<p>Congrats, Emaheevul08, on your great financial habits! There are many things I liked about that post. </p>
<p>
</p>
<p>My goal situation! Do you watch Suzie Orman?</p>
<p>No, the spouse’s credit file and history would be separate from the individual’s and would come into play only when a loan or something is needed with both applicants. Many times that is the case in buying a loan. My friend’s DD married a young man with a reasonably high income but a trashed credit history including large student debts and other situations from a very checkered past from which is slowly recovering. When they wanted to buy a house, they could not get the benefit of his high income without the death blow of the lousy credit history. Which means buying a house on her income alone which restricted what to buy. It takes time to repair bad credit so even paying off everything would not help the way the mortgage market is these days. So, yes, marrying someone with bad credit and lots of loans can be an impediment for financial issues.</p>
<p>Here in NY, if you want to move into certain buildings, both people in a marriage have to release credit and background info, even if it’s just a rental sometimes. So, it can be an issue when you want to do something jointly.</p>
<p>Even if a person has a lot of debt, if s/he is managing it responsibly, making the payments, it’s a postive thing, IMO, though of course, we may imagine other more ideal scenarios. If the person, has a lot of issues in that credit report, and is not dealing with them even now, that is flag, IMO. How to deal with that when your child is seriously involved with someone, is a whole other issue.</p>
<p>In my scenario my husband (then fianc</p>
<p>
This statement is incomprehensible to me.</p>
<p>My kids were in the fortunate position to complete undergrad debt free. One has a serious 5 year long relationship. This SO has very supportive parents who were unable to contribute to the 5 year undergrad program. The SO is matter of fact and determined about the over 6 figures in debt that must be paid. The field is not so lucrative that it is “easy”, but it has been barely doable and a new position with a significant raise is about to start. </p>
<p>I really respect this SO and their family. We have never suggested that our adult child re-think their choice based on this debt. That said, neither are in high-paying fields and we know that this will impact their joint lifestyles should they co-mingle their finances. Would we have sanctioned a similar plan for our kids- no. But every family must sort that out for themselves…</p>
<p>Quote:
Originally Posted by FenwayMama
My parents never complained but I know they were less than thrilled with the idea that their hard work was subsidizing a nice starter life style for someone else’s kid-
This statement is incomprehensible to me. </p>
<p>Given parents with equal incomes, I can see how this would be frustrating. One goes on 2 european vacations a year and leases cars and gives their kid massive debt vs the other lives fastidiously and pays for the kids college.</p>
<p>If the kids both get 60k jobs, the kid with no debt can live an insanely fun lifestyle vs the one with 500/mo in debt payments has limited discretionary income and would have to live more of a 30k lifestyle. </p>
<p>However, if the debts within stafford loan limits(<30k), there’s not much of a difference. If its not and the parents signed off on extra loans, this would miff me as well.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>I would be very worried in this scenario. This level of debt can, and will, affect the lives of the couple for many years to come. </p>
<p>We are fortunate that none of our Ds have significant others with anything approaching that level of debt. It’s unheard of in Canada anyway, because the cost of post-secondary education here is a fraction of what it is in the U.S. We do have one D who has a significant other who had almost no assistance from his family during his undergrad and so has a small amount of outstanding student loans. He’s now in grad school and we have assisted them financially in paying his tuition. This D has an excellent job so, otherwise, they are doing just fine. We’re fortunate in that we’re able to help out, and also fortunate that all of our Ds finished undergrad and grad school with zero debt. </p>
<p>The amount you’d qualify for in getting a mortgage will absolutely be affected by outstanding student loans, and the rate you are offered may also be affected.</p>
<p>IMHO, attitude towards money is more important than having debt or being debt-free. I’d much rather my D marry someone with student loans and a car payment who was used to working hard and paying off debt faster than required, than have her marry someone who’d been handed a college education and a paid-off car and never had to work. (Obviously, a hard working, frugal person with no debt is better than either one.)</p>
<p>Being satisfied with a $30k lifestyle on a $60k income is a useful life skill.</p>
<p>We do want our kids to have a good chance at an upper middle class life and yes, it can hurt if they pick a SO that is going to be a tremendous drag on this. And, it happens. All of the time. I have friends that are not thrilled that their DDs are the major bread winners even as they have children. I know a number of them in this situation, and it’s the opposite of the case for many of us in the older generation, and it’s a tough change for some of us to swallow. What to do when your DD who is making 6 figures marries someone barely making $30K and isn’t like to be finding anything making more, plus has 6 figures in student debt and a lousy credit score to boot? And then the babies come, and you watch your DD struggle being a full time + working mom and, yes, she does want time off with the babies, but can’t afford it. My friend’s DH would love to bash his SIL’s head against the wall, a macho Neanderthal reaction, but yeah, i know where he’s coming from. But the DD is married to him, and they have children together and things seem to be going along relatively well; just not what you had thought would be the case, and yes, it always hurts when it isn’t ideal. When the child is one who did everything the way one should, except marry someone with a job paying what hers does, and is having a rough go, it does bring the old blood up. But that’s just the way it goes. </p>
<p>I saw it in extreme form. Tears, lots of them when moms could not take time off a job when their kids were dxed with life threatening conditions that required acute treatment. I was ever so grateful to be a SAHM at that time, so that I was available to spend time with my son during critical difficult treatment. And my DH was the one who had to keep working… Sometimes the gender roles were reversed back then even, and now even more so. </p>
<p>So student loans are just one part of the financial picture. Job and salary prospects, credit, financial and personal responsibility, with the latter items the most important of all.</p>
<p>There can be longer-term consequences too. If the debt is the result of relative bad financial management by parents and student, could that result in obligations that the couple has to deal with when the parents are much older? Kids looking at marriage don’t typically think about this but those in middle-age do when their parents are retiring or need funds for nursing home or other care.</p>
<p>“IMHO, attitude towards money is more important than having debt or being debt-free.”</p>
<p>And I’m all with this. That and the type of person the SO is. </p>
<p>My friend is not thrilled that her DD has to carry the bulk of the financials of the family because the husband doesn’t make much money. Sure, it would be nice, if she’d married a financial peer. But he’s a great guy, a wonderful husband and father, and seems to be doing well in running the household and keeping the bills paid. That, to me would be far preferable to some I know, and have known who make the great incomes and spend even more and end up in financial trouble due to lack of organiziation, budgeting and caring.</p>
<p>@Sylvan: “This statement is incomprehensible to me.”</p>
<p>Ummmmm…Why? Perhaps you could explain how this is “incomprehensible” to you?</p>
<p>My niece and her H were able to afford a very nice house even tho her H had and still has 6 figure debt from law school. She earns more than him. They are very happy together and working to pay off his debt and their mortgage.</p>
<p>I think the gift of a debt free education is just that, a gift. What they choose to do with that gift is their decision. Some kids will use it wisely, others won’t. Ultimately as with any gift, the giver has no control over how it is used. Marrying someone with debt essentially wipes out the gift as now the giftee has (marital)debt where before he/she had none. </p>
<p>I know a family who has a great deal of money and they have spelled out strict conditions for their children in order to have regular access to generous family funds. Some of the requirements include no tattoos (ever), marrying someone of the same faith (Catholic), and weekly Mass attendance. So far the kids (18-24) are compliant, but I think they have also learned to be a bit sneaky… </p>
<p>You CAN attach strings to monetary gifts, whether that’s the right thing to do is another story.</p>
<p>As I read through the posts, I gain a little insight into the other point of view. It’s really hard for me to relate, but I can kind of understand.</p>
<p>I PAID for my college. I worked my butt off - no loans. But I only have an AS, and that’s all I’ve ever needed. I do quite well. My husband didn’t get any parental support and paid for his and took out loans that I am actually paying on because he (the one with the 4 year degree) is unemployed.</p>
<p>First, I can’t relate to the parents footing the bill for a $200,000 education. Second, I cannot begin to fathom taking out that much in student loans. So that’s at the core.</p>
<p>But above all that, both of us were responsible for our college finances, as well as choosing our spouses, with all that comes with (already acquired debt included).</p>
<p>Our kids are similar. D2 is a junior and is VERY attached and will probably get married after graduation. He does not have too many loans because of scholarships, but she has a bit. They will both be in relatively low paying jobs ($43,000 or so) So yea, they will probably have to rent for a while instead of buying a home, and they will have to live modestly. But I don’t think he would opt NOT to marry her because of her loans. And I don’t think his parents hold her loans against her. Their payment for their college, their selection of spouses, the finances in their marriage - all theirs to deal with.</p>
<p>Reading the posts and understanding that many parents are REALLY financially invested in their children helps me see where some of the reaction is coming from. But it makes me even more glad that we have approached things the way we have. At some point, these kids finances should be primarily their own concern. I guess my upbringing just places that age at about 18-20 rather than about 22-30.</p>
<p>H and I have scrimped so that our kids can graduate UG debt free. No vacations for us, little eating out, no home improvements, no new cars. We don’t want the kids to have financial stresses. We know how that causes sleepless nights and worry. </p>
<p>So I would be disappointed if they took on the student debt of a spouse. Eventhough they would not be responsible for it legally, as a practical matter it means less money for housing, retirement funds, an emergency fund, vacations, etc. </p>
<p>And it would depend on whether the new spouse has the earning capacity to pay off their debt in a short time. That is, a medical student’s debt is better than the UG debt for a degree that gets a minimum wage job. </p>
<p>I would advise my kid to look hard at the debt and the ability to pay it back. Was the future spouse showing financial irresponsibility in taking out the debt? Did the parents not contribute because they were low income or because they were also financially irresponsible? </p>
<p>Financial arguments are the primary reason for divorce. After the glow of the initial romance wears off, the hard realities hit. </p>
<p>I’d say wait and see how the intended is paying off the student loan on his/her own to see how much financial sense the person has.</p>
<p>
In situations where there is a significant amount of debt (100K+), I don’t think a couple should not get married. I think they should hold off on getting married. What’s the rush? They can be engaged for however long they want to be, but with marriage comes large expenses. </p>
<p>I see no problem with renting for a couple of years after a couple gets married. I’ll probably be doing the same. While a couple rents, they can save up a nice chunk of change (50K+) that can go towards the down payment of their first house.</p>
<p>It’s easier in the short term to get financially on the right foot when both parties have little (20K or less) or no debt.</p>
<br>
<br>
<p>There are a lot of people in the US that have or make a lot of money. There are more that don’t have or make a lot of money. If you associate with and/or work mostly with one of the groups, then you might not realize that there are lots of the other. A random Google search on the number of millionaires in the US turns up 9 million.</p>
<br>
<br>
<p>The average loan amount is $27,000. I think that the percentage of those over $100K is pretty small but it makes for sensational headlines.</p>
<br>
<br>
<p>This is the kind of environment that I grew up in with my mother working two jobs to support the family and my father working on and off (mostly off), not helping at all with the housework and taking off for long periods of time. They eventually separated but he came back on and off because he had nowhere else to go. You can imagine the kind of resentment my mother had and the kind of marital situation that resulted.</p>
<br>
<br>
<p>There are warnings and cautions that parents give kids when they are in their early 20s. I ignored those and perhaps I would have saved myself some problems by listening to them. Using the wisdom and knowledge of others can make the path of life easier. Unfortunately, 20-year-olds think that they’re smarter than their parents. Until they get a lot older.</p>
<p>As others have said, it depends on why the debt was accumulated. 200k for an undergrad degree? You are more interested in yourself than your future and you’re not for me. 200k for med school? Understandable. </p>
<p>I am starting out with probably 50k for my UG and masters and my partner has about 20k-ish. Not terrible but I was upfront about the debt and our payments. We both live very simple lifestyles so we can make it work. If he wanted a flashier lifestyle, the debt would be the least of my concerns.</p>
<p>Niquii77,</p>
<p>I agree that 100K+ is significant. I expect that D will have more like $25,000 when she graduates. (I’ll carry an additional sum because I’m already paying on it - so I’ll just continue). I don’t see them waiting though. They will have waited as long as they’re probably going to (2 1/2 years). Because of religious and personal reasons, there is a bit of a rush. LOL. I have not seen that marriage brings greater expense. That has not been my experience. It has saved me money.</p>