<p>For most of my education I’ve been pretty good in passing my classes and excelling. By the second half of my high school education, my attitude changed dramatically towards school. It went from doing the best I can do, to getting things done at a level that looks good enough (by my standards that’s getting 80+ or Bs or higher). I was a 91 avg student in high school and I’m at a 3.4 at the moment in college. I’m not sure what it is, but I am very bitter about school. I only do whatever I need to do to get good enough grades and to get the easiest grades possible. For example, I used to be, and still am, interested in the sciences but I haven’t taken any science classes since 10th grade. And since I don’t have to I won’t be taking one while in college. I don’t have a science requirement at Fordham U, or at the very least I already had it fulfilled before coming in. When it comes to midterms and finals I do short reviews just for refreshers. Why? Whether it’s wrong thinking or not, I feel that if I didn’t get it before I’m not going to really learn anything by memorizing something for the exam. I’ve been that way for a while. When I’m in class I don’t really take notes down. I just listen and take in the information and learn that way. In the few classes I do take down notes I don’t even review em much which is why I’ve stopped taking notes in all but one class (my stats class). A lot of my professors have taken me to the side in the past and have said real nice things to me (of course you don’t expect someone to say bad things in your face unless you provoke them which I don’t). Of course, compared to some of my peers who have much higher grades it feels a bit weird sometimes. I’ve been told constantly by teachers going back to middle school these kind of nice things, and how I’m different from other kids my age. The weird thing is I’m not an overachiever by any stretch of the imagination. So I wonder if I’m just wasting potential here. I mean I know what my passion is (it’s technology and computers) but I feel sometimes as if I’m wasting my potential. I don’t even feel like going to grad school, and if I do it’ll be to make more money and nothing else (and yet at the same I don’t even obsess over money and have even helped out some members in my family with the little I’ve made). And I don’t write this to come off as arrogant. I just want to know whether I’m wasting my time and not seeing the point of an education or if this is normal for students?</p>
<p>My question is, who is paying for your education? If you are paying, it’s your dime, and if you don’t want to take advantage of the scholastic opportunities you have in school, then that’s your loss. But if you are there on your parent’s largesse, then I think you should talk to them about the fact that you are not getting the most out of your college experience, and perhaps you should transfer or take a year off. I’d want to know if I was paying for my child to warm a seat.</p>
<p>I’ve had ‘former’ employees who would do the minimum.</p>
<p>Work and classes are two completely different things. Not sure why you would equate the two. in fact because of my workstudy job, I’ve gotten about 4 part-time job offers PLUS 1 full time job offer. I turned down the fulltime job offer because it would limit the amount of credits I could take a year since it would be a university position, plus I want to graduate within 4 years. I’ve taken up the other two part-time job offers though. It’s been a big plus to my resume. And in fact went on an interview for an internship a couple of weeks ago, and the exact requirements and knowledge needed for the job I already had. The interviewer went as far as saying that I probably knew more than some of his fulltime employees though. At work, I go beyond the scope of what I can do sometimes. I’ve actually gotten in trouble at one of my jobs because of doing too much to help customers. Also, my parents and I help pay for school. And they know the grades I receive and everything that goes on in my education. Don’t have a thing to hide, it’s not like I’m doing bad in school. And the one time I did mess up, which happened in high school I explained to my parents the situation. I mean I know college is supposed to be getting an education, but I mainly view it as something to add to my resume so that I get an edge over the person who doesn’t have that degree. I’ve seen too many times what can happen when you don’t have a college degree in my family.</p>
<p>You sound cynical and disillusioned to me, as if you are merely jumping through what you believe to be the necessary hoops. It seems to me that many find themselves in a similar position in their 40’s or 50’s after decades spent in unfulfulling jobs; why you would be satisfied to subsist this way in college is beyond me. If you know you have a passion for technology and computers, and you are pursuing a degree that does not support that passion, it’s plain to me that you are squandering potential, you know it, and you know you should do something about it. If you’re looking for support for changing majors well into your college career with the aim of finding satisfaction in your future, I say do it.</p>
<p>In a lot of ways you sound like me -
I took very few notes in my classes, often didn’t finish the reading, rarely reviewed the notes that I did take, etc.</p>
<p>One thing that is different about us, though, is that for me I did the minimum required for two things:
- To get As
and 2. To learn what I wanted to learn.</p>
<p>I might be wrong, but to me it sounds like you have three issues going on that make what you’re doing feel wrong, where as I did similar things and felt fine, even good about it.</p>
<ol>
<li><p>You are worried that your current standard of good enough grades might actually not be good enough. It depends what you want to do. I wanted to go to med school. Bs would not be sufficient. You need to figure out if your current grades are going to get you where you want to go. If yes, then getting better grades can’t be the reason to change you behavior.</p></li>
<li><p>You are worried that you aren’t taking advantage of the educational opportunities that you are being given. There’s a difference between what I did, which was skipping required reading that I didn’t care about, and what you’re doing, which is avoiding subjects that you are interested in because you don’t want to do the work. This to me should be your biggest concern - why don’t you want to take classes in areas that interest you? Doing work for things that you really are interested in generally doesn’t seem like work. Maybe you just haven’t really found what fascinates you yet?</p></li>
<li><p>You are worried about what others might think of your study habits. This, i think is something that you should not worry about too much, if you are learning what you want to learn and getting the grades that you need. I certainly had my share of incredulousness from my friends and professors, but I got over it when I came to terms with the fact that I learned more and better and enjoyed myself more when I wasn’t taking notes. If you don’t learn that way, it’s OK! People learn differently.</p></li>
</ol>
<p>Anyway, sometimes good enough IS good enough. and sometimes not. Only you can make that call.</p>
<p>Work ethic in work and school are similar - I’m not sure why you wouldn’t equate the two. I made my statement because the same lack of a work ethic can happen on the job. Some people will do just the minimum they need to do to get by. I’m saying that this eventually gets noticed by their management and they usually aren’t the employees who’ll excel. They’ll usually end up getting fired or layed off. </p>
<p>It’s great if you have a good work ethic while on the job even though according to you, you don’t have it at school. What are you majoring in at college? Maybe you’re just taking the wrong major or are taking too many classes that don’t interest you. You say your passion is technology and computers so are you a computer science or engineering major?</p>
<p>I am a Management Information and Communications Systems major (MICS for short). I love my MICS classes. Taking two of them right now. It’s the liberal arts and business classes I hate for the most part with the exception of one or two professors who know how to engage their students. Since I’m in the business school, I have to go through a liberal arts core and a business core. Neither works for me because I already know what I want to do as far as my career goes. I have to take 5 classes per semester, basic requirement for all students in the business school. So yea, the major isn’t the issue. It’s the non-major classes. But then sometimes I hear such good compelling arguments for a well-rounded education and it makes me wonder whether or not it’s a waste to focus all my efforts in one specific field. For example, I remember taking biology in high school and enjoying it. Same for some global history and american history. I’ve always enjoyed math. English has been ehh, but some papers are easy and fun to write. However I hear about some of the professors for certain classes (usually for the more advanced courses) only a few professors, sometimes only one professor, will teach that class and they have insane requirements for their class which leave me thinking, all that work for something I’m not going to use in my career? So I’m sort of split in that regard on what to do. I guess that would fall inline more with the second point jenskate1 made. I’ve never been too overly concerned with grades because I’ve always felt that it’s just a number and not representative of the knowledge you’ve gained from the class. Plus after you’ve gained enough experience in a field, how relevant is the GPA going to really be to future employers? (I have heard of stories of people with 30+ yrs of work experience having rare experiences where the interviewer will request a transcript from college which I think is more of an exception than the norm with that much work experience.)</p>
<p>Well, in college one generally has to take some courses they may not be enamored with. You have to just grin and bear it and try to apply yourself even if the subject matter’s not your thing. Sometimes you get surprised and find something interesting you thought wouldn’t be (and vice versa sometimes). Most technical majors at top colleges will require a certain amount of humanities and general science courses. </p>
<p>From the classes you’ve enjoyed in HS it sounds like you should enjoy similar well-rounded classes in college. Maybe you can tweak the specific courses you take to some that might be more interesting to you.</p>
<p>Regarding English classes, I can empathize with you but don’t think that the skills you learn in writing papers will be for naught. I can tell you that strong written skills will help you and can help distinguish you from others in your career including in the technical and computer fields. Challenge yourself to do well grammatically and write with a strong vocabulary and realize it’ll help you in the long run even if the particular subject you’re writing about seems irrelevant. Think of it as exercise or training. </p>
<p>It’s true that after a certain number of years in the field the GPA become less important to not important at all since it’s the recent work experience that’s more important. The GPA does help with getting internships, first jobs, and entrance to grad schools though.</p>
<p>Your college habits will carry over to your future work. You get more out of college when you put more in- you are paying for the full education, why spend your months only getting part of what is offered? The readings are assigned for a reason, the lectures may only highlight them- wouldn’t you rather evaluate them than take a predigested version? You may find you agree/disagree with the professors’ takes on them. You will also have a much firmer foundation of knowledge if you capture as much information now as you can. Put forth the effort, school is your job- your full time job- at this time of your life. You will not always do as well as some others, but you want to do as well as YOU are capable of. You won’t regret knowing more, but you may regret it later if you remember there was something you were exposed to that you ignored in college and someone else has an advantage over you because of it. I especially like all the employment statements- you are creating the person you will be in the future- will it be the just get by, or the as successful as you want to be one?</p>
<p>Our very knowlegeable GC tells us that college admissions people prefer students who challenge themselves, even struggling a bit (within reason) with honors and APs, rather than those who take the easier way out and get all A’s in regular classes. Maybe it’s an idication that the student will be able to not only handle the college workload but also make the most of it.</p>
<p>Well, the parents and others who have weighed in so far may be right. You may be exhibiting a poor work ethic in school which will characterize you in the workplace.</p>
<p>But I think I <em>may</em> be seeing something different. I emphasize <em>may</em> because I’d need to hear more from you to feel I might be right. I see your thoughts a little bit more like jenskate sees them than others who have posted. But my slant is a bit different from hers (I think she makes some very valid points, worth your contemplating).</p>
<p>Academics are not for everyone. Some highly successful people did not do well in school. Some did not finish college. Need I even mention Bill Gates?</p>
<p>So, if you are motivated by some things, you are motivated and do well in your fields of interest, it may be fine to do just enough to get by in other fields - especially when your definition of “get by” is to get at least B’s in classes. Those are perfectly acceptable grades. </p>
<p>To me, it depends on the reasons and other activities in your life which are inspiring you go just get by. If you wish to devote only the necessary time (and not one minute more) to classes of only mild interest to you, because you are spending your time productively elsewhere, I don’t see a problem. If OTOH, you are spending that saved time in a depressed state, doing nothing, doing unproductive or counterproductive things (gaming/gambling/substance addictions…), I do see a problem.</p>
<p>When I went to Stanford Business school, we were graded Pass/Fail in every single course. However, they had gradations of “Pass.” Honors Pass, Pass +, Pass, Pass-. One of the Orientation speakers told us that if we were getting any more than “Pass,” we were spending too much time on classwork. That there were other things to do in life besides study to get top grades. Many might disagree with that, but I thought there was an important kernel of truth in there.</p>
<p>Caveat: in your career and in your life, there will always be things you need to do which don’t thrill you, are not too interesting and do not float your boat. You still have to do them. And sometimes you need to do them well. Other times you can do just enough to get by. I wouldn’t want you to think you can always slough off the drudgery or only need to put your energies into things which thrill you.</p>
<p>Everyone has only one life to live. By settling for mediocrity, you are only shortchanging yourself. But academics are only one aspect of life. I hope that there are other meaningful areas of your life where you pursue excellence.</p>
<p>wis75, the reason I don’t read the textbooks is because what we get tested on isn’t even on the textbooks. If it were then yes I would be reading the textbooks. However most textbooks aren’t very helpful at all. In my two years so far I can say I’ve really needed a textbook in my Math classes (because of hw problems given from textbook) and my accounting classes (because the professors tend to complicate accounting more than needed). There was even one class I took in which the professor straight out said that I should not even bother getting the textbook assigned. The only reason he had one was because that’s what was required by all professors (to assign a book). And there’s plenty of times I’ve disagreed with professors. I make it a habit to let them know AFTER class is done (not after the semester, but rather after the actual class period finishes). And from there we delve into conversations on different areas of whatever the subject material.</p>
<p>As for the comments regarding future jobs and my major, like I said, when it comes to my major classes I take them very seriously and do the best I can because it’s interesting to me. And when I’m working I stand out more so than any of the other student workers. I explained this earlier. I’m not sure why people keep saying I’m just going to do whatever I have to in order to just get by at work. My attitude towards work as never been like that because I love what I do for work. So exactly what is it that you guys mean by these comments on my attitude towards school that will affect my working habits at a job I enjoy? I mean it certainly hasn’t affected me in my jobs thus far.</p>
<p>lspf72, I took APs and honors classes in high school for that very reason. Colleges like looking at them. I excelled at them for what it’s worth.</p>
<p>jmmom: If my poor work ethic in school characterizes what I do in the workplace, why has that not happened in my jobs?</p>
<p>It is true academics are not for everything. Personally I wish I weren’t in school. But I need that college degree because that’s how you get by in this society. Though soon enough my college degree may not even be worth much in which I may consider going to grad school after a couple of years of working. By the way, Bill Gates is the man 
. My field of interest motivates me unlike any other subject I’ve ever taken.</p>
<p>As for your other questions, socially I don’t do much. I work and go to class and spend time with my family on weekends. Not doing much socially is a whole other issue which I rather not get into here because I know the comments I’ll get in regards to that and those are just problems I’m trying to work out. However I am not doing anything counterproductive. I know plenty of people who do but I don’t fall into any of that (games, drugs, drinking, gambling, partying). Life right now is very simple which works for me. No risks involved. Everything is measured accordingly.</p>
<p>As for the last comments, there in fact have been things at my jobs which I’ve had to do which I don’t like but I do them, and I do them as best as I can. For example, one thing I hate doing at one of my jobs is setting up computers for users because it involves moving equipment and configuring computers for the users. However when I go to these setups I make sure the user has everything working and make sure they are setup right. I know other co-workers who will just setup computers and do a very sloppy job at the configuration process (these are full-time workers). Work for me, isn’t something I slack off in. I make sure to help others out when they need help with their work. And when there is nothing to do I make sure to ask to see that there isn’t anything my managers need me to do.</p>
<p>I think you are fine, BP, based on further elaborations you’ve made here… as long as you think you are fine.</p>
<p>And I either misspoke or you misunderstood me, I don’t necessarily think that your current feelings about school work will translate into a poor work ethic in the work place. Poor work ethic in school <em>could</em> be a sign that someone will have the same issue in other venues, but it ain’t necessarily so.</p>
<p>And my take, from what you said, is that it ain’t necessarily so for you. So, if you feel comfortable with your current approach (not really engaging with many of your courses); and you are happy enough with the B-type grades; and you are really excelling at and enjoying your jobs (which it sounds like you are); and profs react well to you and your contributions inside and outside the classroom (which it sounds like they do)… then, I think you have a pretty good thing going in how you are prioritizing your efforts.</p>