This week we did our final campus visit with our youngest child. So, we’ve sat through quite a few college information sessions over the years, and I didn’t think there was anything new to be heard. I was wrong! An adcom at a top 20 LAC said that when they see a candidate with mostly A’s but a few C’s, they think that pattern indicates that the student only works hard in the subjects he likes, and is less diligent about those he doesn’t care for. Wow, that’s quite an assumption! In D’s case, I can tell you a C grade means that the subject was very difficult for her and touched on some weaknesses, but that in reality she worked even harder to earn that C than she did the A’s.
I wonder if it’s better from an admissions standpoint if they assume you’re lazy, or that you’re academically less capable in certain fields? Neither is positive, of course, but I was surprised they just assume lack of effort.
The concept of being lazy or less academically capable coincide with one another. If a class is difficult for a student, schools want to see that the student did everything they could to bring that grade up. It’s better to see a B in an academically rigorous class than to see a C. Unfortunately, nowadays the C does not translate as an “average” grade, but as one that can carry the same weight as essentially failing a class.
One of my kids got Cs in a certain subject, at a school with no grade inflation. My child worked very hard in those classes to even get those Cs and not something lower. The GC was able to touch upon the area of academic weakness in the counselor’s statement and also one of my child’s teacher recs was from a teacher in this field. The teacher thought highly of my child, praising my child’s preparedness, effort, and seeking of help despite the grade received in the class.
Some students have lopsided abilities. I think colleges are able to see this and there is space in top schools for some students like this. (My child attends a top 20 LAC) However, through the application, a picture was painted of what kind of child my student was - strengths, weaknesses, but not laziness/lack of effort.
I have no problem with the school deciding it doesn’t want to admit a student with C’s, and certainly the elite schools don’t need to and probably don’t often do so. However, one could also allow for other possibilities when a kid who is normally a straight A student gets a C, including poor teaching and unfair testing.
Doschicos, your S sounds like my D. Interestingly the teacher of the AP class in which my D got a C this year praised her tremendous work ethic when she wrote in her yearbook.
Oh, I’m not actually looking for a way to get D in. I don’t think it’s a good fit for other reasons. I just wanted to discuss any info session tidbits that surprised people.
My son and I went to an info session at a large state university for the Honors college. At the info session, the representative giving the info session proceeded to tell us that her daughter organized a French Club which never met in order to beef her ECs to make her competitive for Honors admission. ( she was admitted by the way) When we stayed after to ask her some questions about the program , her standard answer was " What makes you any different than anyone else in this room?" not as a thought provoking question, but as a sarcastic response. My son applied and was accepted into the program, but he declined admission for a school which was a much better fit that appreciated his assets .
My jaw dropper was this, which I’ve mentioned. A parent asked about career services. Rep (someone seasoned) seemed blindsided. Finally said, well, we’re building a new center, mumbled about how it would get up to speed. Huh? And the alums she brought were one unemployed and one a nanny. This was for a top LAC, a road show meeting in Boston, not some random pool of kids. Off our list.
At a very elite New England LAC, someone asked what SAT score would likely lead to admission. Admissions rep said, “700’s, unless you can play football, then it’s 600’s. BUT if you can play hockey, 500’s.” When the crowd murmured in disbelief, he then added, “Hey, the alumni like competitive teams!” Probably an extremely honest answer, but shocked to hear it verbalized.
Those guys must get punch drunk after a while of repeating the same stuff and answering the same questions about what size sheets and what if Johnny gets sick.
I may have mentioned this…I was at a regional private school that would be a safety for most full-pay kids. I was really starting from square one from this school and wanted to get an overview of what they were all about. So at the end of the info session, I floated a nice slow softball for the rep: besides the location, which you emphasized in your talk, what should I tell my out-of-state kids is special about this school? And he looked at that nice slow softball and whiffed. He had no answer. He thought about it and dithered and finally returned to the location! (It’s not the only school in that city.)
The admissions rep was an alum who majored in PUBLIC RELATIONS. My students need a lot of drop-dead safeties, but I came away thinking that even my expellees should expect more than that.
At UChicago, the admissions rep mentioned that letters of recommendation should be from teachers of core academic subjects. No surprise there. But she also listed them, and foreign language was not on the list. I asked for clarification and the response was that they did not consider foreign language a core subject and did not want letters from those teachers.
My friends son fit the mostly As but a few Cs pattern and the assumption the OP heard was correct in his case. Didn’t hurt him. He was admitted to HYS ( didn’t apply to P). Of course he was described accurately as “brilliant and " focused on his passions.” And he was an Intel finalist and came in first on the National Chemistry Exam ( my husband who has a degree in Chem said the smartest person he ever knew before him came in 100 th)
Apparently he continued his pattern at Stanford grade wise. And decided one of his his passions is acting. He auditions and appears in local theater. But he’s probably the only " struggling actor" whose day job is genetics research!
Probably not the only one. Lots of other performing artists do it on the side while having some other jobs. Of course, many are not trying to make a career of performing art (i.e. it is an “extracurricular” for them).
At Brandeis, the adcom said “Who else in here hates math?” and raised his hand. “Because our flexible requirements are perfect for kids that hate math.” Big turnoff for my D.