Manhattan mom sues $19K/yr. preschool for damaging daughter's Ivy League chances

[monydad]

<p>Concenedddadd:</p>

<p>In truth, it wouldn’t have mattered anyway, would it?? The money would not have been refunded if the contract did not require it, whether or not the seat is filled. If they can keep it contractually, they will, regardless of the equity of the situation or whether the place is ultimately filled anyway.</p>

<p>I’ve had some unfortunate personal experience in this regard, when we had to relocate for a job change, well before the start of D2s junior year of HS (but well after we’d paid her private school).</p>

[Illyria]

<p>

Taking the angle of ivy admissions out of the equation, preschool/kindergarten can be worthwhile if done the right way. And some can be better than others. It’s not unreasonable to be upset if you are paying 19K and your child is basically getting daycare.

</p>

<p>This just seems an appropriate opportunity to point out again that was not the child’s first year at the school. The child went to the school for the 2009-2010 school year. The parents chose to enroll her again at the school, then pulled her out after a month of her <em>second</em> year at the school.</p>

[midatlmom]

<p>I don’t believe that any private pre-school in NYC would publicly boast of prepping for the ERBs, since, even though it obviously occurs, it is frowned on to discuss that fact. In fact, the York Avenue Preschool website merely says the following:</p>

<p>

Confidence, ability to express themselves, in addition the knowledge of the alphabet and number correlations are all mastered in the Fours/Pre-K class. Our students have consistently tested well on the E.R.B, which is given on site, along with the Board of Education Gifted and Talented tests. We are very proud of our Kindergarten placement record and work closely with the ongoing school directors.

</p>

<p>I think that Mrs. Imprescia is going to find it difficult to sue if all the school did was state that its students do well on the test.</p>

[Pizzagirl]

<p>

So for those whom are pleased with how things worked out, why would you care how much others spent on their children’s education? Maybe you think it wasn’t worth the money, but they do feel it was worth the sacrifice. Or perhaps some unhappy people feel it wasn’t, but it was their money that was spent .But if you are happy with your children’s options, why be jealous of others and accuse them of being elitist?

</p>

<p>Very well said.<br>
My SIL/BIL spent beaucoup bucks on private school and got their son into a top 20 uni.
My H and I used public schools and our kids are going to a top 20 uni / top 20 LAC respectively. Why would I care that they chose to spend money I didn’t?</p>

[calmom]

<p>

“If one parent backs out after 2 weeks of school, the school has no one to fill that seat which 9 others could not get.”</p>

<p>Except for the waiting list…</p>

<p>If they do fill that slot, they will still keep the money.

</p>

<p>It’s standard contract law. The school has an obligation to try to mitigate its damages by seeking to fill the spot. Even though the contract is nonrefundable, if the spot is filled by another student, then the parent would likely be awarded a partial refund in a lawsuit. The calculation would go something like this:</p>

<p>$19,000

• prorated tuition for one month
• money school collected from replacement, waitlisted student

• costs incurred by school in finding replacement student
  = Amount of refund.</p>

<p>It’s not a “class action” and it would be next to impossible to make out a claim for fraud, given that the child had attended the preschool the previous year. </p>

<p>It doesn’t matter if the contract specified that 1 years’ tuition is “nonrefundable” – some clauses in contracts are simply not enforceable. I don’t know what NY law is on the subject, but as a general principal of contract law the ability to enforce that provision would fall under the analysis set forth above.</p>

<p>Lawyers do not take contract actions on a contingency basis, but charge an hourly rate for their services. The contract with the school may specify that the prevailing party is also entitled to an award of attorneys fees; if in fact that is the case, it would be in the school’s interest to settle by offering a partial refund in a reasonable amount.</p>

[starbright]

<p>I loved this article by Hoover in the Chronicle of Higher Ed:</p>

<p>

Lawsuit Suggestions for Ivy-Obsessed Parents
March 17, 2011, 2:07 pm</p>

<p>By Eric Hoover
In case you haven’t heard, the mother of a four-year-old girl has sued a pricey Manhattan preschool. Why? For harming her daughter’s chances of getting into an elite private school and, in turn, an Ivy League college. (Just to be clear: this happened in Manhattan, New York, and not Manhattan, Kansas.)</p>

<p>In the spirit of this mother’s courageous act, we’ve created a list of other possible lawsuits that the parents of budding geniuses might want to consider. After all, nobody should let tens of thousands of dollars stand between them and their stratospheric ambitions for little Johnny and Susie, who are destined for greatness (or business school), years of stunning achievements (or frantic nail-biting), and a lifetime of selfless actions (or selfish indifference to others).</p>

<p>Are you a concerned mom or dad who daydreams about sending your children to Harvard, Yale, Princeton, etc.? If so, you should think about suing:</p>

<p>• Your nannies/au pairs, for not speaking enough of Spanish/French/German around your children. If your child doesn’t know a second language by five, he or she will never get into a top college, after which knowledge of another language would be useless.</p>

<p>• Penguin Books, which publishes Colleges That Change Lives, a subversive text that could threaten your child’s future. It includes the libelous suggestion that a bunch of “no-name” colleges “will do at least as much, and usually far more than, any Ivy League clone, or a major research university to give you a rich, full life, and to make you a winner.”</p>

<p>• Your daughter’s health teacher, for promoting good nutrition. Just how in the world is your daughter supposed to become an award-winning dancer if she starts living on anything more than diet cola and half an apple each day?</p>

<p>• Your son’s football coach, for not allowing players to “spear” opponents with their helmets. Doesn’t he understand that you want Stanford’s scouts to see that your son tackles other players as hard as he tackles AP Chemistry?</p>

<p>• Your parents/in-laws, for not donating more (or any) money to the top-25 institution of your choice, thus depriving your child of a crucial “hook.” Don’t your child’s grandparents understand that they can’t take it with them?</p>

<p>• Your son or daughter’s college counselor, for any of the following: a) using cheap stationery in handwritten notes to admissions deans b) poor penmanship c) reluctance to disparage less-deserving students in your child’s school d) suggesting colleges other than ones you’ve heard of e) unwillingness to use his/her “charms” in pursuit of your desired admissions outcomes.</p>

<p>• Your family’s priest/minister/rabbi/imam, for suggesting to your children that there’s something more to life than worldly success. Pish posh!

</p>

[SisterVengeance]

<p>I remember when I read this at Jezebel. I laughed out loud so dang gone hard.</p>

<p>Really, you know what this mother sounds like to me? A over achiever mother who will
probably try to live through her daughter.</p>

<p>It’s sad if you ask me. The girl is in pre-school and age four at that. What’s wrong with her playing with kids half her age and learning about color and shapes? That’s apart of her development. That’s the kind of development that actually makes her smarter.</p>

<p>Not some exam question about how a reality television show impacts viewers…</p>

<p>Along with that, I really do feel sorry for this little girl. Her mother is going to be so dang gone hard on her for no reason. I understand we all want the best for our children and we want them to have the opportunities we never had but they are still their own individuals. They have to develop into THEIR own molding that they are wired for. </p>

<p>Not how mommy and daddy wanted to be growing up.</p>

<p>Besides, what if she grows up and she’s not, ahem, Harvard qualified? What if she decides she just wants to go to state school or community college and get some associate degree in office administration and be quite happy with it?</p>

<p>Who really gives a quack? Let the kid be a kid.</p>

[monydad]

<p>"It’s standard contract law. "</p>

<p>Maybe you’re a better lawyer than our lawyer, in our case she didn’t find any basis, other than asking for it, to get our money back.</p>

<p>…of course she was also busy with her new job, half way across the country…</p>

[mtnmomma]

<p>

In case you haven’t heard, the mother of a four-year-old girl has sued a pricey Manhattan preschool. Why? For harming her daughter’s chances of getting into an elite private school and, in turn, an Ivy League college.

</p>

<p>

My SIL/BIL spent beaucoup bucks on private school and got their son into a top 20 uni.My H and I used public schools and our kids are going to a top 20 uni / top 20 LAC respectively. Why would I care that they chose to spend money I didn’t?

</p>

<p>I don’t think the issue here is the amount of money spent but the stupidity of this woman to think that a preschool has an affect on her daughter being accepted to an Ivy League college.</p>

[Pizzagirl]

<p>

don’t think the issue here is the amount of money spent but the stupidity of this woman to think that a preschool has an affect on her daughter being accepted to an Ivy League college.

</p>

<p>It IS a different game in Manhattan than it is elsewhere, though, in terms of access to education.</p>

[mtnmomma]

<p>

You can let your genius sit at home and hope some day (s)he will bloom but I think the popular believe is that even geniuses get benefited by attending fine institutes of learning.
If that was not the case then the competition to get into HMSPY won’t be there.</p>

<p>The whole concept of having fine institutes of learning is to make geniuses succeed more reliably and efficiently.

</p>

<p>Someone drank a lot of kool-aid! POIH, come on, haven’t you figured out all the manipulation here? “Fine institutions” cost a lot of money…hmmm, I wonder if they need to make people believe that it is worth it!</p>

<p>To get into HMSPY you need to be smart (the kind you’re born with that is nurtured with hard work) and INTERESTNG! Do you really think all those cookie cutter kids from “fine institutions” are more interesting or taught to be more creative? </p>

<p>I’m not against great learning experiences at fine institutions, but if you think that is what will get a kid into HMSPY, I think you have been misguided.</p>

<p>I don’t know very many geniuses “sitting at home waiting to bloom”. Hahaha!</p>

[mtnmomma]

<p>

It IS a different game in Manhattan than it is elsewhere, though, in terms of access to education.

</p>

<p>Really? A parent can’t handle teaching their kid the ABC’s and basic addition skills? Then people in Manhattan must need a few parenting classes.</p>

<p>P.S. if their kids were HYPSM material, they would be teaching it to themselves by preppy-K.</p>

[LadyDianeski]

<p>*Your family’s priest/minister/rabbi/imam, for suggesting to your children that there’s something more to life than worldly success. Pish posh! *</p>

<p>LOL–perfect! Throughout this entire discussion, I’ve been thinking: Do people like this Manhattan Mama ever stop to consider that there might be just a BIT more to life than an Ivy education and subsequent career success? Er, what about the old-fashioned notion that getting into Heaven might be just a tad more important than getting into Harvard?</p>

<p>So much for any sense of transcendence…</p>

[LadyDianeski]

<p>Really? A parent can’t handle teaching their kid the ABC’s and basic addition skills? Then people in Manhattan must need a few parenting classes.</p>

<p>Thank you, mtnmomma! I attracted the ire of several posters when I suggested good old (FREE) home-schooling as an alternative. But, as you point out, how hard is it to teach ABCs and addition/subtraction? Parents have been doing that for centuries. It is not rocket science. If you feel you can’t handle the alphabet flash cards and phonics lessons yourself, simply use a DVD. Or a home-school canned program. Easy as pie. And a lot less expensive than any private preschool.</p>

<p>I know many home-school families, including several who would be considered economically disadvantaged, with little access to premium educational opportunities. All of these families managed to teach their pre-school kids basic alphabet and number concepts. Many of the kids learned to read before kindergarten. Go figure. :)</p>

[Pizzagirl]

<p>

It IS a different game in Manhattan than it is elsewhere, though, in terms of access to education. </p>

<p>Really? A parent can’t handle teaching their kid the ABC’s and basic addition skills? Then people in Manhattan must need a few parenting classes.

</p>

<p>Those are two different things. Of course any parent could handle teaching their kids ABC’s, etc. That doesn’t change the fact that Manhattan is different in terms of the access to education. Those of us in, say, the 'burbs don’t have to worry - you move to a decent school district, you put your kids in, over and done.</p>

[mtnmomma]

<p>

That doesn’t change the fact that Manhattan is different in terms of the access to education.

</p>

<p>So now parents have to “get their kids into the right pre-school?” Maybe the people in Manhattan need a reality check that this is RIDICULOUS! Maybe they should be spending all their time and $$ on changing the system, not being a slave to it.</p>

[mtnmomma]

<p>

When our kids were young, H and I both worked and we were usually out the door before 7am. We couldn’t imagine getting our kids out the bed so early to take them to day care and picking them up after 7pm, so in home care was the only option acceptable to us. </p>

<p>Maybe our kids were sheltered, but I don’t feel it would have added anything to their personal growth to have them live in a dangerous neighborhold or have to “rough it.” I grew up having to “rough it,” and I certainly do not think I have turned out better than my kids.

</p>

<p>Uhmm…what part of not seeing their parents all week do you not consider roughing it? Sheltered? How about ignored.</p>

[ellebud]

<p>As someone who is familiar with, not living in New York, the challenges of New York city education: Home schooling (please read this tongue in cheek) will prevent the young one from mixing with the “right” people. Ergo, no clubs, assemblies, future job potential, debutante balls. The object isn’t necessarily the EDUCATION, but rather the connections.</p>

<p>We have family and friends with children who are/were at Dalton, Calhoun, Trinity and Chapin (or was it Spence?) among others. They have commented on the phenomenon. All this is about connections…marrying well and keeping one’s place in the best apartments.</p>

[starbright]

<p>I am not sure its at all necessary in Manahattan to get into the right preschool and play that crazy game, there is just greater fear that it is necessary. </p>

<p>I recall some friends who balked at the whole thing, ignored preschool and put their kids into the PUBLIC school when the time came! The horror! We couldn’t believe it! These were professors, they could easily afford better, didn’t they know what they were doing?! How could the sacrifice their kids like that! </p>

<p>Apparently they knew what they were doing. One of their kids got into Columbia, the other Amherst. They are both thoroughly enjoying college. Saved a boat load of money too (as the going rate in the middle 90s or so was about $13k for half day preschool, on top of the cost of a full time nanny because no decent nanny works only half days, and privates were around $25k).</p>

[oldfort]

<p>mtnmomma - no need to be so judgemental. Trust me, my kids were never ignored. I just traveled 3000 miles from another country to watch my 21 year old daughter perform her last ballet recital last weekend. I am taking 3 days off again (tomorrow) to travel back to the States with D2 to be interviewed for a summer program. While my kids were growing up, with my busy work schedule, I have not missed any parent/teacher conference, recitals. We had dinner together almost every night when the girls didn’t have ballet (I made it possible by putting in additional hours after dinner) Because we cared so much for our kids, we had a full time nanny (then a driver for after school when they got older), plus those expensive pre-schools, private K-12 and top tier college. </p>

<p>Just because you didn’t choose my route, it doesn’t give you the right to judge. I don’t judge people for doing home school (not a fan), or decide to stay home and then later find out there isn’t money for college. Sheesh.</p>