I think the real problem is that as seen on this monster thread, “really casual”, the term used by the OP, means very different things depending on where one lives and what their sensibilities are regarding clothing. To many, “really casual” means exactly that-come as you are. In no world I’ve ever been a part of is “really casual” dressy slacks or a dress. One commenter even said she only wear such slacks to meet with Very Important Clients.
The description of “really casual” being actually, fairly well-dressed has had me wondering what the Op considers “dressy”. Suits and ties and formal wear? Several here have suggested that the teen in question could have “gotten away” with jeans or a nice sweater over the tee shirt, or perhaps “nice” shorts. But I don’t think so. The OP’s “really casual” was “nice pants”. No one who thinks “really casual” is dress pants is going be ok with jeans or any kind of shorts.
I don’t think that the D ever knew about the hubbub. She was probably told, “Oh, we decided to go to a different place.” Why would she be told that it was because she couldn’t “dress right”. That would be even more boorish than the attitude ascribed to the girl in the first place.
Well, off to another complete digression: There is apparently more than one Thai restaurant on the east coast named Wild Ginger. If they happen to be at the one in the southern part of the east coast, temps there have been in the high 90’s, so shorts and a t shirt may be a reasonable thought to a young adult. Just sayin’.
Somewhere about pg 5 of this thread some posters brought up the thought that the OP might have been embarrassed by, or uncomfortable with, the girl’s outfit, so instead of the Thai restaurant, changed the choice to a burger joint. Seems to be a reasonable assumption, even though it was implied. Doesn’t matter-- its hard to really understand why this thread took on a life of its own. If that’s what the girl brought and was comfortable with, it is what it is. And who knows what the school sent to the students as suggestion for what to bring/wear. I know my DS#2 tries to travel with just a backpack whenever he can.
And thanks, igloo. We had a great time with the wedding. While it may not have been what I would have chosen, it was their wedding and very much “them”. Very outdoors-y. Young folks these days are getting married on farms, in barns, converted warehouses, at camp retreats, etc. Mix of traditional and non-traditional. DS relayed a story of their having attended a wedding in a burned out barn (about half remained). DS and wife thought it was a unique choice and they (the bride and groom) managed to make it an interesting venue. Turns out it was not by choice- the barn had a fire the week before and they had to make the best of it!!
As for “cute flats”, I can’t wear flats as they offer no support and my feet end up in pain. But I have several pair of comfort shoes-some approaching “cute”, most probably not. Comfort shoes aren’t very attractive. But I prefer to not be in pain so anyone with issues regarding my footwear can go pound sand.
There certainly are different ways of thinking here. For me, it’s all about making the guest comfortable. I’m not going to criticize or judge what they wear. I may tell my kids that they should wear pants or change their shirt, but if a friend or their child came over wearing something overly casual, I would never blink an eye. If I felt the need to change the restaurant, so be it, they would never hear any concern from me. It’s not about what I want, it’s about making them feel welcome. I also tend to think that people at restaurants pay little attention to what kids wear, so as long as the kid isn’t wearing a see through top, nobody will even think twice. But It’s how my kids appear that concerns me, not someone else’s kid.
The most important thing here is seeing the friends, making them feel good, and not letting them feel any discomfort or judgment. The choice of restaurant is fairly irrelevant, and the only reason I would choose a particular restaurant in the first place, is because I’d think that they would enjoy it.
Some poster said we’re just yacking- and that’s really all this is. Kind of like our own long lunch. OP has only commented twice, I think- and I imagine her smiling and shaking her head.
So I want to say, my “cute flats” are not like what D2 owns, $10 somewhere, utterly flat or with a 1/4 inch heel. Mine are low wedgy, super comfortable, have taken me on lots of travel walking. I can wear them with jeans or a suit. I treasure them.
Say WHAT??? Try taking off those incredibly myopic glasses and read the posts more carefully. That is such a total, ignorant misunderstanding of my comment that its simply not worth wasting the time trying to dumb it down, which seems to be necessary. Good grief. Seems its more important to care about whether cars in California have a ding or two and are too shabby to be on the road and not up to one’s standards, I suppose. FWIW, when we were in that locale, saw plenty of beater cars on the road. Better call the PC authorities :)]
@pizzagirl - We don’t go to fast food and I wouldn’t consider it “going out to eat.” The kid has been know to take his own money and stop at McDonalds on his own time (usually late night with friends or on a road trip). That is in a separate category than even the most casual family dining. He would not consider wearing the PJs actually out with anyone but his friends for the very most casual activities.
The point is not that “everything goes everywhere” or that her shorts were the best, most appropriate choice. The OP asked in her opener if “everyone has gone around the bend with casual” implying that the kid had a full wardrobe in front of her but willfully chose to show up in gym shorts despite other options. It’s not about what she wore to dinner or what she should have packed for unanticipated activities. The OP was surprised that she was that casual on the airplane and at her orientation. To answer that I would say, “No, we have not all gone around the bend.” She was fine for her agenda and the point was raised (which OP ignored) that she would be on the edge for the dinner engagement. She may be guilty of poor planning, but that is not a sign that the fashion world has gone to the dogs or that people everywhere don’t understand how to kick it up a notch based on the venue.
@sseamom I am 100% with you on the footwear issue. I will dress up and wear dresses because I like them, but shoes is one area I really don’t care for dressing up ever, unless it’s work or formal function or a place that calls for closed-toed shoes. Everywhere sandals are OK, my Tevas go.
Back in college, I used to wear heels daily. Yeah, I am glad I outgrew that phase. I love wearing shoes that allow proper support and allow me to walk hours on end, without restricting movement, especially living in a big city, where I walk everywhere! I also think it’s a great choice for my knees, which have had issues in the past. I wear my Tevas with everything from dresses to shorts, and they definitely go everywhere with me, including restaurants, dressed up or dressed down by the other clothes I am wearing.
People say that, but maybe the problem in the past was we were too formal:). When I started working in tech, I was working nights so we dressed casually (I mean casually!), when I switched to a day job I was wearing a jacket and tie. Over time that evolved into business casual, and where I work now, I wear polo shirts and jeans and sneakers or my boat shoes, but it also is the kind of job where everyone dresses like that, unless they are dealing with customers or clients. I can tell you that the ‘suit culture’ was more formal, and i also think it had a lot of downsides (besides dry cleaning), I think it reinforced hierarchy and status crap way too much, rather than focusing on people as a team or on how people contribute. While sometimes I think it may have gone too far (a young woman wearing a business suit and flip flops was a little weird, though my wife pointed out she may have been going for a pedicure!) , being in a building where there are financial firms where suits and ties are still the norm, it feels kind of alien to me. Obviously, it is all about appropriateness, too, I won’t show up to a wedding in jeans and sweatshirt (unless it is that kind of thing), or a funeral, if it is a fancy affair I’ll dress up, but going to an ordinary restaurant or whatnot, not going to go crazy either.
You know, with teenagers, when we were going to travel somewhere, I always asked them what they’d packed. I realize they aren’t masters of the traveling world, and haven’t considered every possibility. I always would have them throw in some pants, even if we were going to a warm climate. Kind of surprised that there is consternation here against the teenager only, if there has to be any. Her parents were obviously fine with her bringing nothing but gym shorts.
When people asked me what to wear to my wedding, I told them dressy casual-ish. Somewhere around sundress/khakis level. I had people show up in everything from jeans to suits (most of these people ended up changing). Even one of my bridesmaids changed out of her dress once the formalities were over into jeans. When it started getting colder at night during the reception, most people (including me) changed into jeans. I literally did not notice until I saw the pictures. I remember them being there but I’ll be darned if I remember what people were wearing.
Is that “around the bend” with casual? If it is, I hope it is a sign of things to come.
Wow times have changed! When I was in college, back when dinosaurs roamed the earth, my shoe collection consisted of : Boat shoes (sperry topsiders), earth shoes (remember them?) Dr. Scholls sandal things with the wooden bottoms (these: http://www.zappos.com/dr-scholls-original-original-collection-navy), hiking boots and one pair of platform shoes. Those (the platform shoes-- think disco type things) were my “dress” shoes. I think I had one pair of shoes in the back of teh closed with a small heel for a formal event.
As for the girl in the OP’s story, would it be typical to check with a upig adult to see what she packed? Her parents may have been fine with what she packed, or didn’t know.
Or the daughter was stubborn in what she would pack to orientation. There’s a cool factor to just tossing a few things in a bag. I couldn’t have told my kid what to pack to orientation.
Since the false assumption here and the ad hominem that followed it is still like nails on a blackboard, will add one thing, before this thread hopefully is shot and taken out of its misery. Who “admitted” anything? No one. Please stop with the inflammatory, annoying straw man arguments. It gets old. Try reading more carefully, and try not to jump to leaps of incorrect assumptions/conclusions from which to springboard the snarky retorts. Yes the invitation to the Fri night BBQ said “casual”. But the invitation was neither written by, nor sent by us. It was written by the bride and groom and included with the wedding invitations, as everyone invited to the wedding was also invited to the BBQ. Not that it matters or really is any of your business.
FWIW
Oh, and thanks (not) for suggesting in that previous post how I should write my posts. No thanks.
I stopped telling my kids what to pack when they were about 8 years old. They had been traveling with us from the time they were about 6 month and packed their own bags since they were 5. That said, they don’t leave our house in gym shorts except if they are really just exercising because they only use gym shorts for exercising and lounging around the house. They may ask if they are traveling with us what range of clothing might be expected and may toss in extra clothes depending on our answer. They are always able to manage to fly with minimal luggage. On the rare occasions that a suit is appropriate, H will send S a text ahead of time so he can bring it and not be surprised. D generally has various separates that she can mix and match to come up with an outfit for pretty much anything she may attend.
I’m sure there are quite a few young people who pretty much live in “nice” athletic shorts and tshirts. If that works for them, that is OK. Even here, in casual HI, I don’t see often folks in such attire on airplanes or out at dinner (except near the beach).
People seem to change their ideas of what they choose to wear as they get older. I know that S until about age 20 wore cargo shorts nearly everywhere. It worked for him and we let him choose. He now wears a much wider range of clothing and rarely wears cargo shorts at age 27.
Ha ha. I am here in Old Navy with my son as he picks out bathing suits! Just bought him (in another store) 2 new pairs of sneakers and 2 pairs of dress shoes as he prepares to leave for his new job (which calls for business dress but they do have casual Fridays). He is the precise opposite of a fashionista - he’s bored senseless by all this! Tried to get him to get a pair of Speery Topsiders for casual and he didn’t bite so I gave up ha ha.
