<p>"In addition to making apologies to Atlanta Falcons teammates, his coach and the National Football League, Vick also said he was sorry “to all the young kids out there for my immature acts.”</p>
<p>“What I did was very immature so that means I need to grow up,” he said.</p>
<p>He said that he was “disappointed in myself” and that “dogfighting is a terrible thing and I … reject it.”</p>
<p>Gag. I don’t call it “immature” to kill animals and watch them tear each other apart. I call it “sadistic,” “Vicious,” “cruel,” and “sociopathic.”</p>
<p>I’m surprised that he didn’t follow in the footsteps of many other celebrities and blame his behavior on substance abuse.</p>
<p>What he did was reprehensible, and I hope he gets plenty of time – enough to cause others who participate in dog fighting to decide that “sport” isn’t worth it.</p>
<p>And I think the only reason that he feels bad about what he did is that he has lost millions of dollars and possibly his career as a result. Any decent person wouldn’t need to have to pay that kind of price to be repulsed by dog fighting.</p>
<p>I don’t believe a word that comes out of his mouth. If his co-defendents hadn’t already confessed, he would be on that podium with the NAACP professing his innocence and complaining he was targeted because he was a successful black athlete.</p>
<p>I have to agree NSM. Immature was not the word that came to mind for me either. I’d like to see him receive time, and I’d like to see him do A LOT of community service at animal shelters.</p>
<p>I’m sorry…but to me, dogs, horses and other animals ARE like children in that they are dependent on humans/adults to do the right thing by them and they do become what we make them.</p>
<p>Let’s hope I don’t cause this post to get pulled, but I am sure someone will be outraged…</p>
<p>It was me who in the other post mentioned disposal of unwanted animals on farms in the old days (and still probably today). For some of us, whom never experienced a day on a real farm, that seems so shocking. For others, it was the give and take of farm life. </p>
<p>Now, in Vick’s case, I would have been more understanding if he just put the animals down. It was the perverse pleasure taken in torturing the animals to death. That isn’t excusable as it lacks reasoning. Animals are put down all the time, for all sorts of reasons from food, to cancer, to moving away. It normally is done as quickly and humanely as possible. Would it be as upseting if Vick brought in a vet in and did an injection? Would that be a legal right of his? What the animal cruelty issue is about is the choices and methods.</p>
<p>[note: I am not in Vick’s corner on this. I found it totally disgusting, so think before you blast.] </p>
<p>What seems to be overlooked in this situation is how was Micheal Vick raised? His younger brother was a violent mess too, but alot was overlooked because the Vick’s had game. I am curious about what way these boys were raised as both display some of the worst traits our society has, yet both act as this is “normal” behavior. M. Vick was truly surprized that anyone cared about what he did to his dogs. It didn’t dawn on him for a second that what he was doing was culturally wrong. Why? How did these guys grow up?</p>
<p>Should Vick be removed from VT ring of honor? NO. Because as awful as this dog thing is, M. Vick still sent aid for the students of VT after the shooting. He does good, he does bad, rise repeat… </p>
<p>I would like to see him gain mental help during his stay in prision. I have a feeling prision itself isn’t going to bug him that much. I do think it should be time to treat him and provide help and then let’s see what comes out at the end.</p>
<p>“M. Vick was truly surprized that anyone cared about what he did to his dogs. It didn’t dawn on him for a second that what he was doing was culturally wrong. Why? How did these guys grow up?”</p>
<p>And how were they educated, and what kind of values do his teammates have?</p>
<p>Not sure why you think your comments will cause outrage, Opie. If Vick killed the dogs out of perverse pleasure, I don’t suspect too many people will be giving him the good samaritan award.</p>
<p>I don’t know anything about his upbringing, but yes, agreed, he and his brother had their share of unacceptable behaviors on and off the playing field. I hope this does cause the the NCAA and the NFL to take a good hard look at their athletes, given the increasingly blurred boundary between aggression and competition we are seeing more and more. Are we turning college and pro athletes into fighting dogs too? Sad social commentary…</p>
<p>NSM-</p>
<p>Agreed- we have to wonder about values. But as we know from social psychology experiments, it is sometimes hard to challenge behavior or choices of one’s teammates. I wonder if his teammates knew about the dogfighting (would he brag about his fried dog escapades to his teammates?? Yuck!). Certainly team owner Arthur Blank didn’t know about these choices and behaviors. He had taken Vick under his wing and was clearly personally wounded by all this. We can only hope something good will come of all these bad choices.</p>
<p>“And how were they educated, and what kind of values do his teammates have?”</p>
<p>Good points. From what I understand MVick really didn’t hang out with teammates at all. He ran with his “boys” from his hometown. His teammates didn’t know about this. However, across the NFL and I guess here, some people were going “so what”? They were his property after all. Several NFLers made these types of statements.</p>
<p>{again to all… just because you attempt to understand the why’s of a situation does not mean you condone it. So don’t make mr. Vick’s situation my situation. That is why the last post got pulled. Trying to understand or talk about a situation does not immediately mean it’s condoned. thanks}</p>
<p>The thing about the education part that gets me. Usually an education opens our minds to different ideas that we replace our old ones. {Think the “Waterboy” and what part of the Aligator makes him so mean…} I mean, what did MVick or his younger gun wielding brother learn at VT? </p>
<p>What some of us fail to understand is American culture is layered. What is “terrible” to some is just “Tuesday” to others.</p>
<p>"Not sure why you think your comments will cause outrage, Opie. "</p>
<p>Hey, I’m not sure either, but they sure did last time, didn’t they? ;)</p>
<p>I pretty much was labeled “pro rape” by my good friend Curm and a few others last post. </p>
<p>Pretty unjustified, yet happend just the same. I would like to post here without getting labeled or accused of something, that’s all. Does that seem reasonable?</p>
<p>My suggestion, Opie… If you refrain from bringing things that are potentially inflammatory up in this thread (such as
) we can hopefully prevent this thread from degrading into a bunch of name-calling. How does that sound?? Ok?? Lets leave the old issues in the old thread.</p>
<p>Hey this is CC and we want to know Vicks SAT&ACT scores. What was his major? GPA all the real facts. heheh How many private tutors he needed. Some here think he is pretty intellectualy capable. We know he can play football.</p>
<p>"If you refrain from bringing things that are potentially inflammatory up in this thread (such as "</p>
<p>Well, sorry, but that didn’t work last time, and I brought nothing up that was potentially inflammatory about the subject. I kinda recall that you were asking me for definitions too and gave up when I asked for more detail or was that someone else? I think you got it. I know some folks did. </p>
<p>I’m sorry there are just some here that can’t see grey. You are or you aren’t. But enough said, so far here it’s worked except for the foreray into abortion being the same for a few pages. </p>
<p>Even this has some grey. Vick’s done some good things along with the bad. Should he be punished forever, or does he deserve an oportunity for redemption in the public’s eye? </p>
<p>Personally, I’ve always agreed with Jim Mora that Vick is a “coach killer”. that is, Vick has so much “potential” yet fails to deliver so often, but still is so attractive for his “potential” makes coaches bend over backwards for him. Which if you think about it, could be why he is where he is today. </p>
<p>Have people been bending over backwards for MVick for years? Could he have failed to “know better” because all those involved with his upbringing were blinded by the “potential” he can show and failed to teach him to “know better”?</p>
<p>You must have me confused with someone else, Opie. I steered waaaay clear of the hot button issues in that previous thread. I tried (though unsuccessfully) to bring the thread back on topic a few times… then gave up. I appreciate your not readdressing the issues that caused problems in the last thread, and thank you for not wanting to “get the last word in” re: that dead thread. </p>
<p>As for Vick, if we as a society do not believe that people can change, that they can learn from and correct bad behaviors and decisions, to learn to rehabilitate themselves, then we are as unjust as he was. He deserves a chance to try to get his stuff together.</p>
<p>After so many references to the ‘dead thread’, I’m almost afraid to bring up new issues with this case. NSM - your reference to Vick as a sociopath brought another issue to mind. Although I can’t remember where and when, I know that I’ve come across articles that show a correlation between sociopaths and animal cruelty, that it’s not unusual for serial killers/rapists/etc. to have participated in such abuse when they were growing up. I’m not qualified to make a call on the significance of the correlation, but someone else mentioned here that he and his brother had a traumatic upbringing. My bet is that this is not his first foray into exploiting the defenseless. In fact, I’d bet good money on the fact that this is not a guy who, for all intents and purposes, leads a completely upstanding and respectable life, and this is his only questionable behavior. Usually people who engage in risky, illegal behaviors don’t get caught upon the first incident - there has been a history of ‘something’ previously that indicated he was headed down a more dangerous path.</p>
<p>I almost started another thread on a story that the media promoted today about whether it’s beneficial for parents to fess up to their kids to their own illegal activities. So do you think Vick would be proud to tell his kids that this is something he once did? Should we start another thread about the pros and cons of how much we disclose to our kids about our own shady pasts? Just to flush it out, I’ll admit I had a pretty ‘colorful’ high school/college lifestyle and did my share of underage drinking and some ‘inhaling’. And yes, I chose to tell my kids about it. Was it the right decision? It was for me, but I can’t speak for others. I think my story shows it is possible to turn one’s life around, which is why I hold out hope for anyone who takes a trip down a wrong path.</p>
<p>I just tell my kids to become as “smart as your dad “thinks” he is…” and let it go at that. </p>
<p>I don’t think Vick is offically married. I thought somebody sued him a while back for giving her herpes. Vick has kinda been in and out of the news over the years… I would have paid more attiention maybe had he been the QB of my local team. I’m stuck with poor ol Matt Hassleback, good father, husband and nice guy… and the only QB to be called for an illegal block while tackling a steeler on an interception return??? And the NBA is the only league with gambling refs? </p>
<p>Has anybody really done a bio on the Vicks? Because up until this year, Michael Vick was the standup Vick in the family as little brother didn’t get the chance to be a coach killer and got tossed from VT.</p>
<p>You know I have begun to wonder whether Vick was breeding pups of “his own”. He sure seems to have the aggressive gene. Sociopath and maybe those winners were his in more ways than one.</p>
<p>Well, well. Atlanta’s quarterback, Joey Harrington, just threw the first touchdown pass of the game aginst the Bengals. Maybe his #13 is a lucky 13. We could use some good news.</p>
<p>“Higherlead, I don’t know what’s wrong with you. Pointing out other issues in the world doesn’t change the fact that fighting dogs, in addition to torturing and drowning them, is wrong. It’s probably your same sick mindset that gave Michael Vick the feeling that he wasn’t doing anything wrong.”</p>
<p>Or iy could be that Vick himself has pretty much been exploited all his life for the entertainment of folks like you and me. Now he is going to lose everything because he violated some white middle class cultural taboo.</p>
<p>What really amazes me is that so many of you can more easily identify with and feel sympathy for a freaking dog than you can a human being. I don’t believe he should skate but there are way worse things happen every day in America and nobody cares. There are way more kids getting abused right now right this minute in your town than dogs fighting for peoples amusement. I don’t doubt that one can breed the other but if that is what is happening the dogfights are more likely the result of childabuse than the other way around.</p>
</p>