Is it normal for the police to ask the passenger for ID?

Parent Cafe
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<p>The law (maybe not all of it… See, I can be reasonable) is fundamentally unjust and police take a bad thing even further than necessary.</p>

<p>You should never consent to anything and you should fight every ticket. Break unjust laws whenever you can get away with it.</p>

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<p>And it is that attitude which keeps our police from doing essential work. They are wasting their time dealing with people like you.</p>

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After my freshman year of college a friend came over my house to visit and since my family had moved we went for a drive around the neighborhood so I could show him around. We were both 19 and male, my friend who was driving had shoulder length hair, and we were driving his Dad’s late 70s Van … we almost immediately got pulled over for speeding (something like 45 in a 25 mph zone) when we were not (if anything we were going too slow because we were checking out the houses in which cute girls lived) … besides the ticket then to bust our chops the cops kept us pulled over for about 45 minutes. Essentially a case of DWY (driving while young).</p>

<p>My friend decided to fight the ticket … so we sent to court the next break in college. We testified … and then the cops testified describing how they tailed us speeding; but since we had only travelled about 100 years since our last turn they had to change the story to make their’s work so in their story they moved where they pulled us over. Then their game of holding us for 45 minutes came back to haunt them … while we were stopped another cop car came by and talked to the cops who stopped us for 10-15 minutes. At this point we asked the judge if we could ask the cops from the second car to testify to collaborate our version of the story … the judge called a recess and called the second set of cops in … who immediately testified about about the location and timing of the stop which agreed with our story … and the ticket was dropped. PS - at the time I was a Navy ROTC student (with no hair), son of an Army Colonel, driving a 1/4 mile from our home in a neighborhood dominated by military officer’s families.</p>

<p>This event actually made me very interested in the law for awhile. While the interest in the law subsided it certainly pertains to the questions about why not trust the cops and do anything they want … my experience involved made up charges, hassling us for no good reason, and made up testimony in traffic court … so my trust certainly has limits. For our kids we advice them to be respectful and helpful but do not do anything more than is required … so do not agree to searches, do not provide more information than is required, and if the police start pushing stop answering questions and call us.</p>

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<p>[What</a> To Do If You?re Stopped By The Police | New York Civil Liberties Union (NYCLU) - American Civil Liberties Union of New York State](<a href=“http://www.nyclu.org/content/what-do-if-you’re-stopped-police]What”>http://www.nyclu.org/content/what-do-if-you’re-stopped-police)</p>

<p>What To Do If You’re Stopped By The Police</p>

<p>We all recognize the need for effective law enforcement, but we should also understand our own rights and responsibilities — especially in our interactions with the police.</p>

<p>This card tells you what to do if you are stopped, arrested, or injured in your encounter with the police, and how to file a complaint.</p>

<p>IF YOU HAVE A POLICE ENCOUNTER, YOU CAN PROTECT YOURSELF.</p>

<ol>
<li>What you say to the police is always important. What you say can and will be used against you, and it can give the police an excuse to arrest you, especially if you bad-mouth a police officer.</li>
<li>You don’t have to consent to a search of yourself, your car or your house. If you do consent to a search, it can affect your rights later in court. If the police say they have a search warrant, ask to see it. If they don’t, use the phrase “I do not consent to this search.”</li>
<li>Do not interfere with or obstruct the police—you can be arrested for it.</li>
</ol>

<p>IF YOU ARE STOPPED FOR QUESTIONING:</p>

<ol>
<li>Police may stop and detain you only if there is reasonable suspicion that you committed, are committing or are about to commit a crime.</li>
<li>You can ask if you are under arrest or free to leave. If you are arrested, you have a right to know why.</li>
<li>In New York, you need not carry ID, and you need not show ID to a police officer if requested. If you are issued a summons or arrested, however, and you refuse to produce ID and refuse to tell officers who you are, the police may detain you until you can be positively identified.</li>
<li>If police reasonably suspect you pose a danger to them or others, they may pat down your outer clothing. Don’t physically resist, but say you don’t consent to the search. If an officer asks you to empty your pockets before he pats you down—even if he says you won’t get in trouble— decline to do so. Use the phrase “I do not consent to this search.”</li>
<li>Don’t bad-mouth a police officer or run away, even if you believe what is happening is unreasonable. That could lead to your arrest.</li>
</ol>

<p>IF YOU ARE STOPPED IN YOUR CAR:</p>

<ol>
<li>Upon request, show the police your driver’s license, registration and proof of insurance. In certain cases, your car can be searched without a warrant. To protect yourself later, you should state that you do not consent to a search. It is not lawful for police to arrest you simply for refusing to consent to a search.</li>
<li>If you’re given a ticket, you should sign it; otherwise you can be arrested. You can always fight the case in court later.</li>
<li>If you’re suspected of drunk driving (DWI) you will be asked to take a breath-alcohol and coordination test. If you fail the tests, or if you refuse to take them, you will be arrested, your driver’s license may be suspended and your car may be taken away.</li>
</ol>

<p>IF POLICE COME TO YOUR HOME:</p>

<ol>
<li>The police can enter your home without permission if they have a warrant or if it is an emergency situation. If the police say they have a warrant, ask to see it. They must show it to you when they are able to do so safely.</li>
<li>If you are arrested in your home or office, the police can search you and the area immediately surrounding you or where evidence of criminal activity is in plain view.</li>
</ol>

<p>IF YOU ARE ARRESTED OR TAKEN TO A POLICE STATION:</p>

<ol>
<li>You have the right to remain silent and to talk to a lawyer before you talk to the police. Don’t tell the police anything except your name and address. Don’t give any explanations, excuses or stories. You can make your defense later, in court, based on what you and your lawyer decide is best.</li>
<li>If you have a lawyer, ask to see your lawyer immediately. If you can’t afford a lawyer, you have a right to a free one once your case goes to court. You can ask the police how to contact a lawyer. Don’t say anything without a lawyer.</li>
<li>Within a reasonable time after your arrest or booking, you should ask the police to contact a family member or friend. If you are permitted to make a phone call, anything you say at the precinct may be recorded or listened to. Be very careful. Never talk about the facts of your case over the telephone.</li>
<li>Do not make any decisions in your case until you have talked with a lawyer.</li>
</ol>

<p>WHAT TO DO IF YOU’RE STOPPED BY THE POLICE</p>

<pre><code>Stay calm and in control of your words, body language and emotions.
Don’t get into an argument with the police.
Never bad-mouth a police officer.
Remember, anything you say or do can be used against you.
Keep your hands where the police can see them.
Don’t run.
Don’t touch any police officer.
Don’t resist even if you believe you are innocent.
Don’t complain at the scene or tell the police they’re wrong or that you’re going to file a complaint.
Do not make any statements regarding the incident.
Ask for a lawyer immediately if you are arrested.
Remember officers’ badge and patrol car numbers.
Write down everything you remember ASAP.
Try to find witnesses and their names and phone numbers.
If you are injured, take photos of the injuries as soon as possible, but make sure you get medical attention first.
</code></pre>

<p>To File A Police Misconduct Complaint:
Contact the Civilian Complaint Review Board by calling 311 or by visiting [New</a> York City Civilian Complaint Review Board](<a href=“http://www.nyc.gov/html/ccrb]New”>http://www.nyc.gov/html/ccrb).</p>

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<p>When I was in college one time we were driving home really late from a concert. The guy driving the car didn’t make a “full stop” at a stop sign at like 1 AM and a cop pulled us over. He asked for his ID as well as the other guy in the passenger seat. I’m not 100 percent sure why but I thought it had to do with them being young and out late and maybe they thought they were out drinking or something.</p>

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<p>@ebeeeee:
Essential duties, like waiting in speed traps for unsuspecting motorists to go 10mph over to fill their quotas? Making sure people don’t stand on the grass or smoke too close to the doors? To keep kids from playing music too loudly, and 20-year-olds from drinking socially?
If all police did was handle real crimes, I’d feel much less hostile towards them. 90% of what they do is petty and wrong.</p>

<p>I really like the suggestions for interacting with the cops. Can you really get arrested for, in a level tone of voice and a smile on your face, on the street, calling a police officer a naughty word? I try to give all cops I see the finger.</p>

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<p>Our town is really strict with this too and everything is printed as well. Now, this brings up another topic I always wondered about…Even thought it is a bit off topic, since I started the thread, I don’t feel as bad potentially hijacking it. So, here is my thought…</p>

<p>If kids live in an area where the police are very proactive busting parties for underage drinking, rather than kids who live in a larger city or looser area, where the police have bigger fish to fry, there tends to be a lot more kids being arrested for underage drinking. When all those kids apply to college and have to list the infractions, the kids who live in stricter areas are going to look a lot worse than those from other more lenient areas, but are possibly doing the same things or even worse, but don’t get penalized for it. Obviously, none of them should be drinking, my point is more that kids who live in areas with less crime, can really look worse than their peers who are doing the exact same thing.</p>

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<p>I have no sympathy for this woman. She obviously had an anti-police agenda and was trying to create a scene. If an officer is giving you a reasonable request, i.e. go back inside because you are in a hostile situation and are interfering with an investigation, it is best to comply with it. Cops have a hard enough job as it is; there is no reason to be a jerk just to make it a little bit harder on them.</p>

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<p>My brother, who is military, came out of a store to find two cops chatting, one sitting on his car. They ignored him as he waited a moment before letting them know that was his car. The cop sitting on his car gave him a J walking ticket. </p>

<p>He went to court in full military uniform and got the ticket thrown out. It was pretty clear the cop was shocked that he had ticketed an army officer. But this is the type of stuff that can happen. You really have no rights with a cop. If they lie and there are no unrelated witnesses to back you up, you are sunk. And even if you win, there is often a cost to fighting a citation and little ability for recourse. </p>

<p>Most policemen are just interested in doing their jobs, but there are bad eggs in there as there are in any profession. In some areas there are more of them.</p>

<p>When my AA friend moved into a suburban neighborhood, after her kids were stopped too many times for random checks, she called the police chief and asked to come into the station and to introduce her family to the police. It was a danged shame that she had to do this, and she did make them ashamed but it was a necessity for her and her family.</p>

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<p>Agreed that there ate good and bad cops just as in any profession, and we hear more of the bad cop stories. In my earlier posts I wasn’t defending all cops merely stating that the attitude of going out of ones way to be difficult isn’t helpful. Giving the finger to every copi I see? Now that is a mature inteliligent behavior.</p>

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<p>I have mixed feelings on the topic. Cops have a difficult job … especially in America where they have good reason to be armed. On the other hand the profession clearly draws enough “bad eggs” that most people have several stories about occurrences that should never have happened. (Yes, that includes me.) </p>

<p>I try to look at the event from the policeman’s perspective before drawing conclusions. I guess that puts me a little left-of-center (for looking at more than just facts) … or perhaps it’s a little right-of-center for considering things that might give the police more leeway. IDK.</p>

<p>I have no problem sharing ID. I have no problem being polite. I don’t even have a (significant) problem with cops stopping young drivers … in part because unlicensed drivers have been responsible for tragedies in our area. But I’ve told my kids to never consent to a search of the car.</p>

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<p>Cuse–the question isn’t whether you or I feel sorry for the woman. Laws are not feelings. The question is, can a police officer tell anyone to go inside, because they “don’t feel comfortable” with them being outside? Where is the line? Do you think there is a line? What commands can a police officer lawfully give and arrest someone for not following? Are there any limits to this? These are serious questions that go way beyond who you feel sorry for. (What do feelings have to do with these questions, anyway?)</p>

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<p>I think if you are present at an active crime scene to the point where you are becoming a distraction, it is perfectly reasonable for an officer to tell you to step back or go away. Look at the situation in Florida a few weeks ago-a shootout broke out on a busy city street and several innocent bystanders were struck. There’s no reason this woman couldn’t have filmed from her front step or from her doorway when the officer asked her to back up. Now, did she break the law? I don’t know, I’m not a legal expert.</p>

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<p>I watched the video. As the wife of a police officer, I <em>get</em> that the officers were not comfortable with her being <em>behind</em> them. She states she doesn’t have a weapon. Unless the officers search her, they don’t know. They cannot know what she is or is not going to do. </p>

<p>The officers need to secure the scene. She could have taped from inside her house. Police don’t/can’t mind being taped. They have video recording equipment in their cars.</p>

<p>As a wife of a police officer, I’d rather my husband err on the side of his safety. </p>

<p>The woman didn’t want to understand the perspective of the officer.</p>

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<p>“Profiling at it’s worst”??? Please, good cops profile all day. It’s their business. They can’t do so based on race, thanks to Clinton, but they can and do practice it often. And for the naysayers who distrust and despise authority do what you want, but I want the cops in my town stopping everything that moves at night. I’ve got nothing to hide, they can stop me all day (and night). Fortunately I don’t behave in a manner that would put me on a cops radar that easy, though if I were stopped I would comply with the request for ID. Police have a progression of force policy, but they also use a progression of attitude policy when they encounter someone and they let the civilians start that progression and when they start it it is often easy to come out on top. They get paid to win.</p>

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<p>One of the problems I see with the case of the woman in Rochester is that there were other people standing there with her. If she was such a threat, why weren’t the other people? It seems like it came down solely to the fact that she had a camera.</p>

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<p>Of course. And there was quite a distance between her and the officers; she was hardly about to attack them. (If there was a concern that she had a gun, which on the face of it is absurd, then sending her into her house wouldn’t negate that concern.)</p>

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What else can you do? Fight them?</p>

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<p>^ Or perhaps write my congressman and tell them that police are corrupt? Get a petition going? People have been brainwashed into thinking that cops = good, and dislike of cops = criminal. </p>

<p>By the way…</p>

<p>[The</a> Legal History of Flipping the Bird / Middle Finger](<a href=“http://www.chiprowe.com/articles/legal-history-finger.html]The”>http://www.chiprowe.com/articles/legal-history-finger.html)</p>

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<p>If only I could be so lucky.</p>

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<p>She allegedly yelled something at the police when she exited her house, which likely is what initially drew the attention to her.</p>

<p>The bottom line is, if you don’t want to have a problem with the police, then don’t create a problem. She created a problem, and unfortunately for her it ended in her arrest.</p>