LSAT scores averaged?

[tempus]

<p>On LSAC it says your LSAT scores are averaged, but I read from another source (forgot where) that only your highest score is used now. Anyone know the true case?</p>

[sallyawp]

<p>At the end of the admissions season, LSAT scores reported by the law schools to LSAC using only the highest scores of its admitted students. However, not all law schools will use your highest LSAT scores in order to determine whether to admit you – in fact, the best information available at this time is that many, if not most, of the top law schools will average multiple LSAT scores. In the last year (at information sessions for potential applicants) several of the top law schools have stated that they still prefer to see applicants who have taken the LSAT no more than once, which best reflects how exams are administered in law school (one exam given at the end of the semester, which is the only grade a student receives all semester).</p>

<p>This topic was much discussed on this forum several months ago. I’m sure that a search would provide you with a lot of the information you seek.</p>

[drusba]

<p>Average was the rule for a long time and is slowly changing. The LSAC use to recommend averaging and the accrediting arm of the ABA required law schools to report their range and average LSAT scores on the basis of averaging any particular applicant’s LSAT’s. A little over a year ago, both those organizations changed their policies, the LSAC now recommends taking highest LSAT score and the ABA now requires reporting of scores by using highest. Those actions now provide an incentive for law schools to use highest LSAT score. Many now do so but many still have not made a change.</p>

[sallyawp]

<p>A few bits of current information from the websites of some top law schools:</p>

<ol>
<li> Harvard Law School:</li>
</ol>

<p>

Should I retake the LSAT? If you take the test more than once, all scores and their average will be reported and considered.

</p>

<ol>
<li> Georgetown Law School:</li>
</ol>

<p>

For reporting purposes, Georgetown adheres to the ABA policy of reporting the higher LSAT score. For evaluation purposes, the Georgetown Admissions Committee typically averages LSAT scores. Georgetown may consider the higher LSAT score if you have only taken the LSAT twice. Please address any mitigating circumstances you feel the Admissions Committee should consider.

</p>

<ol>
<li> Columbia Law School:</li>
</ol>

<p>

Even though the ABA requires that we report the highest LSAT score, the Committee considers the entire LSAT testing history when evaluating applications for admission. Published statistics for this and prior years were based on average LSAT scores.

</p>

<ol>
<li> NYU Law School:</li>
</ol>

<p>

If I take the LSAT more than once, does the Committee see the higher score?
Yes, but they evaluate based on the average score in most cases. The Committee may take special circumstances into account. If a candidate can point out specific reasons why the Committee should consider an LSAT score aberrant, they should detail those reasons in an addendum to the personal statement.

</p>

<ol>
<li> Penn Law School:</li>
</ol>

<p>

Q. If I take the LSAT more than once, does the Admissions Committee consider the average or the higher LSAT score?
If there are circumstances that you believe affected your performance on a prior test, we encourage you to provide an additional statement with your application explaining those circumstances. The Admissions Committee will consider such information and may, at its discretion, evaluate your application based on the higher or highest LSAT score.

</p>

<ol>
<li> U of Chicago Law School:</li>
</ol>

<p>

What if I took the LSAT more than once? We recognize that some students will take the LSAT more than once, perhaps because the first score was the product of unusual conditions or because it seemed low given earlier practice test scores. In keeping with recent changes in LSAC and ABA policies, we will focus on the higher of an applicant’s two scores. LSAC data suggest that the first score is an excellent predictor of a second score; applicants are thus advised to re-take the test only if there is reason to expect significant improvement. We certainly do not wish to encourage expenditures on repeat test taking.

</p>

<ol>
<li> U of Michigan Law School:</li>
</ol>

<p>

How does the University of Michigan Law School handle multiple LSAT scores?
The LSDAS report for an applicant who has sat for the LSAT more than once will show every score or cancellation, as well as the average score. The ABA requires law schools to report score information based on an admitted student’s highest score, and therefore, that is the score to which we give the most weight. We do, however, consider the average score as well, because data provided by the Law School Admissions Council suggests that it has the greatest predictive utility. If you have a significant disparity between scores (six or more points), it would be very helpful to address any explanation for the difference in an optional essay or addendum.

</p>

<ol>
<li> U of Virginia Law School:</li>
</ol>

<p>

What is your policy on multiple LSAT scores?
Multiple LSAT scores will be evaluated on a case-by-case basis. We do not automatically use the average, the highest, or the most recent score, but will evaluate any information provided by the applicant that may be relevant to the interpretation of test results, such as illness, testing conditions, or other extenuating circumstances. The recent change to the ABA rule regarding multiple test scores affects only how we report the LSAT score of an applicant who took the LSAT more than once. The old rule required that law schools report the average of multiple scores; the revised rule now asks law schools to report the higher of multiple scores. The ABA rule does not now, nor did it ever, tell law schools to rely on one score over another in making admissions decisions, but rather encourages schools to look comprehensively at all information presented in an application for admission. That practice has not changed.

</p>

<ol>
<li> Northwestern Law School:</li>
</ol>

<p>

All applicants are required to take the LSAT. The LSAT is administered in June, October, December, and February. Applicants may take the test more than once, but repetition is not advised unless some disruptive factor has interfered with performance during the first administration. If an applicant takes the LSAT more than once, the Admission Committee will consider all scores, the circumstances surrounding each test experience, and possible benefits resulting from prior exposure to the test. Test results are sent to the Law School by the Law School Admission Council. According to LSAC, scores are valid for five years after the test date.

</p>

<ol>
<li> Cornell Law School:</li>
</ol>

<p>

If I take the LSAT more than once, will you take the highest score or the average of the scores?
In general, Cornell Law’s policy is to take the higher score if it is at least 3 points higher than a prior score, but the Admissions Committee invites applicants to submit an addendum to their application explaining the different LSAT scores and why we should take the higher score.

</p>

<ol>
<li><p>Duke Law School - no comment made on website</p></li>
<li><p>Boalt - takes the highest (I’m sure someone can find the quote, if necessary)</p></li>
<li><p>Yale - no comment made on website, school still states that they use a holistic approach to admissions</p></li>
<li><p>Stanford - makes no comment on website</p></li>
</ol>

<p>Moreover, the takeaway seems to be that if you take the LSAT more than once, you had better have a good reason for doing so (102 degree fever, power outage at the testing location, death in the family, etc.) and you had better take some time to explain that reason in your application. Again, I emphasize that you should prepare for and go into the LSAT as if you are going to take the test once and only once. Having explanations for one thing or another on your application, instead of just having a strong application, diverts attention from your strengths and may lead to questions about your ability and/or your commitment. </p>

<p>The LSAC has repeatedly emphasized to law schools that your first LSAT is the test most likely to predict your success in law school, and I think that most of the top law schools are clearly keeping that advice in mind. You may take the LSAT more than once (in fact, up to three times in two years), but I believe that you do so to your detriment in admissions.</p>

[Insane_Membrane]

<p>Here’s a list of a list of a about 177 acredited law schools and they’re policy on lsat scores.</p>

<p><a href=“http://www.deloggio.com/academic/twolsat.htm[/url]”>http://www.deloggio.com/academic/twolsat.htm&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

[sallyawp]

<p>I think that if you compare what is stated on the deloggio website versus the actual stated policies of the T14 law schools, you will find in most cases that the deloggio website is either wrong or oversimplifies the approach of these law schools.</p>

[Insane_Membrane]

<p>how are they wrong? It succiently gives you an overview of the policy for each college. For example Cornell:</p>

<p>The website says:
10. Cornell Law School:</p>

<p>

If I take the LSAT more than once, will you take the highest score or the average of the scores?
In general, Cornell Law’s policy is to take the higher score if it is at least 3 points higher than a prior score, but the Admissions Committee invites applicants to submit an addendum to their application explaining the different LSAT scores and why we should take the higher score.

</p>

<p>Whereas dellogio says

School MultipleLSAT Scores notes
Cornell higher explain

</p>

<p>That seems about right, reading what Dellogio say, Cornell will take the higher of your lsat score if you explain the circumstances around it. Granted its slightly vague in this case, in the case of Duke its slightly more specific:</p>

<p>

School MultipleLSAT Scores notes
Duke average explain 5+

</p>

<p>Duke will normally average your score unless there is a 5 point difference, then you will need to submit an explanation like with cornell.</p>

<p>The data is only two years old and the site owners take responsiblity it any of it is incorrect,

That’s the latest word from 177 schools, as Suzy and I understand it.<br>
We take responsibility for all misstatements, misquotes, and misunderstandings.

I’d say thats pretty good overview of the law schools. Can tell me which law schools listed have an incorrect policy listed?</p>

[marny1]

<p>Found OUR College Confidential thread as a link on another Law school admission website. (Top-Law-Schools) so our info really does get around.</p>

<p>Wanted to bump it up as it is probably useful info to many people.
I also realize that alot of Law schools will be having Admission sessions during the next few weeks, so it may be a topic of discussion with Law School Admission folk- so if anyone has obtained updated info, please add to it.</p>

<p>D’s scores are good enough to let stand (top 5 %) but that is not going to get her into Columbia or NYU. She is really going to have to decide whether it’s worth the time and aggravation to take the test a second time. Looks like she may not apply until next year- so that makes it more bearable to take the test a second time- but it certainly is possible her score could go down–and that could cause more harm then good.</p>

<p>if anyone has thoughts on my kids “dilemma”, I’d appreciate some input-
(I’ll be away from my computer for a few days- so I’ll check this posting when I get back)</p>

[marny1]

<p>Sally- I also meant to Thank you for all the detailed info. It was so helpful. I spent some time trying to get this type of info- to no avail. (this thread was already “archieved” but I got the date from TLS website and was able to pull it back up)</p>

<p>The situation I described above may affect those students scoring between 165-169 Great scores and will get you into a top law school- but a point or two higher would certainly help alot. so at what point is it worth taking the test a 2nd time??</p>

<p>I am often amazed how much info we can get from one another.
Thanks again to everyone.
marny</p>

[bluedevilmike]

<p>1.) If GPA is very high or very low, that could be the tipping factor. A very high GPA means that she doesn’t want to risk a lower LSAT; a very low GPA would mean the LSAT really has to be spectacular, making a retake necessary.</p>

<p>2.) There are plenty of T14’s less selective than NYU and Columbia; but if the daughter’s set on NYC, then that narrows her choices a lot.</p>

<p>3.) Had she taken enough practice tests to know what her average over several exams would probably be? I know what mine was, and my one-time “sample” – the real LSAT – was about three points higher, so a retake would have been a very bad idea. If her average-score-over-several-exams-representing-her-probable-mean is higher than her one-time-sample-real-thing (henceforth ASOSERHPM and OTSRT), then the retake might just be worth it. If she’s already above her mean, and trying to get-lucky-and-score-even-more-above-her-probable-mean (GL&SEMAHPM), then it’s probably not advisable.</p>

[marny1]

<p>Hi BDMike- was away for a few days, so couldn’t Thank you for your input.</p>

<p>D thinks she’s gonna stick with her score. Her GPA is on the high side, so a 2nd LSAT score which could be lower than her current score could do more harm than good. I think she’s just planning to put in the extra effort and keep her GPA as high as she can. Her score was also in range with her practice tests, so there may not be much of a difference with a second test result.
Since we are a NY family, there is a certain assumption that she may stay in the NY area- so an acceptance from Columbia and NYU would be nice-- but an acceptance from Cornell or Fordham would be completely wonderful too. Luckily, I think she has a pretty good shot with those schools. </p>

<p>But who knows what will be next year-- last conversation I had with d, she mentioned checking out UCLA!</p>

[bluedevilmike]

<p>If the daughter’s willing to move to Ithaca, might she be willing to talk about schools like Penn and Georgetown? Even, possibly, Virginia and Duke? Still T14; still East Coast; easier to get into then Columbia and NYU.</p>

<p>EDIT: Pardon my earlier confusion. Cornell Med is in NYC directly, so I thought Cornell Law might be as well.</p>

[marny1]

<p>Thanks Mike- she’ll be looking at a whole range of schools and FYI Cornell Law is definitely on the Ithaca campus. I am sure she is going to consider most of the schools you mentioned above-- and will throw in a few other schools like Fordham- Boston- Vanderbilt etc to ensure she’ll have a few solid acceptances to choose from.
I am finding that as my d gets a bit closer to college graduation, she gets more “tentative” about her future plans and really doesn’t discuss it much. She is pretty sure she will be applying to Law School next year and will focus on it when she has to.<br>
Right now, I think she just wants to concentrate on enjoying her senior year and worry about law school applications next year.
Her LSAT’s and grades are pretty much a done deal. She’ll get her recomendations in the spring while she is still on campus. So much of the Law school application process wouldn’t begin until next summer. </p>

<p>Good luck to everyone going through the process.</p>

[marny1]

<p>bumping this up</p>

[Badatcomingupwithusername]

<p>Marny1-- I saw that your daughter might be interested in Cornell Law. I don’t know a whole lot about the law school, but I’m a current Cornell undergrad who also lives in the NY metro area. There are buses directly from Cornell to NYC, and the ride is about 5 hours (which really isn’t too bad at all–I just bring a book). </p>

<p>There also really is a lot to do in Ithaca, and the area is absolutely beautiful.</p>

[marny1]

<p>Bad- I just sent you a PM. Thanks for the info</p>