<p>I am brand new to this forum and realize that this topic must have been discussed sometime in the past. As I lurk around this board and look at the “chances” posts it is apparent that my son (JR in HS) is lacking in EC’s compared to most posters. This is due to the fact that his passion is swimming and he is a year round swimmer. This means he is up at 5:00AM and in the pool by 6:00AM. In season he also swims right after school and does his homework at night, out of season he swims at night and does his homework right after school. How will this EC deficit be viewed by the Adcom’s? He is bright, articulate, extroverted and generally well rounded, he just does not have a lot of free time for other activities. He is also a good student 3.8 GPA top 15% of class in a good school.</p>
<p>Also I expect that he will be recruited by Mid-Major DI schools and at the DIII level although because he is just a Junior this has not really started yet. Will the coaches advocate for him with the Adcom’s? Will his swimming ability allow him to get into schools that he would not get into based on his academic record alone? How does this typically work? What is the relationship between athletics and admissions at most schools? Is this different for DI vs DIII? Again this is a swimmer not a FB or BB player. Appreciate any information, we are new to this process.</p>
<p>This was exactly my position last year swpdad, except with tennis instead of swimming. I still had a couple of ECs but did not do anything extraordinary because i trained 20+ hours a week, traveled to tournaments on weekends, and spent all summer at a training facility.
I was really worried after coming on here that this would affect my college admissions when I saw other people’s incredibly stellar stats. However, when your son fills out college apps there will be places to put all his swimming stuff. I could have easily filled out all of the commonapp EC spots with club teams, summer programs, etc.
I was in a slightly different position in that I decided I would probably not enjoy myself playing D1 athletics. However, I made this decision AFTER speaking to many coaches so I have a pretty good idea of how that stuff works anyway. Basically, if your son is being recruited by a coach then it will be much easier to get into the school. His grades and sats will still obviously have to be somewhat close to the school’s range, especially with the smaller top schools, but he should not have a problem.
The big difference between D1 and D3 athletics is simply the money. D1 can usually give athletic scholarships and D3 can’t typically. What you’ll find, however, is that D3 schools can give “merit” scholarships which are basically athletic scholarships disguised as academic. Coaches are typically open about these as well.
I have found that in general, as a tennis player, my recruiting experience has not been too much different than that of friends for soccer and football. There is generally much less money available for scholarships for sports such as tennis and swimming, but its still out there.</p>
<p>Hope i could be of some help, sorry its all jumbled up but if you have any more questions definitely ask</p>
<p>My D is a recruited athlete now, having spent 2 plus hours per day on varsity teams, almost year round for 4 years. No one has questioned her lack of EC’s. She has some volunteer work (80 hours per year) mainly completed in blocks during the summer, and leadership, but primarily in her sport, and some academic clubs. She also took advanced courses in 9th and 10th, 3 AP’s last year and 6 this year. </p>
<p>It seems to be understood by coaches and admissions people at even very selective schools, that to maintain a high GPA in hard classes and stay competitive at a state or national level in a sport is a major accomplishment in itself. Anything else is icing on the cake. </p>
<p>If I had to give advice, it would be for your son to take a leadership role on the team and/or in an academic club this spring or for next year (Captain of team would be best), and to keep his GPA as high as possible. Trying to pick up some other ECs just for the brag sheet is probably not necessary and will just cause stress. Others may disagree…</p>
<p>And to answer your question about recruiting, yes coaches can help your son in admissions, but this varies a lot between schools, and how your son fits on the team. I’ve asked that question point blank, and coaches are prepared to answer you, once they have your child’s academic and athletic record. You can email any coach at any time and ask questions. They, however, cannot contact your son until next July 1st. Check the ncaa website for lots of details on rules, eligibility, and so on. Also, hopefully, one of your son’s coaches has a clue about college recruiting. Buy him a cup of coffee.</p>
<p>The message I keep hearing is that admissions officers would rather see a passion or two, than a laundry list of puffy clubs where the student attended sporadically, just to expand the length of the list.</p>
<p>It’s always important to focus on one’s strength area, and not try to be anyone else. A developed passion for swimming can also make quite an interesting essay, or be a good short-answer to a question on the Common Application, if he can get beyond the obvious theme of competition. </p>
<p>Ask him this year to begin to observe some atmospheric reasons he enjoys it, which might include the way the world feels at 5 a.m., the individual body development and teamwork, a favorite person he encounters daily at the pool (if they converse) and so on. </p>
<p>You might also ask him, since he’s just a junior now, if he wants to try to do something on a Saturday or Sunday morning in the community. An EC can occur outside of school, too, whether it’s a church youth group, tutoring kids on Saturday mornings, helping at a museum, anything he might find interesting outside of the school building. Even if he just does something one hour weekly for an entire year, he can list this as “volunteer/community service” which is an EC, just not school-based. If he MUST have water to be happy, perhaps there’s a YMCA with swim programs for kids, elderly or the disabled in the community. </p>
<p>You don’t “have” to do this, but if you’re concerned, just consider adding on a once-a-weekend community activity, Sat or Sun.</p>
<p>swpdad, welcome and relax! An athlete with strong academic credentials will have plenty of options, even if his sport is his only serious EC. There are so many parents and students on this board who can counsel you much better than I can, but I want to assure you and your son that he doesn’t need to invent any more stress for himself during the school year. A varsity sport plus a rigorous academic schedule will do the trick.</p>
<p>The summer between Junior and Senior year would be a good opportunity to diversity his resume. It doesn’t have to be fancy: Don’t underestimate the value of an old-fashioned summer job or basic community service as Paying recommends. Good luck and let us know how he does.</p>
<p>I just attended our school’s college athlete night with counselors, admission reps, private counselors for athletes(!) and college coaches. What I took away from the meeting was:
Your child can contact any coach at any time. Start now!
Go to college website and fill in the D1-D3 info for coaches
Collect some official times and tapes and send them
Make it easy for college coaches to see you in action. Attend some “elite” sports camps this summer. Coaches will be there -after July 1st.</p>
<p>That “lack of ECs” - I 'm sure your son can fill up pages with awards, state meets. p3t’s advice - as always - is great and it sounds like a fun thing to do.</p>
<p>swpdad, My DD was until April, a year round swimmer also, 20+/hrs a week. She was concerned early on in HS about not having time for other EC’s. She joined just a few clubs that she had real interest in, and that generally had meetings before school. She has stuck with those few and gotten leadership positions in them throughout the years. When looking at her college apps, I was initially thinking they would look sparse, but I’m sure when adcoms look at number of hours she did swim, they will know that she was not just “sitting around” and did pursue just a few other things and stuck with them. What schools is your S thinking about? My brother was a heavily recruited Division I swimmer years ago, and had endless opportunities offered to him. Good luck to your son.</p>
<p>My kids’ main EC is sports; their guidance counselor said colleges will understand that sports take up several hours each weekday and many weekends, so they shouldn’t stress too much about lack of other EC’s. I think too many kids have a really really long list of clubs they’ve been in and they obviously can’t have been intensely involved with each one.</p>
<p>If your son is being recruited, then I don’t think the lack of other EC’s will make much difference. If he has both the athletic abilities that college coaches want as well as academic credentials that make those admissions dept’s happy, then he’s pretty valuable to those schools. I agree with previous posters - start the process early. Our son is a hs senior currently being recruited athletically. We didn’t realize he had the potential to be recruited by the Ivey’s athletically, but he’s had significant interest and several official visits. Close to making a final decision now. We didn’t initiate contact with the coaches until August before his senior year. If I’d realized his athletic stats would be of significant interest to those coaches, we would have contacted them earlier, giving us a little more time to sort through the possibilities.</p>
<p>In your son’s case, lack of other ECs isn’t going to be important. Being on the coaches list will be. It is important to look at schools where the swim program is strong, the coaches have clout for recruiting. The top D-3 schools such as Kenyon, Johns Hopkins, Wash U, Emory, CMU often have stronger programs than weaker D-1 schools. If the school does not care much for the sport, there is less impact on admissions even being an athlete. Do start the process of getting to know the coaches, as you don’t want to enter the scene after the coach mentally has his first choice roster in place. </p>
<p>Though there can be money for swimming, many schools cut the scholarships into pieces which is permissable in this sport. So it is difficult to get a full ride unless you are really needed. You need to look at the rosters, see who has gaps in your son’s events and keep your ears and eyes open as to who else is looking. Most upper level swimmers know each other and keep that contact going. There is not as much athletic clout as in other sports for admissions, because swimmers tend to be a pretty smart bunch, and the sport does not figure that high in most colleges athletic picks. A lot of male programs have gone under in the past years.</p>
<p>swpdad, check his h.s. course offerings…do they offer a leadership class?
other possible ways to volunteer - special olympics, youth sports clinics, youth competitions, school clubs.</p>
<p>A 2400/4.0 student gets an “advantage” in admissions, and achieving those scores/grades was certainly “all about them - not others.” Should admissions be based only on the number of volunteer hours a hs student accumulates?</p>
<p>CGM, I can only speak for one sport and one child, but your assumption that a child who has 20+ hours of workouts/week doesn’t get to do other things. Student athlete’s who dedicate this much time have one thing in common, good time management skills. In my case, D always had time to socialize with friends, be active in clubs, attend Junior Classical League conventions, Hosa conventions, volunteer at local food bank, student government officer, and many many other things, oh, and maintain a stellar school record, full IB candidate, which includes LOTS of extra time for CAS hours etc, and had in addition 5 AP classes by end of Junior year for AP w/distinction. And yes, she is a happy well rounded kid. Sorry for the rambling, but this hit a nerve.
D did quit her 20+ at the end of April, she was going to Governor’s Honors for 6 weeks, and other factors, but she did it for years…with a very full life! So, am I sad, no, proud, yes!</p>
<p>Not from our HS. Swimming passionately got one senior into 2 Ivies. She did have some minor stuff, like member of a club. Her grades and SAT scores were solid but not top.
My D quit similar EC to your son after 10th grade because she is no longer passionate about the sport, despite spending an enormous time on it. She had a choice to join the junior varsity team. The GC did not like that she quit the team because they need people for that sport. But she is an average athlete and enjoy the social aspect of the sport but not the sport itself.
As long as your son can keep up his grade and he is still passionate about swimming. I’d say not to worry. Whenever, I read some of the EC list on the chances thread and I felt dizzy. I’ll bet you, adcom will feel the same.</p>
<p>[Want to clarify that my post #13 was in response to CGM’s pre-edited #12. I was responding to her statement that sports shouldn’t give a student an advantage in admissions because sports is “all about them - not others.” ] </p>
<p>CGM,
Your ignorance of the values, lessons learned, opportunities presented and benefit to kids and society of sports, is astounding.</p>
<p>WOW!!! Thank you all for the quick and valuable responses. I cannot believe the volume and quality of the information. Thanks again you have been most helpful!!!</p>
<p>swpdad - focus now on the swimming - as it’s a timed sport the coaches will be aware. My D’s best friend at Princeton is a recruited swimmer. She knew in the fall of her senior year that she could choose between Yale and Princeton. My son’s best friend - high school senior - is highly ranked in tennis in CA. She already knows where she is getting acceptances from Ivies LOL.</p>
<p>Now, being actually recruited, vs. getting a little interest, that’s a different story. There are many threads on the main parent’s forum about Likely Letters and NCAA etc. that will give some very good additional information. The best thing to do as I understand it - given that my kids are only recreational athletes but that I have friends with serious athlete kids - is to go to the websites of the universities and look at the swim team rosters.</p>
<p>Check the times in your son’s events. That will give you an idea of what it would take to be recruited, and what the different degrees of “recruited” will require in terms of times.</p>