<p>I am interested in pursuing the joint PhD/JD program at Harvard University. My question comes about by way of my background:</p>
<p>I’m currently an undergraduate History major returning to school after a successful career in the performing arts. I was accepted to private schools in the Boston area but I am not willing to put myself in serious debt as I’m considering graduate/law school (where I will no doubt incur tremendous debt). I made the fiscally responsible decision to attend the University of Massachusetts Boston; however, having spoken to members of the history department at UMass (many of whom are Ivy League Grads), my hope to attend has diminished. </p>
<p>Summing up the Faculty’s position, they said: It’s unlikely… near impossible for me to get in to Harvard because of UMass Boston’s reputation in the area.
As it turns out, my fiscally responsible decision may have been the irresponsible academic decision.</p>
<p>I understand their position but I’m hesitant to believe it. It’s not that I don’t appreciate their advice but these are guys who got their PhDs back when the Ivy League was the “old boys club”. Despite attending a public school, I think I can still make it. I’ll give my numbers below and see what you guys think. What’re my chances of getting in to Harvard’s joint PhD/JD program OR either program individually? Thanks:</p>
<p>GPA: 4.0
LSAT: Practicing in the 170 range
GRE: Prepping for it.
Language skills: Some Japanese, 3 years of Latin, working on French and Spanish
EC: Intern with a State Senator
-Guest artist with many Ballet Companies in the US
Experience:
-Former professional dancer
-Instructor/Competition Coach</p>
<p>PhD programs really aren’t about numbers (law school is). And the name of the university is often less important to the power of the degree than the names of the particular professors who mentored you. Professors currently working in your field are the best experts about what it takes to get accepted to top PhD programs in that field.</p>
<p>I had one high school friend who did the JD/PhD program at Harvard. He’s a tax professor at a third-tier law school. I’m not certain what the PhD did for him, other than produce personal satisfaction.</p>
<p>I know a bunch of people who got their JDs and PhDs separately. Mostly, they got their PhD first, and then went to law school, or they went to law school when they were ABD and finished their dissertations during/after law school. But I know one guy who practiced law for a few years then went into a PhD program (and continued to work as a lawyer part-time while he was doing it). Many of them taught law school for a while, or permanently, but for the most part their PhDs had fairly little to do with their ability to get the law teaching job. In some cases it did, though, and it may have helped one become a university president (although there are lots of JD-only university presidents). The flashiest of them – Harvard PhD/Stanford JD, Cal Tech PhD/Stanford JD x 2 – never went into teaching at all, and their PhDs themselves (as opposed to their command of the fields in which they got PhDs) have had nothing to do with their post-JD careers.</p>
<p>Joint degree programs sound great, but I don’t know what enormous benefit they provide, unless you can get funding for law school tuition (which is a little hard to believe). In any event, if you don’t get accepted into the Harvard joint program, and you have your heart set on a JD/PhD, you should pursue the PhD first, and then go to law school. The PhD (or ABD), especially from a good program, will help immensely with top law school acceptance.</p>
<p>Teaching is my ultimate goal, maybe school administration. As for a joint program…</p>
<p>For me the appeal exists in constitutional law/constitutional history. I was planning on studying constitutional law with the hope of teaching it in a law school. I’ve come to realize that my interest in law is purely academic. To put some merit behind that interest, a PhD seemed like a solid idea. Really, my heart is not entirely set on the joint program, it’s more of an option.</p>
<p>The better question to ask is:</p>
<p>Provided my numbers stay the same and my academic work is stellar… …coming from UMass Boston, do I have any chance of getting in to HLS or their PhD program OR both?</p>
<p>I’m very resistant to the idea that because I go to UMass Boston I have some how made the uphill climb to the Ivy League schools harder…</p>
<p>If this does indeed hurt my chances, I’ve thought about pursuing a higher degree, at a more reputable instituion, before applying to law school.</p>
<p>PhD – it’s all about work you have done, having faculty sponsors who know people, and finding the professors you want to work with. It’s a mistake to set your mind on “Harvard”. You should be looking at what people are strong in the areas you care about, and pursuing whatever institutions they teach at. Your major GPA may matter some.</p>
<p>Law – 170 LSAT is good, but it’s kind of the bottom of the range for top schools. A couple of extra points would go a long way. Obviously a 4.0 is very nice, but it’s going to get discounted for UMass-Boston. You really need recommenders who say you are an extraordinary, once-in-a-lifetime student, and some more accomplishments, and some luck. The dance part will help you, maybe a lot.</p>
<p>My instinct is that you should forget about applying to the Harvard JD-PhD program, which is a little bit of an immature goal. Instead, get into the best PhD program you can, and in a few years decide whether to go to law school. Your law school application will look much stronger, and a good legal historian’s recommendation will go a long way.</p>
<p>Contrary to JHS, I know some Ph.D/JD who have gone into teaching, though others have not.
I do not think that any non-academic activity that is not directly relevant to the proposed course of study is going to help an applicant.
What will help:
preparation for the proposed field of study, including languages. If an applicant wants to study the history of a particular country, say, Japan, having lived in that country will be a plus; if a student wants to do legal history, some exposure to legal work would similarly help. Bear in mind that students will be required to pass General Exams before being allowed to start on their dissertation. Different programs have different requirements for the Generals.
recommendations. Professors’ recommendations carry a lot of weight in graduate applications.
statement of purpose. This may be the single most important piece.
writing sample. More and more graduate programs seem to require them.
I know of at least two cases of students admitted from a college no one had heard of at Harvard before. But the statement of purpose and profs’ recs truly impressed the admission committee. One of the students did a Ph.D./JD and has not gone into teaching.</p>
<p>I don’t know about the JD program but at graduate programs such as Harvard’s, students are guaranteed tuition plus a stipend for a certain number of years. This usually includes some teaching (being a Teaching Assistant).</p>
<p>How is this contrary to JHS? I said that most of the JD/PhDs I knew had gone into teaching, either for a while or permanently, and that while I thought the PhDs had little to do with getting the people academic jobs, in some cases they clearly did. I merely noted the anomaly that three of the people I knew with the best combination of prestigious credentials did NOT go into teaching, and in fact did not use their PhDs much in their legal careers. (I should have phrased it more carefully, though, since there are counterexamples.)</p>
<p>I should, in turn, have phrased it more carefully. I know some Ph.D./J.D. who have gone into teaching legal history as opposed to law. In other words, the Ph.D. was the principal degree; the J.D. is icing on the cake.</p>
<p>Hmmmm. Given the salary-scale difference between law schools and arts-and-sciences faculties, and the fact that lots of legal historians teach in law schools, with or without PhDs, it surprises me that there are JD/PhD legal historians teaching OUTSIDE of law schools (or outside of joint appointments).</p>
<p>Maybe they do have joint appointments. I don’t know. Of course, I don’t know many! I do know a couple of people who ditched their high-paying Wall Street jobs to go for a Ph.D. in one of the over-subscribed fields!</p>