I am not showing off, I need some serious help

Chance Me / Match Me
1

Anyone who will reply in this thread, just know that you really saved one soul and helped that sould A LOT.

So basically I am from a curriculum which does not offer me any AP courses (rather more hard topics in syllabus) and I did not do enough in my 11 and 12, grades were 4.00 out of 5.00. I did well though in 9 and 10, got 5.00 in all subjects back then. I will tell why. Please read this post.

I AM AFRAID. Read the whole thing to better understand and to better help me please :smile:

So, I took what was best option and challenge for me- Olympiad. I have participated in several (International Olympiad on Astronomy and Astrophysics, Asian Pacific Math Olympiad, Iranian Geometry Olympiad, The Interschool Debate). But the main fact is I only participated there and somehow did not get any medal

Apart from that, I am National Champion/Runner Up in many olympiads like my country’s Astrophysics Olympiad, Inter School and College Programming Contest. And while talking about regional- I am regional champion in Physics, Math, Astronomy, Astrophysics and Programming.

So you can get that I have a diverse interest, which is maybe common among students like me. For this diverse interests, I have created or led several communities and organizations. I most probably have created and managed more than 15 clubs and don’t want to make my post so big. If I say shortly, One of my club got Best Math Club award nationally. And from one of my club I arranged an International Cubing Competition of World Cube Association. And there are literally more than 20 successful high participating national competitions.

What skills I used? My leadership, designing, marketing/branding, technical and these skills. You are probably getting a picture of jack of all trade and master of none. Maybe it was, but I was popular as a master. I mean as a teacher. I taught all these things in my several organizations. Taught things about math, physics, astronomy, programming, robotics, cubing, chess and related problem solving. Yeah, I literally many more than all of things which I listed above.

So now I am confused as my grades are not that much, I am international, I am not legacy, I don’t have international medals which others have, I don’t have enough grades (you can guess that I have to give that up managing these things because I really loved managing these things), I am from a very low income family so I also will need a full financial aid, and also I am applying in regular decision.

I AM SO MUCH AFRAID TO APPLY IN IVY LEAGUES.
I am even afraid to apply in some so called “not so bad” or “okay, good” colleges.

I have stuffs like theatre, music instrument, arts too (Cause I loved them really and did the best performances in my high school in those area).

You will probably get that liberal arts college will be good for me. Or I don’t know, maybe I am wrong. I just need to know- what I should do? I have started applying for colleges like Reed, Carleton, Colby, Denison (I loved this, dunno why), Bates, Tulane, Macalester, Colgate and some so far to dream college like (Upenn, Yale).

Am I going in right direction. What more college should I choose? Which college should I not choose? And how is my chances? (I need to get full free ride too and job opportunities).

Anyone who will reply in this thread, just know that you really saved one soul and helped that sould A LOT.

Thank you all in advance. And also, maybe you got a picture of me in your mind, right? So on which thing I should prioritize on which university while showing me? I can never put all of these in my resume. So will I create different resume for different universities? The universities I mentioned above, can you guys give me an idea what they might like? Or will I just send same resume everywhere? My major is still undecided and I will apply like that. STEM and Business -both attracts me in their own way, along with visual and performance arts.

I love this community a lot. Don’t make me sad by ignoring this post please :disappointed:

3

You should apply to colleges in your own country. You need to have that backup. The need-blind meets-full-need schools in the US are all reaches for you. Your extracurricular activities are not going to make up for lower grades in 11th and 12th grades. Take your chances, but be realistic.

How much can you afford to pay each year? Most of the higher ranked public schools will not give you any scholarships. Money is going to be your biggest challenge here. You are very limited in what jobs you can get on a student visa, so you can’t count on that as a significant source of funding. To even get a visa in the first place you are going to have to show how you will pay for college and your support.

5

You may want to look at colleges in Europe. Germany maybe? Some of those may be free to attend. We have posters more familiar with those options than I am, so hopefully one of them can chime in with suggestions.

$1,000 to $2,000 a year is probably not enough to study in the US. Realistically you will only be able to earn somewhere between $3,000 to $5,000 or so a semester. As a student on a visa, you are (for the most part) limited to working for the college, part time on campus. Your visa and travel costs, airport transfers, dorm accessories, books, a cell phone and laptop, snacks not covered under the meal plans, laundry, hotel fees for the breaks (when dorms are closed), climate-appropriate clothing, money just to get out and explore the town
 all that can easily add up to nearly $15,000 the first year - and none of those expenses are commonly covered by scholarships (most scholarships only cover room and board at most, maybe fees too).

Here is an article that lists the US colleges that give the most aid to international students. However, all ten of these colleges are reach schools. Some are reaches for everyone who applies (they have so many students applying that they turn down kids with perfect grades and perfect test scores).

https://www.usnews.com/education/best-colleges/the-short-list-college/articles/universities-that-offer-international-students-the-most-financial-aid

You can pick a college or two and give it a try. The other alternative may be to find a college in your own country that will let you spend a semester in the US. This is easier to afford and to arrange.

The timing is bad too. The US economy is suffering due to the pandemic. Colleges are closing their wallets. They’re closing programs and letting faculty and staff go. Donations have been affected too (which affects how much money is available for scholarships). Again, pick a college or two and give it your best try. If you get in and they will pay for you to attend, that’s great. If not, it won’t be because of any shortcomings you have. It is a highly competitive system in a bad year for applicants.

6

Have you considered applying and attending school in Europe for two years, and then transferring to a US college? I don’t have any great advice, but wanted to wish you the best of luck.

7

You could always try to get loans, however be careful with the interest rate.

8

I see you have Denison on the list of schools you are considering, and I agree that is a good possibility for you, as Denison treats both domestic and international students equally from a financial aid perspective and meets full need. It is also a good school for someone who has very diverse interests and is not ready to decide on a major. If you are applying RD, you still have some time to work on your application and the Common Application essay. (From your message, it is not clear whether you are fully familiar with the Common App, which all of the schools you list will use - while you can submit a resume as an addition to the information required in the CA, the information in the CA will not be changed from school to school except that some schools require additional essays.) Not just for Denison purposes, but for all of the schools you will be applying to, I think you need to consider how to shape your application so it will be impressive and compelling rather than overwhelming (your post above is a little overwhelming). You can list 10 extracurriculars in the CA, so think about how to prioritize that “top ten” so that they give the readers a good sense of you. You can put the rest of your activities into a resume and submit that as well, but I can imagine you coming up with a 10-page resume and that would probably not be effective. You will also need to put effort into your essays to make sure they are clear and compelling and present a coherent picture. If there is someone who can read your work and provide honest comments, that will probably be helpful. Good luck to you.

12

I know quite a few people who got their bachelor’s degree in their home country, and then got their master’s degree in the US. Many are from India. Some are from Canada. A few are from other countries. This is definitely a possibility. Some of them had work experience between getting their bachelor’s and getting their master’s (which is also true for students from the US).

If you want to get a master’s degree in the US (which would presumably be a number of years from now), admissions will look at ALL of your university studies. However, they will not consider you high school at all – they will not even ask about it.

Given your budget and what you said about your finances to me it looks unlikely that you will be able to get a bachelor’s degree in the US. This however does not say anything about what happens next. Of course, there are also many US based companies that hire quite a few people who live and work in other countries.

13

If you upload your resume on the Common App site, all the schools will receive the same thing. If you wanted to do something different for different schools, you could send the resume separately to the Admissions Officer who is responsible for international students in your geographic area, but that would be unusual. With respect to other schools, you might take a look at the College of Wooster and St. Olaf - I don’t think either of them commits to meet full need for international students, but they do have generous aid available and are very welcoming to international students. (Schools in the Midwest are not as well known as the East and West Coast schools outside the US, but many of them are working hard to increase diversity and may welcome an interesting international applicant.) US News also includes Wesleyan and Swarthmore on their list of top 10 generous-to-international students schools. I am more familiar with the liberal arts colleges than larger universities, but it does sound as though you might prosper in the LAC environment with all your diverse interests. I think it is a great path to do undergraduate studies at an LAC and then move on to a top research university for graduate school. One other thing - for the schools where you will be applying, be sure to check whether interviews of any sort are available and apply ahead of any cutoff time.

14

You need to apply ED to a college that is need blind/full need FOR INTERNATIONALS.

There are very few of those: Harvard, Yale, Princeton, Amherst, and MIT.
Why? Because ALL OTHERS are need aware, meaning your odds of admission depend on your ability to pay. Since your ability to pay is zero ($1,000 will cover airfare) you need a college that can cover your fees but not “dock you” for needing the money. Needless to say, they don’t fund fully that many students. Perhaps 1 student from Iran will be fully funded at each of these universities. So, your odds are very low. You already know that. You have to go full-in and yet keep your hopes in check. It’s really very difficult psychologically.

Your best bet is likely Amherst since it’s a Liberal Arts College and that seems to be what you’re interested in, matches
4 v. 5 is not going to make a huge difference. An Iranian 8+ is okay (even if obviously 9 or 10 is better, 8 makes the cut off of “excellent academics”).
Running in all these Olympiad and not winning any regional medal (let alone national or international) is a bigger problem.

Have you taken any sort of standardized test? ACT or SAT? Because that’d open colleges with merit scholarships. There aren’t many now, but there are still a few.

You can also apply to Northeastern on the sole strength of your curriculum and grades. If you’re NOT applying for STEM or business, you’d have an edge - your chosen major has to be consistent with your background, of course. Don’t say you’re passionate about Classics if you’re never taken a Classical language (Ancient Greek, Ancient Persian, Latin, etc, etc) nor any Ancient history course! Your odds are, of course, very low, but you already know that.

Is it more important for you to leave Iran even if you attend a US college that’s less “prestigious” than the college you’d attend there, or are you looking for “extra prestige” (ie., a top US college is more prestigious internationally than a top Iranian program, even if Iranian programs are very reputable.)

Do you speak French, Spanish, or German?
Some of these countries have “free tuition”, but you’d need to fund your housing and food. Living in smaller town can cut on costs but these typically require you to know the language.

16

The issue is not just being admitted to US universities, it’s getting enough aid to attend. That makes US colleges a reach for you.

Prepare well for the SAT and TOEFL. High scores can only help.

Most public US universities are not going to be affordable as most don’t meet full need for even out of state residents, let alone international students.

Coming to the US for a masters degree may be your best bet financially.

PS You said you participated in an Iranian competition so I too made the assumption that you were Iranian.

17

You said originally that you didn’t do well enough in grades 11 and 12. Later you said you are predicting a 5 for year 12. Please clarify this discrepancy.

You started a whole bunch of clubs and didn’t keep your grades high. And you need 100% full financial aid. That, in a nutshell, is going to be a problem for you.

You’ve said repeatedly you’re afraid, you’re scared, you’re afraid. Why? If you have a 100% guaranteed option for college in your own country, or maybe in Europe, then you shouldn’t be afraid. Being afraid of not getting in to highly competitive colleges with less than ideal grades, when you need 100% full financial aid, has nothing to do with fear. That’s just unrealistic and misguided thinking.

I’m sorry to sound harsh, but you are looking for honest feedback. Apply to some of those colleges If you like. Do more research to determine which ones you have the best shot at, both for acceptance and aid. Those applications are going to cost many hundreds of dollars that you probably don’t have.

A quick search on Wikipedia, perhaps not the best authority, shows that Denison does not provide full need. All the others, with three exceptions, aren’t need blind for international students. Your “strong and huge” ECs do not take the place of grades. To me, it seems clear that you were too focused on the ECs and sacrificed your grades.

You seem like an okay applicant. But you are leaving it a bit late to make your applications really good. Your EA/ED deadline might be today, or the 15th. There are ED2 deadlines at some schools. At this point, a gap year could be a good idea to try again for next year. Good luck.

18

In that it could only help help you, I suggest you enhance the depth of your research. Amherst, for example, generally accepts applicants from among the top 1% or so (by holistic criteria) of U.S. and international students (though it would, of course, make a great choice for students interested in STEM fields such as math, physics and biology).

19

@Lindagaf , from Denison’s website FAQs: “Yes, Denison offers exactly the same need-based financial aid and merit-based scholarships to international students as it does to U.S. citizens and permanent residents, and Denison meets 100% of each student’s demonstrated financial need.” So they are not need-blind but do meet 100% of demonstrated need for students who are admitted.

1 Like
20

There’s a big difference between Skidmore and Amherst. If OP has a 4.0 out of 5, that’s roughly a 3.2/4.0. Not Amherst territory. (Depending on the transcript, maybe an issue for Skidmore and Denison, as well.) It’s true core subjects matter most, not simple cum gpa. But we don’t know what country OP is from, what sort of educational standards, the volume of other highly qualified applicants, nor how many kids from his/her country already fill slots from that country. Etc.

Add to that, a grade drop in 11th (and 12th) is a red flag. It’s generally the time when course rigor increases and top colleges like to see mastery, not a stumble.

(I know this is bad news for OP, sorry. But you do have back-ups in your home country.)

The ECs lean unilateral- that is, all seem to follow the STEM interests. These colleges want depth AND breadth. It’s not a matter of winning “international” awards, or even national. It has more to do with being the sort who can try other things, as well, while maintaining high grades. The US top schools take academics seriously, but like kids who do more than focus on academics or just activities related to those interests. It’s different than other countries.

And “meet full need” does not mean a free ride, not at all. Other than the schools that do fully fund (the very top reaches,) most will expect a “student contribution” of roughly 5-6k, per year.

And when you do get a campus job, no way it’s “between $3,000 to $5,000 or so a semester.” Often, more like $2400 for the entire academic year. (OP hasn’t indicated he has the skills to land a more lucrative campus position. These usually go to more senior students.)

So, this is a long shot. A great suggestion would be some rare program that wants students from his country, doesn’t mind the drop in academics, has some generous $$ to offer, etc.

Not Amherst. I can’t name what US school that would be.

Best wishes.

21

Thank you all guys who replied to this thread. Basically back then I wanted to know what will be my chances in my worst case scenario. Like if I miss my grades in 11 or 12, how much it can hurt with having a decent EC. Luckily, there are no such worries now!

Really, thank you very much! Will update if I get in to the colleges in which I am applying to (most of them actually are not mentioned above, did not do that much research back then, that’s why I panicked and this post was formed)

Stay safe!

22

Any updates?