<p>Child with near perfect SATs, numerous HS honors was accepted into Honors program at major university. First semester GPA …let’s just say way below 3.0. Is not partying, just enjoying social events, movies, intramurals, etc. Seemed to be doing better second semester, but just before finals confessed that things were not going well. How do you teach a child common sense at this point? How long does it take for them to learn that staying up till three every night makes it hard to study. I can’t tell if made the wrong major choice, the wrong college choice or just unhappy. Needs to go to summer school to bring up GPA to stay in Honors, but I am considering having them spend summer at home. Will decide when we see grades in a week. Anyone else have experience with this?</p>
<p>College is HARD work for most students, especially Honors programs, and is much harder than HS. For many students, there is a steep learning curve- especially regarding how to manage their time, now that mom or dad are not around reminding them what to do and when. Most smart students make the adjustment , especially after the shock of getting low grades for often the first times in their lives. Let your child go to summer school and learn the consequences of “goofing off”. The common sense will come with experience.</p>
<p>Your son doesn’t sound unhappy.</p>
<p>You could describe my D while she was at college. She majored in ECs at college and studying for classes seemed to be an extracurricular activity with her. She loved college, loved her roommates, loved her college experiences. </p>
<p>It never did improve–but a parent can’t micromanage her schedule at this stage of the game. </p>
<p>One problem she ran into: never having had to ask for help during high school, she had trouble knowing what to do when she ran into trouble. Once when she did line up help in two classes that gave her trouble, she quit going for help after one session. Grrr…</p>
<p>After that, all we asked is that she graduate in four years. </p>
<p>And she did!</p>
<p>Is he an engineering major, by chance? That is a major that is particularly difficult and sub 3.0 grades are not unusual early in his college career.</p>
<p>I didn’t have trouble in college, but hit a brick wall at a well-regarded law school. I finally came to a place where I was “merely average,” no matter how hard I tried. Once I came to psychological terms with my new status, I could really enjoy school. </p>
<p>I’d have a long discussion with your son about the past school year–could better time management have helped? If you can’t hack the math, maybe being an engineer isn’t for you. If you can’t hack the chemistry, maybe medical school isn’t for you. Maybe he’s “topped out” educationally…maybe the Honors Program situation is a bit more than he could digest. We’ve had sons of friends who played video games until all hours of the night and then didn’t go to classes. That was a recipe for disaster!</p>
<p>Lots of things to think about…I’m guessing that your S could fill in a few blanks.</p>
<p>Son also says has trouble focusing, concentrating on studies. I think it may be poor organization skills and lack of sleep that are contributing because this did not seem to be a problem in HS. (As some of you said, the studying requirements may just be harder.) We only hear about these studying problems at the end of the semester! It is just hard to tell what is going on when you don’t see or hear from them very often.</p>
<p>You only hear about bad things at the end of a semster because of the typical habit of teenage “magical thinking…”–I can rescue this somehow, etc. Maybe having a study group would be useful in helping him focus.</p>
<p>Many kids run into trouble when they fall for the story that since attendance is not taken, it is not required. It may not be required, but it is necessary for success. Is he attending every single class?</p>
<p>We can only sympathize with you, OP, and give you a few guesses on what may be going on. Several above have good ideas. Here’s another one–a little less pleasant I’m afraid, but if a previously high-achieving freshman is now not keeping up with work, getting poor grades, complains of being “unfocused”, doesn’t continue with tutoring help, and continues this pattern for two semesters, it is sometimes a case of too much partying. No teenager, especially not one who has a habit of keeping bad news from parents ears–like low grades–easily admits to drinking too much. But admitting to staying up until 3am? What exactly his he doing until that hour? If it’s drinking, video games, or a serious girlfriend, those distractions will need to be dealt with. So perhaps some gentle detective work may be in order to rule those out. </p>
<p>Does your S seem seriously concerned with staying in school? Staying in his major? Staying in the honors program? If not, he may be “failing” his way passively out of those choices. I really think a serious heart-to-heart may provide more answers.</p>
<p>Hope these suggestions are not offensive. I only think we parents need to make sure what is really going on before we can offer help.</p>
<p>“I’m afraid, but if a previously high-achieving freshman is now not keeping up with work, getting poor grades, complains of being “unfocused”, doesn’t continue with tutoring help, and continues this pattern for two semesters, it is sometimes a case of too much partying. No teenager, especially not one who has a habit of keeping bad news from parents ears–like low grades–easily admits to drinking too much.”</p>
<p>This is how older S – who had 98th percentile board scores, the IB diploma, and virtually 100% merit aid at a 2nd tier college – managed to flunk out H and I didn’t realize the reason until I accidentally (really!) found his blog in which he detailed his drinking and drug use, something that there was no evidence that he had done when he was in high school. When he was in high school, by his own choice, he either was at home or at work, and we knew where he was since he didn’t have a drivers license, so H or I had to drive him. When he went to college, he somehow was regarded as a sophisticate by some older guys, and he apparently started partying to keep up with his new friends.</p>
<p>My advice is that if your S has to take course over, make him pay for those courses. If his grades are bad – such as borderline failing, have him take a semester or year off and work to support himself. A taste of the real world may inspire him to get serious about college.</p>
<p>Of course, if he’s in a very tough major like engineering, his grades may be lower than you’d have expected just because such majors are difficult even for very smart, formerly high achieving students.</p>
<p>When younger S got serious senioritis in h.s. and almost didn’t graduate, we told him that we wouldn’t pay for college until he had gone for a year on his own dime (H and I were willing to co-sign for loans). He spent a year in Americorps, and learned lots about what the real world requires. He went – with some merit aid and very heavy loans – to the college of his choice, a place that he loves for all of the right reasons. He has been a dean’s list student there, and at the end of soph year has a 3.45 overall gpa, 3.7 gpa for the semester even though he took 20 hours this past semester, worked 14 hours a week, and did time-intensive, productive extracurriculars.</p>
<p>Having some skin in the game and seeing what the real world requires can inspire some students to do what they are capable of doing. As for the others, they may need to support themselves for a while. Parents can’t force them to do what they’re required to do in college. They are adults and need to take responsibility for themselves.</p>
<p>This sounds like me, a million years ago. You know your son the best, and presumably you would be able to tell whether there are underlying problems or whether this is just the typical freshman experience that many formerly high-performing kids have when they go to college. It’s hard, and for some students (me) it can be frustrating, intimidating, and a little demoralizing. As I hear about friends’ kids’ freshman experiences, I hear several stories that sound like your son’s. Summer school sounds like the right course of action. But if he is failing courses, if there’s evidence of drinking/drugs, if he admits he doesn’t go to class, etc., then I would be worried. </p>
<p>My own son did well, but this semester was much harder than the fall. He did not do well in one course for reasons that I could have predicted: never had to study for tests in high school, not used to teachers who don’t express clear expectations or are disorganized. Another course (he doesn’t know his grade yet) was a super-challenge, even though it was in an area of real strength for him. He absolutely loved it, but I could tell that he realized that he wasn’t just going to sail through. Things are just different in college.</p>
<p>Like you, I wonder how they can accomplish anything on no sleep. Oh, isn’t it great that they’re coming home! :eek:</p>
<p>Sounds like S2. Same kind of HS profile. He got to school into a major that was very difficult. Had a lousy adviser who put him into the second semester class since the first semester class was full. Although not a prerequisite he did not have the foundation to do well. He started playing computer games all night and sleeping all day. He flunked out once and we should have paid attention to the fact that he had not really changed his ways. He went back and then dropped out. </p>
<p>Good news, now 5 years later after supporting himself in low paying jobs and getting engaged, he is back in school. He is financing himself and getting a 4.0. </p>
<p>DH had the Army take care of his maturity issues when he flunked out long ago. Some just take longer to mature. But he needs to figure out root cause and if he is not going to change it, you are wasting your money.</p>
<p>
Very good point and advice.</p>
<p>A large number of college students need to figure out time management and self management given their new-found freedom of fending for themselves. Some end up on academic probation (usually < 2.0 GPA) in the process. Some end up flunking out in the process since they don’t turn themselves around in time. Your S needs to make a serious evaluation of why he’s not performing as expected and he needs to be honest with himself. He could be partying, drinking/drugs, socializing/attending sports too much, playing video games too much, watching TV too much, IM’ing/Facebooking/MySpacing too much, sleeping too much (seriously, there are a number of college students who do this), etc. He could also be in over his head in some of the classes and might need to get help from fellow students, TAs, Profs to do better. </p>
<p>As some mentioned, if he’s engineering, especially at a top engineering school, don’t expect him to automatically get > 3.0 since usually more than half the class of very bright students is below a 3.0. There’s a big difference between something like a 2.6 and a 1.9. A lot of students fail to maintain the GPA required for ‘honors’ and certain scholarships as well but that doesn’t necessarily mean they’re failing. Make sure you’re not over-reacting.</p>
<p>Maybe he should consider getting an on-campus job. It can actually help some students with time management since their time becomes more structured. He’ll also earn money. Which takes us back to NSM’s point - if he has to pay to retake courses he genuinely didn’t put adequate effort into, then maybe he’ll try harder.</p>
<p>I think forcing him to take summer classes while at home could be a real issue since you and he could be in a constant battle with you in ‘parent mode’ and him in ‘HS mode’ and alienation could be a possible result. </p>
<p>He needs to understand that ‘he’ is in charge of whether he succeeds or fails now. This is no longer K-12.</p>
<p>"Good news, now 5 years later after supporting himself in low paying jobs and getting engaged, he is back in school. He is financing himself and getting a 4.0. "</p>
<p>That gives me hope for older S, a very bright guy who flunked out of college after freshman year due to partying. He now is 25, living out of our state, supporting himself in through temp office work, and seems to be becoming more thoughtful about his life. I have the feeling the fact that his kid brother is doing well in college also may be inspiring older S to take a close look at his own life.</p>
<p>I think it really helps to do the “clear expectations” thing before your kid goes to school. We did that before DS went off to college, though didn’t feel the need to do so with more-driven DD. The clear expectations included that he take full advantage of the opportunities that were available at his private college, since we turned down a full-ride for him to attend the private college, and that he actively pursue research, EC, and other great opportunities. We had him sign a letter with the statements of understanding. (As in; you understand that this is costing us as much as a new vehicle every year, and you understand the sacrifice that we are happy to make as long as you do your part… 
)</p>
<p>I wouldn’t say my “high achiever” is not succeeding, but I wouldn’t call it a great academic success. I can say with almost 100 percent confidence that it is NOT drinking and partying, but certainly time management and procrastination, given a propensity for sleep (not at night, though) and EC’s, is in issue. The good news is, she knew she’d need help, and went for it early, but I can’t tell if it helped much. But second semester was better than the first, and she feels she’s become a better student. She also hopes next years roomate will be a better influence. School only asked a few questions, but her and Freshman roommate had a little TOO much in common. </p>
<p>Husband would like to “encourage” her to transfer to a cheaper school, but for the most part, she’s holding up her end of the original deal. We didn’t know WHAT to expect, as this was a major “reach” school for her. Does anybody renegotiate the “deal” after they sense the lay of the land?</p>
<p>i work with young adults - high school students and college students. I cannot begin to tell you how things have changed with wireless internet. Staying up until three is not uncommon, but certainly unhealthy. Sleep deprivation is the underlying factor for many kids who suddenly think they have an attention deficit. Boys are playing games and just surfing the net, while the girls are more likely scanning facebook or surfing. It is serious problem for a lot of kids and i believe accounts for the increase in referrals to counseling clinics on campus.</p>
<p>Solution? Lots of great suggestions here, but honest discussion is paramount. If he is saying 3 in the morning, I would bet it is even later than that. That kind of sleep pattern can produce behaviors that look pretty disturbed.</p>
<p>Good luck to you & know you are not alone.</p>
<p>OP-Sympathies to the “helicopter parent” in you. IMHO your student is showing classic signs of under estimating how much time and effort it takes to complete college level work.</p>
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<p>I can second this, having menopause-induced insomnia…</p>
<p>I went from being a straight A student in HS to being a B/C student my freshman year in college. I was scared to death to tell my parents. When I knew my grades were going home, I called them to prepare them and they said: “We didn’t send you to college for academics only. It’s also about learning to balance your time and social development. We trust you. We know you can get this straightened out. We believe in you.” And they were right. I got my act together and graduated on the Dean’s List. I thought they handled it beautifully: no scare tactics, no anger, no recriminations. Just understanding and support. College is a huge adjustment - I remember the day I realized that the professors didn’t take attendance and that I could skip a class. It was incredibly freeing and scary at the same time. It was that freedom to which I had the hardest time adjusting.</p>
<p>4gsmom: What you have written about is, in my opinion, the most important lesson that freshman students learn. Learning how to balance all those things is to me, far more important than a B vs. an A and sometimes a C vs. an A in freshman fall classees. Universally the kids that manage to learn the lesson are the ones that will have increasing GPAs and actually go the distance. In my experience, the kids that don’t learn the lesson at all freshman year generally struggle with the same issues sophomore year. I held my breath my oldest son’s entire freshman year hoping that he would “get it.” Fall was rough, spring was much better, sophomore fall he was walking on the clouds about his grades. Me, thirty years ago, went the other way…I was always socially misfit…all As freshman fall and hit the skids freshman spring when I discovered the social life pulled in out sophomore year!</p>