<p>Interesting piece this morning by a computer science professor at Yale on the potential of internet-driven curriculum. It had me thinking perhaps a melding of the Charter/Internet models could work well wherein the Charters serve as physical locations with supervision, assistance with the technical stuff, recess, lunch, friends, etc but the real teaching is driven by truly excellent teachers and curriculum developers. I think this might work quite well actually.</p>
<p>When we finally left our public school system it was really the curriculum that drove us out. My son’s 8th grade “honors” English teacher was obsessed with Gone with the Wind and basically had the class spend the entire year on it, and not in an interesting sociological way but in an “Isn’t this GREAT literature???” way. I’m not kidding. Honors history class was an entire year on Black History, a great topic but that was it the entire year. This is because there was a large impoverished black population in the district and the school system was trying to show that they were “sensitive”. Science class was making posters about global warming and recycling. It was truly preposterous. </p>
<p>Yes, the high school in our public system would have offered some better teachers and better classes, no doubt. But by then we had just moved on.</p>
<p>Actually, those countries all provide a “right” to education for every student. </p>
<p>What they DON’T guarantee past their equivalent of 8th grade is the “right” to one leading to a university education unless the student concerned has demonstrated he/she meets the academic admissions/graduation standards of such institutions. </p>
<p>Moreover, such rights can be revoked if a student has demonstrated a pattern of extremely disruptive/violent behavior in the classroom and/or on campus. A reason why an older Japanese undergrad ended up completing his education from 7th grade to university here in the US.</p>
<p>My daughter had a pregnant girl in her 8th grade class and it actually served as a sobering life lesson.
Another young woman I know who had a baby at our school just married the father, six years later now that they have good jobs and all that. It’s not ideal, but some people do make it work out with family support.</p>
<p>But you see, that’s NOT a stretch. We as a country have direct statistical evidence (via longitudinal studies) that the most impoverished group of Americans who produce subsequently undereducated and impoverished children are the product of DROP OUT TEEN PREGNANCIES.
Not teen pregnancies overall – but predominantly THOSE WHO DROP OUT.</p>
<p>So ONE school in ONE town funded by public money that kicks out a pregnant student IS HIGHLY LIKELY to contribute to cyclic poverty within its own community.</p>
<p>I do not think this is an acceptable use of public funding – further fueling an already costly social problem. Nor is it humane. I’m just as blown away as other posters by the glamorization of teen pregnancy, which has a confluence of guilty parties – ranging from shoddy parenting, idiotic media messaging/content and over-sexualization of children to rebellion against overly-strident disciplinarian (not to mention a society that leaves SO many teens unsupervised.) However, the solution to these problems is not to exacerbate consequences for the young after the horse is out of the barn. It’s to give them the tools to survive and participate productively in society.</p>
Anything could be said to “contribute” to anything else. It’s a stretch and isn’t meaningful at all.</p>
<p>Frankly, I think programs that support pregnant teenagers in their specific needs are far better choices than generic public schools that aren’t equipped to meet their needs. And, yes, I would absolutely support public funds for that.</p>
<p>My belief with regard to education is that one size doesn’t fit all and we shouldn’t expect all schools to be the same as every other. I think it’s perfectly fine to have support for a pregnant teen, for a gifted teen, for the needs of boys. It’s when a kid can’t be contorted into the educational round hole that he or she is lost. I also support public boarding schools. Because sometimes that’s the only way.</p>
<p>I’m appalled anyone would use “Gone with the Wind” to show “sensitivity”, seeing as it glamorizes the KKK, has vicious little vignettes about how inferior black people are, and constantly refers to black people as “darkies.” I was dumbfounded by how racist it was. Never seen the movie, but I hope it was better.</p>
And. if you are really lucky and pregnant and a teen you can appear on a cable tv reality show! Go USA!</p>
<p>We have taught our D the exact same thing. And, we have taught S to never, ever, yes - never…leave the responsibility for pregnancy prevention up to the sole discretion of the young lady. Not until you are willing and able to follow thru with all the consequences.</p>
<p>
Glad you did! The other poster could have just stopped reading.</p>
<p>OK. That’s the general understanding I have. Does anyone know if the international comparisons, say for math and science proficiency, take into account all children of the same age in every country compared so that the US average and the average in the other countries are comparing apples to apples?</p>
<p>Or is what is being compared the average abilities of the university tracked foreign students and our “average” Joe and Jane?</p>
<p>Up to 8th grade, they’re all on the same track from what I understand…with the exception of the minority of extremely disruptive/violent students. </p>
<p>In the case of the ROC(Taiwan), the math and science proficiency for all 8th graders would be higher on average considering they mandate math up to calculus and require bio/chem/physics courses with lab in the junior high curriculum. Mom was considered a remedial student there during the '50s because she didn’t get to calculus until her sophomore year at a remedial high school while her siblings all completed the standard junior high curriculum without issue. </p>
<p>Moreover, many vocational high schools also require good written communication and STEM skills. Certainly not places for academic laggards.</p>
<p>Despite claims by US apologists, the international tests such as PISA are inclusive. To keep it simple, a country such as Belgium (to stick to the theme I started) does not exclude students who are in vocational or technical tracks anymore than the United States would. </p>
<p>As a bit of trivia, a few years ago, John Stossel ran an experiment and compared the performance on a standardized test in a school in New Jersey with a school in Belgium. Critics howled and suggested it was unfair to compare a New Jersey public school with a private school in Belgium --even if the test would in Belgium’s third language. Scratching the surface, however, would have revealed that the school in Belgium was a sports school with a mission to prepare … athletes!</p>
<p>PS I expect some here to join the howling at the mere mention of the name John Stossel.
PPS For full disclosure, the education system in Belgium is not immune to problems and criticisms. With a very large number of immigrants and sons and daughters of immigrants, a growing problem of equality has arisen as the gap between higher performing schools (usually faith based schools in the Flemish side of the country) and the underperforming public schools in the capital Brussels (that has a population of 30 percent Muslim) and the Walloon side is growing deeper.</p>
<p>Regarding public money following schoolkids, that doesn’t happen in the ROC(Taiwan). Parents whose kids failed to attain admission to a public academic high school/vocational school or public universities…especially elite ones like NTU face a double whammy. </p>
<p>Not only did their kid(s) end up having to go to a much less prestigious choice if their choices are only private schools, they also have to pay a lot more for the dubious privilege while continuing to pay taxes to support the public institutions.</p>
<p>cobrat–interesting to me that you have a lot of information about ROC. My S after graduating from college had a dance performance contract there (Taipei) so he lived there for 6 months in 2011. He taught English to 5th graders at a language school to supplement his income.</p>
<p>He had several observations about the degree of creative thought he did or did not observe. Apparently being a student, even in 5th grade, is a serious undertaking in ROC.</p>
<p>We hosted a Japanese foreign exchange student while S was in HS (private). He constantly mentioned the difference in learning approach. Especially when asked to explain something/express an opinion in class. He said that was very un-Japanese.</p>
<p>I went to preschool and kindergarten in Taiwan. My mom says the main things she remembers about me in school there were 1) I was the only kid in the school who was not Taiwanese or Chinese, 2) I resisted clean hands check which apparently happened multiple times a day, and 3) I got in trouble a lot for not sitting still, staying in formation in the yard, lining up and staying put, etc. </p>
<p>This could say something about the regimented rules-based early Taiwanese education system, but it might have also been that she lied and said I was 4 when I was 2 1/2 so I could go to school :D</p>
<p>One of the serious downsides to the East Asian…or even the US system if you happened upon a no-nonsense authoritarian type teacher was that classes were basically a sit down, shut up, and take notes while teacher teaches/lectures/drones on for most/entire class period. </p>
<p>Moreover, any disruptions by student tended to get the student sent down to the dean at the very least/best. That was from my firsthand experiences as a first-grader in a Catholic school and as a 13 year old high school freshman going through an angry rebellious phase. HS dean got to know me very well during that first semester of HS. </p>
<p>Not helpful in encouraging creativity or learning how to speak, debate, and otherwise think on your feet. Then again, I’ve also heard that even attempting to debate/argue with the teacher in an East Asian classroom tended to result in severe disciplinary sanctions for being “disrespectful” and “disruptive” in class. Then again, I’ve had similar experiences with a few teachers in junior high/high school here in the US.</p>
<p>Here’s the piece out this morning that I personally think holds a concept that could have real traction in correcting the profound dysfunction in US public education. It uses the internet to amplify and fully utilize truly good teachers and could potentially use the Charter model to provide kids with family friendly neighborhood sites for socialization and supervision and tech support.</p>
<p>I’d just also like to express my sense that many on this thread defending the “system” have bright kids who won awards and did well in the system. The problem is that system is increasingly eclipsed by the systems in other countries and your darling children – like it or not – have to compete globally. I understand the appeal of having a “special kid” within a big, dysfunctional public school. Lots of awards, lots of “OMG, s/he is BRILLIANT” (especially if you’re baking cookies and being an “involved parent”, etc). But you really have to look beyond if you want to parent responsibly in this moment.</p>
<p>A ridiculous percentage of kids getting to college must take remedial coursework before they can do college coursework. A lot of these kids were 4.0 students in their high schools. It starts to undermine the meaning and the value of the high school degree, and perhaps quite soon the college degree. </p>
<p>Then there’s just the breathtaking stupidity of the population emerging from our schools. The lack of any understanding of our country’s history. The complete absence of basic grammar and mathematical competence. This is the generation we will depend upon to support us, to vote in good leaders, to lead their lives in a responsible manner consistent with our nation’s heritage?</p>
<p>Sure, families have eroded. Values are relative. Etc. But the single most glaring failing is in public k-12. It is staffed by an unacceptable percentage of truly stupid people with meaningless education degrees who are regurgitating meaningless curricula concocted at places like UC, Boulder where the education faculty is unlikely to be able to row a boat let alone orchestrate our kids’ education. </p>
<p>We’ve all been asleep on this issue. We’ve all trusted.</p>
<p>I think you forgot what web site you’re posting on. Remedial college courses?</p>
<p>I personally had a great public school education (until 9th grade) and so have my kids. None of us were “OMG you’re so amazing” kids compared to the others. Heck one of them didn’t make the top 50% of the class and still arrives at a competitive college with a near full ride and lots of AP credits.</p>
<p>I’d never refer to even one of the dedicated, caring, intelligent teachers I or my kids had as “stupid people with meaningless education degrees who are regurgitating meaningless curricula”. Well possibly one or two, out of the 40 or so.</p>
<p>Sorry your experience was apparently different.</p>