<p>There’s more to than just removing disruptive kids, but that’s a good start.</p>
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<p>First off, you’ll notice I was careful to say “through vouchers” as that is what is relevant to this discussion. </p>
<p>Second, IMO, no private college- especially not a religious one- should be getting Pell or other government subsidies but that is another matter entirely.</p>
<p>“Then why are Brigham Young & Notre Dame students eligible for Pell Grants?”</p>
<p>Because the state is not to required to provide a free higher education to anyone, but has decided it is in the best interest of society and higher education is not compulsory unlike primary and secondary education. </p>
<p>Congress passed the Higher Education Act in '65 and it has been reauthorized many times since - and as far as I know the part about federal money given to students who attend either secular private or religious private has not been found unconstitutional.</p>
<p>What a glib accusation. Get real.</p>
<p>My kids always went to public schools and we support them. However, if we lived in a place where they were bad or dangerous, of course I would have sent my kids to a private school.</p>
<p>“Lets allow public schools to remove disruptive students instead of providing vouchers if it is about improving education.”</p>
<p>Public schools can remove disruptive students but if they do so they are required to provide a free, public education somewhere else. There is nothing stopping any district from building a special school with classes and teachers for all the disruptives. </p>
<p>If you don’t like it, sue the school district or lobby for a amendment to change your state’s Constitution.</p>
<p>One county run school for disruptive students.</p>
<p>Wait, send disruptive kids to a better school?
No, send them to something like the Civ Conservation Corps or a program for prob,em kids.</p>
<p>“One county run school for disruptive students.”</p>
<p>So, go for it and lobby your county. </p>
<p>“No, send them to something like the Civ Conservation Corps or a program for prob,em kids.”</p>
<p>That is not a free and public school.</p>
<p>How is a Pell Grant not a gov’t voucher funded by taxpayers?</p>
<p>I thought CCC was a state program-- okay, that’s Calif Conservation Corps. I see a few other states have something similar.</p>
<p>“I thought CCC was a state program”</p>
<p>It is but it is not school.</p>
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<p>Nope, not true. None of the ones I know of take kids with special needs. The special needs kids are more expensive to educate, this is one way Catholic and other private schools keep the costs down. Not knocking them, just stating facts. D attended a private , religious school before we moved here and I loved it. Great school. </p>
<p>Between my 2 kids, they have attended: a private, religious school, the local publics and a public magnet school. I have taken both criticism and praise for each school choice that I have made.</p>
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<p>A fair question. </p>
<p>But under the status quo, I think higher education is a different case from K-12 education. We don’t have free public higher education in this country. IMO, that makes it more reasonable to subsidize higher education (even at private, religiously-affiliated institutions) than to subsidize private education in K-12 schools. In addition, there’s means testing for Pell Grants. I think a lot of the people advocating for school vouchers aren’t advocating means testing; I think a lot of people just want the ability to get back the tax money they’re paying to support schools that they’re not using.</p>
<p>I’d be happy to listen to someone outline a plan that would create and sustain a system of free, open-access higher education. I’d love for such a thing to exist, frankly. But I don’t think the political will exists in this country to fund such a system, even if it would be feasible to create one.</p>
<p>It includes education and skills training.
I don’t know that there is a mandate to re-place disruptive kids-? They can no longer expel?</p>
<p>“How is a Pell Grant not a gov’t voucher funded by taxpayers?”</p>
<p>It is, but again the state is not required to provide a free and public education to anyone past secondary school and the state has decided it is in the state’s best interest to provide funds for those who want a higher education. </p>
<p>There is also nothing stopping anyone from lobbying their legislature to establish a voucher system for primary and secondary education, or a state passing a law allowing it. Indiana already has.</p>
<p>Here is information for NJ on disruptive students</p>
<p><a href=“http://www.njsbf.org/images/content/1/1/11385/StudentDisciplineRights_Guide.pdf[/url]”>http://www.njsbf.org/images/content/1/1/11385/StudentDisciplineRights_Guide.pdf</a></p>
<p>“They can no longer expel?”</p>
<p>Yes, they can expel, but states all have different laws requiring whether it can be a permanent expulsion or only for a specific length of time and it is determined by the severity of the offense.</p>
<p>It might be one huge improvement to get help to the good kids who need it, remove disruptive kids and somehow save them from a prison destiny-- and get kids who are ready for more an opportunity to be empowered, not stuck with some common default in the classroom. But, noo, that’s not what? Nice?</p>
<p>Taxpayer dollars go for plenty of things I disagree with or wish were not necessary. If we truly believe it’s necessary to educate kids, why limit it to one size fits all?</p>
<p>You know, many magnets are not fully for talented youth. Some have the same issues inherent in publics.</p>
<p>There are catholic schools that accept and educate kids with special needs. I have never heard of a catholic high school that didn’t have entrance exams.</p>
<p>^ I think that it depends on where the school is located. The Catholic High Schools where I live (suburbs) have entrance exams but the Catholic High Schools where I grew up (rural midwest) do not. I am sure that some Catholic schools accept special needs students, but the ones where I live do not.</p>