<p>jaylynn, my D says the same thing about TOK and having earned the IB diploma is one of her proudest accomplishments because it took so much work and so many different skills. As a result of her IB credits, she entered college as a sophomore and was able to double major and double minor, which is perfect for her extremely, umm, weird set of interests. She also loved the research for the EE and didn’t mind the writing, although it is true that the IB rubric is freakishly bizarre.</p>
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<p>Ugh…IB Theory of Knowledge (pops hedache medicine and rubs temples.) Memories.</p>
<p>Jaylynn and Twogirls, I’m glad the IB curriculum is working out for your daughters. I think that’s great. I did not mean to knock the IB program. Although I feel we were mislead about the end result, I have no doubt in my mind the curriculim prepared me for college and blessed my mind with a well rounded eduation, but I stand by the advice I gave the OP. If the schools that her daughter is applying to don’t recognize the IB program, and the hard truth is more don’t than do, even the private schools, it might not be worth it to earn the diploma, since her daughter will be very pressed for time this summer. </p>
<p>For giggles, I called my sister who sent her daughter to the same high school I went to (they are still offering the IB program.) My neice didn’t go full IB at all. She took IB English 1 (jr yr) and 2 (sr yr) and IB Precalc jr) and IB Calculus (sr). She scored 6’s on both IB exams, and, according to my sister, THAT is what got her some college credit, because Stanford only acknowledges test scores of 5 and higher. My neice graduated from Stanford last year, so it’s fairly recent.</p>
<p>I would definitely do the IB diploma, if offered. When a school looks at the transcript and info from the school, the counselor should be mentioning if the student is doing the IB diploma or IB certificate. Many schools want to see that kids challenge themselves in high school. My son will be finishing his senior year next month in the IB diploma. The EE wasn’t so bad. He really disliked TOK, but he really was challenged in everything, and no, it wasn’t as time consuming as everyone claimed.</p>
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<p>IB may help you get admitted to some colleges, and it certainly provides excellent preparation for college, but getting credit for IB courses may be a different matter.</p>
<p>My daughter was an IB Diploma graduate. She went to Cornell, where she got no credit whatsoever for her IB courses, even though she had 6s or 7s on all the exams. She also took 8 AP exams, got 4s or 5s on all of them, and got credit for most, for a total of 30 credits. (Some of the AP exams were taken at the end of IB courses – a trick some kids use to get credit in situations where they otherwise would not.)</p>
<p>This may not be a representative example.</p>
<p>Yes Marian you are correct, which is why I wrote that the credits that are accepted depend upon the school. We just went on a tour and info session at Cornell this past February, and it seems that they do accept some IB credits. I am not sure of the details ie how many are accepted etc. When my daughter was planning to do IB I spent 3 months researching the program. She changed her mind in March so I have been out of the IB loop since then.</p>
<p>I forgot to mention in my previous post, that the top students at my daughter’s school took tons of AP exams (self study and experience from classes that had AP and IB mixed) in addition to participating in the IB Diploma program. The majority of AP scholars from her school were IB diploma students.
I also want to add that I’ve sat in several College seminars the past 4 years (the joint ones with schools like Yale, MIT, Harvard, Columbia, Rice etc.) The subject of IB vs AP always came up. The representatives all said that they like to see that the student took advantage of the most rigorous courses offered at their school. If that’s AP they like to see that and if it’s IB they like to see IB. IB is definitely more commonplace now than it was years ago. I do agree with someone upthread, that finding out what your school markets as their most rigorous program would be beneficial, if that’s a concern.</p>
<p>My S intended to write his EE over the summer and spent a little bit of time on it–just enough to define the topic and track down reference material–then got busy with other things. When the fall came around, he was even busier. He missed all the intermediate deadlines for getting feedback from his teachers, and barely got something in on time for the drop dead deadline. So not an example of great planning, nor was the product anything close to the best he was capable of, but it was good enough–he got the IB diploma and learned something doing the essay in spite of himself. I do think the other things he did instead were more valuable to him in the long run than spending more time on the EE would have been. No one has ever asked for his grade on the EE, which wasn’t even available until long after college acceptances were determined, and no one other than a teacher, his mom, and the IB graders have ever read it. It doesn’t have to be the high school equivalent of a PhD thesis–just think of it like a term paper that has to satisfy a particular rubric.</p>
<p>If I recall correctly, if you score well in the subject… it’s not critical to get a top score on EE.</p>
<p>I will offer an alternative here… you can do the entire EE in one weekend (depending on your topic). It will probably not be amazing and you will not max the points, but you can check the box for doing the paper.</p>
<p>That is basically what I did, and I got 0 or 1 points on it… don’t remember.</p>
<p>Also, most top schools give a lot more credits for AP than IB it seems. If you drop down a bit, you can get sophomore status at a bunch of schools for the IB diploma.</p>
<p>“the IB rubric is freakishly bizarre.” - True. My son had an EE advisor that was a first timer and a busy administrator… so he did a lot (too much) on his own. Although he had a solid draft at the end of the summer, he ended up rewriting it in the fall.</p>
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<p>But do colleges like it merely because it is usually the most rigorous option in schools that offer it, rather than because of anything special about IB? Of course, if it is the most rigorous option in schools that offer it, the students aiming for the most selective colleges will choose it over less rigorous options because it is the most rigorous option, not necessarily because it is IB.</p>
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<p>[Credit</a> and Placement](<a href=“http://as.cornell.edu/information/orientation/credit.cfm]Credit”>http://as.cornell.edu/information/orientation/credit.cfm) indicates that Cornell Arts and Sciences gives credit and/or placement for several IB Higher Level exams.</p>
<p>The summer medical research internship at the university is 40hrs/wk. (biomedical engineering/neuroscience) She doesn’t want to leave this opportunity because she was selected from 625 applicants.
During the school year and into the summer my daughter volunteers at the local hospital interacting with elderly care patients. (6th day) She will have more than enough CAS hours for graduation. </p>
<p>Overall my concern is balance. In speaking with the IB advisors, and calling a few college admissions offices I am trying to help my daughter decide what best suits her circumstance. (there is no comparison with friends) Every student is unique in how much workload they can handle. I feel it is better to have less on your plate and do the things well then to try 10 things and be mediocre in them. (or burnout)</p>
<p>Ideally if the summer project could also be used for the EE that would be great but I believe between the EE rubric and university publication and copyright rules it seems less likely. The 7th day (day of rest) was to be a day to work on college applications, review some SAT material if she wanted to take the test once more in the fall, and look into scholarship applications. I feel she is so caught up with the IB Diploma requirements that there is no room for taking classes for career exploration or interest. (or to just take a fun class) All I hear is IB acronyms. (IA, TOK, EE…) If she does the certificate she can focus more on quality of her work and being wellrounded. Perhaps work to improve the g.p.a or higher SAT score. Be involved in activities she is passionate about. There would be less pressure and stress and she can focus on writing quality application essays. This would not really any time over the summer for college visits or a vacation. (which are important too) </p>
<p>When the students were recruited for the IB Diploma program I honestly don’t think they knew what they were getting themselves into or what the expectations would be.
I feel it is harder then AP because it is so writing intense and then the IB rubric (seems regimented)which is a mystery to me having done AP myself. Also if a student needs help with an AP class there are books and tutors however with IB there are no books that can be purchased on Amazon and fewer IB tutors. Personally I feel IB is more rigorous than AP (though I maybe wrong) but colleges gives each program equal value. In fact I feel the students doing AP probably earn more college credits than IB Diploma candidates.
Simply because AP is more recognized at universities. Some people have never heard of the IB program. </p>
<p>Given all this, part of her wants to go for the diploma because she feels she has worked too hard to give up now. She wants to graduate on stage with that honor and sense of accomplishment. On the other hand there is additional time management needed and more stress to deal with. So it is a tough decision. I want her to have some fun memories of high school. Junior prom is coming up and it seems the IB diploma candidates have so much on their plate that many are planning not to attend. </p>
<p>Overall my concern is her wellbeing. I wanted her to be challenged but at the same time have some recovery time over the summer because fall will be hectic. Fortunately she gets proper sleep. She doesn’t procrastinate and goes to bed at a reasonable hour completing all school assignments.</p>
<p>At D’s IB magnet school, both Dips and Certs got accepted to top-tier schools, although the Dips were more heavily represented. But “merely” getting a Certificate isn’t necessarily a knock-out factor.</p>
<p>During D’s first semester at college, she said she could spot the IB students in discussion classes; they had that ToK stamp. That’s one of things I really, really like about IB. It teaches students how to communicate.</p>
<p>She has TOK after school during her junior year. In senior year it is the 7th class.The other 6 classes are IB. (4 are HL)
My impression is that admissions is holistic. They look at the students complete profile.
So if she completed the certificate then they would see she spent two summers where she was selected for university programs. (we didn’t pay for any of these) She could explain on her application that she chose the certificate to pursue career exploration by taking IB electives more aligned with her college major rather than fulfilling IB Diploma requirements. We reside in Northern VA which is extremely academically competitive.
Out of 350 students in her class at least 100 are pursuing the IB diploma. (It was 125 but 25 dropped out) At the same time with so many strong IB diploma candidates the competition for local colleges is fierce. There isn’t really a safety school.(unless you want to go to a 3rd tier school which accepts students that don’t take any college level classes in high school.</p>
<p>I did not read the entire thread but I will chime in…
DS is an IB senior in the oldest IB school in our state. He commutes to the school close to 40 miles each way just to be in this environment. He is a very good student (val) at a very demanding/competitive school.
Extended essay was nothing. The kids have been writing papers almost as long in their freshman English class . I have also heard that you only need a C on your extended essay and only do fair on the tests (4-5) to get a diploma. What is the value/prestige of doing a full diploma if one stays for college in the US - I am not sure. My second child however is thinking about studying abroad and for that student an IB diploma is rather a must .</p>
<p>I agree with the fact that IB diploma is very useful if a student wants to study abroad because value in not given to an AP program high school degree when doing foreign studies.
In our area we have a small number of IB high schools but they are not magnet programs. By default our local school is an IB school. (maybe because our area is very diverse and there are many diplomats that live in the area) Diplomats move often so the IB curriculum provides a standard that is accepted in other countries too. </p>
<p>I feel that the IB program does prepare students for college level work.
The students develop good writing and communication skills in the IB program.
I believe students that do complete the IB program feel more confident in handling the college workload and maybe have a smoother transition. The program changes they way they think and the coursework is an IB standard. (which is recognized globally)
The plan is to apply to colleges within the U.S. To get into the best college possible that we can send her too with the best scholarship/aid package offered. (without breaking the bank) The extended essay is presented at school as the big culminating project to be completed for graduation. I think because students don’t know what to expect it can sound intimidating. If my daughter hadn’t gotten this summer internship she would without a doubt complete the IB Diploma program because she would have so much time in the summer to complete the Extended Essay.</p>
<p>I would have to find out if the counselor would mark her academic records as most rigorous in she does the certificate vs. the dipoma.</p>
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<p>The EE would be considered ‘unpublished’ and I don’t see any reason why the university would have any rules that would limit her freedom to use the work for this purpose.</p>
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<p>Yes, but only a few and only higher level. As it happened, they didn’t give credit for two of my kid’s three HL subjects, and she didn’t score high enough to get credit for the third (although she took the AP test in the same subject, with no preparation beyond the IB course, and got credit that way). </p>
<p>I gave my kid’s experience as an example. But my point was that if your goal is credit, take AP tests. This doesn’t mean that you shouldn’t be in an IB program. It just means that you should take BOTH the AP and IB tests in subjects for which the AP and IB curricula are similar. You will get more bang for your buck with AP.</p>