it is okay to throw a party with an Asian theme, and it is okay to wear a silly hat? In other words, let’s assume that the girl with the hat didn’t see the invitation and didn’t know about the silly slur. In the absence of any knowledge about the racist language on the invite, do you think she did something wrong by showing up to the party wearing that hat? Emboldened by Bay’s solidarity, I’ll admit it: I don’t. (Again, there may be other facts I don’t know about. I’m basing my whole opinion on the one picture of the girl in the hat.)</p>