In “King-Size Homer”, the seventh episode of Season 7 of the Simpsons that aired on November 5, 1995, Homer celebrates when he reaches 300 pounds and can be considered legally disabled …
I am sorry, but I don’t find that in the least bit funny.
Yeah, not seeing the humor there.
You can watch it on youtube, sometimes comedy is used to make a social commentary.
So back to the seatbelt question:If an obese person cannot close their seatbelt, even with the extender, even if they are “wedged” into their seat, can the plane take off knowing a seatbelt is not fastened on a passenger?
Well, the Simpsons are really never funny, just stupid, IMHO.
It’s my understanding that people who are seriously obese enough that they cannot fit into a regular seat need to buy 2 seats and ensure that the armrest will go up, but I don’t know for sure.
But that’s another classic example that actually supports this thread – if you know you are that obese that fitting into a regular seat may not be problematic, you don’t just show up and expect that they will let you get away with not buckling your safety belt or make some other arrangement.
If you were that obese, you would call ahead, inquire about different airline policies, inquire if there were certain planes, classes of travel or specific rows / seats that might be more accommodating, buy two tickets, ensure an FAA-approved seatbelt extender was available, etc. Just like this family should have done. And I can see a person of size being “humiliated” if they tried to squeeze into someplace they legitimately couldn’t fit, but that doesn’t mean that the FA doesn’t have every right to try to figure out a way that the person still needs to be buckled in in accordance with regulations. Despite dstark’s wishes, you can’t just always “bend the rules” just because you feel sorry for people’s life circumstances.
“A lot of people nowadays are getting a note from a shrink claiming their dog is a “service animal” needed for psychological support.”
I am waiting for the CC thread that says “help, my kid’s freshman year roommate has a ___ for a service animal, though he’s not blind” …
“So back to the seatbelt question:If an obese person cannot close their seatbelt, even with the extender, even if they are “wedged” into their seat, can the plane take off knowing a seatbelt is not fastened on a passenger?”
I think we all need to move en masse to Flyertalk 
And if you think CC discussions get ornery …
Actually, there have been numerous disputes concerning obese airline passengers.
For selective bending of the rules, and feeling sorry for life circumstances, I tend to discriminate:
Ivy is described as a stroke survivor with Spastic Quadriplegic Cerebral Palsy, who is not able to sit up on her own, and has a mental age of 6 months.
Then there are obese people, those with a broken leg, and ex-NBA players.
Don’t know how current this is, but its a list of policies regarding obese passengers by airlines http://www.obesityaction.org/educational-resources/resource-articles-2/general-articles/to-buy-or-not-to-buy-an-extra-seat-2 This ine is from 2013 http://www.cheapair.com/blog/travel-tips/airline-policies-for-overweight-passengers-traveling-this-summer/ Canada requires their airlines to accommodate obese fliers, bit I believe the arrangements again, must be made in advance https://www.otc-cta.gc.ca/eng/canadian-transportation-agency-decides-favour-one-person-one-fare-policy
Whats your point, sorghum? Sure there have been “disputes”. Only found reference, upon brief search, to one lawsuit (which is what my link referenced, not “disputes”) re: a passenger in Europe passing away before being able to get back to the US, as she was obese, had one leg and was in a wheelchair, which brings up other ADA issues). One article discussed a passenger, Joshua Millman, being given a $100 credit towards another flight because the obese person next to him took up 60% of his space on the flight. http://thegate.boardingarea.com/obese-airline-passengers-debate-continues/
"For selective bending of the rules, and feeling sorry for life circumstances, I tend to discriminate:
Ivy is described as a stroke survivor with Spastic Quadriplegic Cerebral Palsy, who is not able to sit up on her own, and has a mental age of 6 months.
Then there are obese people, those with a broken leg, and ex-NBA players."
Maybe the person is obese because he was horribly abused as a child and found comfort in food. Maybe the person with a broken leg got it because she jumped out of a burning building in which her entire family perished.
Or maybe the person is obese because he just likes fries too much and the person with a broken leg drove drunk and got into a car accident.
What does the reason for the specific life circumstance have to do with enforcing safety rules?
Go back to when I described being on a flight and sobbing due to just having found out about a family member’s suicide. Are you suggesting that because that’s an inherently more sympathetic situation than, say, sobbing because I broke a fingernail, that it would be ok for a FA not to insist I sit up and buckle my seat back and put my tray table up?
Safety regulations aren’t safety regulations if they are dependent upon how sympathetic the person / situation is.
My point is that this is not always true:
Another point is that this child deserves more sympathy and accommodation than anyone else I can imagine.
WHAT is not always true? If you know in advance (size, disability, temporary medical condition, etc) that you may need to work with the airlines to plan seating in advance, you do it. Plain and simple.
I was on a cross country flight a few years ago when I’d just been diagnosed with a Bakers cyst behind my left knee. My physician said I could fly if I was able to elevate my leg and get up and move around. So I contacted the airline to inform them (and provide my letter from the MD) and they moved me from a middle seat somewhere in the middle of the plane to an aisle seat-- in the last row by the toilet. Sat with another person with a medical issue in the middle seat (he was in a sling) and the lady who did not seem to be injured or infirmed in any obvious way who happened to be seated in our row by the window must have gotten out of her seat no less than 20 times. No exaggeration. What a nightmare. The good news- the person in front of me was very sympathetic and let me occasionally put my foot up on her armrest. The bigger issue is that I could rarely do so b/c people were standing there, leaning on my seat and her seat and blocking the aisle, waiting to use the toidy. It was an absolutely miserable flight.
And I’d hazard a guess that most of us have sympathy for the child and the family of a disabled child, but not necessarily any more or less sympathy if one’s disability is more “severe” than another’s.
What do you mean, it’s not always true? An obese person SHOULD do those things. They may or may not, but that is what they SHOULD do, if they have any common sense.
Sorghum, I think you need to read WayOutWest’s story about her friend’s son who died because he was a lap child. And then think about a FA who is aware of that story - maybe lived through it herself. Maybe the best “compassion” she can exhibit towards the Kirschenbaum family is her INSISTENCE that Ivy be placed in her own seat and buckled in per FAA regulations, versus being held on her mother’s lap. No matter how instinctively warm and friendly and fuzzy the idea is of a disabled child snuggling next to mom, the fact of the matter is that it is safer - and ultimately kinder - to have her buckled on her own.
It is not always true that obese people work with the airlines in advance, of course. Some (very few these days now that the rules are widely known) just turn up and make a scene.
Have you witnessed any obese passengers “make a scene”? What is that statement based on? And PG’s point is well taken- if a person has good reason to believe that they will have trouble fitting into a seat, they should contact the airlines. Maybe they are trying to jockey for a free upgrade. Is that what you are implying? So the child deserves your utmost sympathy but the obese person does not? Both of my sister-in-laws are obese. I know one is very sensitive about her issue and plans her flying with consideration of other passengers. Dont know about the other SIL, but she is the one married to my $)(^$^()* BIL who is also very big/significantly overweight, but not quite as big as his wife. If they fly with their skinny sons., I’ll guess the sons are the ones who get squished sitting next to each of them. Then again, I wouldn’t put it past my BIL to threaten the airlines if they dont make special accommodations for his wife.
It is not ALWAYS true that obese people plan with the airline in advance. Actually I have witnessed it, once, but even if I hadn’t there are enough online news reports to convince me.
Is this a real question??
An otherwise generally healthy and mentally capable obese adult and “a three year old stroke survivor with Spastic Quadriplegic Cerebral Palsy, who is not able to sit up on her own”?
I have made it clear where more of my sympathies would lie.
You’ve witnessed WHAT?? That obese people planned in advance, or that someone made a scene. I’ve seen plenty of people make scenes. They weren’t obese. I have a friend who is a gate agent. She has seen every kind of obnoxious, entitled, demanding, rude, threatening passenger. Not with disabilities, unless you consider being a class A jerk a disability.
And IMO, being “more” sympathetic to a physically disabled child than with some other severe disability is discriminatory. People with disabilities deserve equal sympathy. The posters here are not unsympathetic to the young girl. They just arent minimizing the potential disabilities of other passengers.
And FWIW, obese people may have many significant medical , physical and possibly MH disabilities. You are assuming that they are “otherwise generally healthy and mentally capable”. That’s a big and probably faulty and probably ill-informed assumption.
Let’s take it away from Ivy specifically. Adults have disabilities / special needs for many reasons.
Passenger A could have a broken leg because he got it while jumping from a burning building with a 5-yo girl in his arms whose life he saved in the process.
Passenger B could have a broken leg because he got drunk, got into a fight at a bar, and broke his leg in the process. (The other guy looks a lot worse.)
Do you not get that airlines don’t have TIME to sift through all of these reasons to determine who they should extend sympathy to and who they shouldn’t? That one cannot expect the FA’s to listen to everyone’s sob stories and determine where they should bend the rules and where they shouldn’t? The “reason why” the disability is irrelevant - the situation is what it is, so let’s deal with the here and now?
BTW, it really makes no difference to the Ivy story whether her parents live in Short Hills or the ghetto. She was 3 yo, she needed to be in her own seat, the parents should have had a seat for her but for whatever reason they didn’t, and so now the FA and pilot are tasked with getting her in her own seat as best they can given her physical limitations. That’s what they did.