Uptapped capacity that adds cost to the admissions office.
I can make the application cycle 6 months and get through it with mostly my existing admission counselor staff or put everything into 3 months and have to bring in contractors/temps to help.
1 Like
Some of the vitriol directed at the plaintiffs is surprising to me and seems unjustified. The claim is that ED is an anticompetitive practice contrary to law. That is not a ridiculous claim. It is also not ridiculous to point out that it tends to benefit affluent families who arenât price sensitive (indeed, one could argue that at some of these schools that is the entire purpose).
Itâs been pretty clear over the last few decades that competition in financial aid has had a significant effect on cost and access at many selective schools. Perhaps folks defending ED can explain why it isnât an anticompetitive practice or why, if it is, it is worth preserving despite the flaws.
1 Like
I havenât - and wonât - defend ED as a channel for admissions. I also wonât side with someone that was likely informed of the +âs and -âs of the application process, participated in that process and when the outcome wasnât what they desired, cried foul.
Thereâs 3k+ Colleges and Universities in the country. Just about every University that someone can point to, the folks on this forum can point to 5 others that are âjust like itâ.
Within the boundaries of the law (which I suppose is what this lawsuit is set to test) I support any private university that wants to set whatever application standard/process that they see fits their mission.
1 Like
But isnât the issue that those processes rest on agreements with other market actors to prevent competition?
I donât think anyone is suggesting these schools shouldnât be able to admit students early if they choose.
1 Like
How do you define âagreementsâ and âother market actorsâ?
ED asks for an applicant to commit to them and in exchange for that theyâll get preferential review/treatment within the application process. I canât come up with them off the top of my head but I know weâve had people suggest that at some schools ED doesnât even have a higher admit rate than EA.
Thereâs other areaâs in society where thereâs preferential treatment given to people that commit early. Though many of them those might not have the long-ranging impact of a college education.
The complaint deals with this starting in paragraph 105.
As far as preferential treatment for early commitment, thatâs not the issue. Enforcement by other institutions is the issue.
Schools like MIT, Stanford, Princeton use a form of non-binding early admission which allows students to apply RD everywhere else (even EA at some schools) and compare offers. That avoids some of the issues but not all, as these programs still contain restrictions that could be seen as anticompetitive. Still, itâs not hard to imagine these programs operating just fine by removing those restrictions.
Speaking of MIT, and back to the issue of cooperation, hereâs text from their description of their EA program:
âHowever, if you apply to another school during Early Action that does have a restriction, MIT requires that you respect those rules. So for example, if you apply to another school that is âsingle choiceââ meaning that you can only apply there during the early periodâyou may not simultaneously apply to MIT, and if youâre admitted somewhere âbinding,â then even if we admit you, you must go there instead. So choose wisely!â (Bold added for emphasis)
1 Like
Ok, everything you list about applies to REA - I might argue itâs more restrictive than ED but it doesnât have the commitment aspect ED has.
Iâm still not sure what the foundation of the lawsuit is. Iâm not a lawyer but what about is it they are suggesting breaks the law (and what law?).
They are claiming violations of antitrust laws. That body of law restricts agreements that restrain economic competition. See Sherman Act.
1 Like
Airline tickets, sometimes theater/concert tickets, hotel/rental properties to name a few.
4 Likes
Another example is MIT, which gives that as the reason for having EA and RD.
Other schools do rolling probably for the same reason.
UCs in California just have an early RD deadline, with no EA or ED, giving lots of time to read applications. CSUs have the same deadline, probably to keep things simple for applicants applying to both.
1 Like
Which is no different from applying EA to any other private college. MIT presumably puts that because applicants likely apply to other private schools that have ED or REA.
There are certainly a lot of folks here on CC who really dislike ED. But there are also plenty of students who welcome the chance to have the application process done in December. I was one of them - about 50 years ago - when most students applied to no more than 5 schools, each with its own application. Putting away the Smith-Corona and focusing on the rest of senior year without more essays or worry was incentive enough to proceed that way (and it avoided additional application fees, essays, and recs.)
Neither FP nor FA applicants get to see if someone else might give you a better price, but upfront, you know what the price is and accept it. As mentioned above, not unlike when you make many purchases.
For some students, the âearly noâ can be a signal to make some shifts in their application or list.
If you donât like it, donât do it, but there are many for whom this is indeed an option that works well for them. While this lawsuit isnât about the merits of ED, we often talk about that.
2 Likes
- I would guess that many people in this group are high earners looking for an advantage.
- Colleges are struggling. And for many outside of the top 20, ED is going to help keep the lights on.
- Birth rates started dropping in 2008, so ED is only going to become more important.
Overall, I think that this is an interesting lawsuit. But it also annoys me. When my older kids were looking at colleges we told them that we could pay X amount and they needed to look at schools where the NPC met that goal. And they did. Kid #3 graduates next year and we will follow the same path. Iâm sorry that these kids feel disappointed. But thatâs life. For most people, they buy the best thing that you can afford that meets their needs. Some people can buy whatever they want. It is what it is.
1 Like
I would feel better disposed towards ED if all colleges gave a financial aid and merit pre-read before the ED commitment.
5 Likes
You would just need colleges to stick by their NPC, or at least within a ballpark range. Require the submission of FAFSA application along with ED application, so that the numbers are available for both sides to see what the NPC shows.
For those that offer any merit, the merit pre read is a big part too, though.
4 Likes
Your point is that it is the collusion between schools which makes it illegal. Iâd agree that this is their best legal argument. The schools will likely argue that ED is voluntary, and that a small percentage of students choose that option.
If I were the plaintiff, Iâd also argue that there is no actual harm to the schools to justify the collusion. Turning down an ED offer has the same impact as turning down an EA or RD offer on the school. The non-binding schools also have this argument.
Do they not? I am probably naive here. S24 applied ED and they asked for FAFSA/CSS so they could disclose aid with offer. This was the FAFSA update year too; I think we just did CSS. He was deferred but it was my impression if admitted he would have had aid letter in Dec.
D26 applying ED to same school and I do expect to have her aid letter if she is admitted.
I really feel like this is a frivolous lawsuit . Having gone through this twice, itâs pretty clear what you are signing onto with ED, nobody is telling you that you have to do it (unless you have a counselor that maybe has secondary gain?), and I think collusion is a strong word. There has to be agreement for it to work, like some sort of strategic partnership.
I also do not believe they are denying need based aid in ED. Again, maybe Iâve been fooled. But if a school says they meet 100% need there are standardized ways thatâs measured. If families donât understand need v what they feel comfortable paying (or borrowing to pay) thatâs not on these schools.
5 Likes
That suggests collusion and even if thatâs happening (Iâm doubtful) itâs going to be a high hurdle to prove.
I donât see how that merit pre-read helps. Itâs not going to allow them to compare to anything from any other school (itâs going to be in Nov/Dec). The chief complaint about ED is that applicants didnât get to compare offers. They still wonât be able to.
And then weâre talking about a burden on the staff that simply isnât feasible. Everyone is going to want to submit for a pre-read to see if theyâll get merit before they bother to apply. The NPC should be sufficient. âIf youâre not able/willing to pay at least this much, donât apply EDâ.
2 Likes