<p>So I think that one of my best friends is about to make a horrible mistake. The man has two bachelor’s degrees: one is in business administration and one is in marketing. He graduated with a very high GPA with his degrees as well. In fact, I’m pretty sure he graduated either Magna or Suma Kum Loude. He is now pursuing an MBA and is almost done with it. </p>
<p>However, he has now decided that he wants to go to Med School and become a doctor in general medicine, and his mind is absolutely set on becoming a doctor in general medicine. I should also mention that my friend is now 24 years old. The only problem is that now my friend has decided that he wants to go ahead and do a business PH. D before he goes to med school. He wants to do this because he says that he has read that schools will pay him a stipend of $24,000 a year (which I don’t really believe he will get that much in the first place). He also says that he has some how worked it out where the school will pay his business PH. D tuition in full. So he now is saying, “Why not pick up a free business PH. D before I go off to med school”. </p>
<p>He also thinks that this will help his chances of getting a full ride scholarship to med school once he enters it. But I try to tell him that he probably already can get a full ride scholarship to med school because of two reasons: 1) He graduated magna or suma kum loude with his bachelor’s degrees and 2) He now has a perfect 4.0 GPA for his masters and is able to successfully keep that 4.0 every semester, so he will likely graduate with that GPA. </p>
<p>I should also mention that my friend is very well off financially and he Grandpa just died and left him hundreds of thousands in the bank. He even told me POINT BLANK that he could easily pay for med school out of pocket with his own money if he wanted to. Plus, he would have plenty of money to support himself while going to med school It’s just that he doesn’t want to have to spend the money. </p>
<p>Anyway, I’m creating this thread to help my friend. Don’t you folks think that it’s a stupid idea as well for my friend to get a PH. D before going to med school? Also, wouldn’t it hurt his chances? Not to mention how old he would be when he actually starts his actual career.</p>
If you have mentioned all the qualification he has had, very few (if any) med schools will admit him, let alone get a full ride to med school. What planet is he on? (What is his MCAT score? How many science prereqs has he taken? What kind of ECs has he had? BTW, GPA is just one out of many factors the med schools would look at. Also, the high GPA in a master program does not carry much weight. A “marketing” UG degree is a negative for an applicant in general - although this weakness can be overcome by a careful selection of more focused EC activities.)</p>
<p>He has yet to take or even study for the MCAT. He has taken none of the science pre-reqs that he needs to take either. He says that he is going to take the science pre-reqs while he is working on his PH. D. The only EC’s that he has is that he works in the school as a teacher’s assistant, and helps to teach class. He’s basically just letting everything ride on the fact that he has a great GPA.</p>
<p>I think your friend, although business degrees are admirable, needs to really understand what the SELECTION process is like for applying to Med School. I know two people who had a 4.0 science GPA, one was a biology major, the other an anthropology major, and both were rejected from every med school they applied to, primarily because they had NO extra-curriculars/volunteering/research/physician shadowing, nothing. Just GPA and MCAT.</p>
<p>Now if your friend was getting a PHD in biochemistry, this would be a different story.</p>
<p>Well I think that my friend’s logic behind getting a PH. D is that he will still have to wait and do the foundation classes for each science class and each one builds on another. For instance, you have to take intro to chem before you take gen chem 1, then you can take gen chem 1, then two, then organic, etc. So I think his logic is that while he taking each class that is a pre-requisite of another, that he can go ahead and knock out a PH. D as well in this time period. However, he thinks he can do a Ph. D in 3 years and from what I’ve read, that’s not gonna happen. From what I have read, Ph. D’s take like 4-6 years to knock out. Plus, I’ve heard that the workload is so intense in a PH. D that you don’t have time to do anything else, much less do very difficult science classes on the side. </p>
<p>Do you also think that having the additional business PH. D would hurt his chances of getting into med school because it would make it look like he is undecided and doesn’t know what he really wants to do in life? Also would his age hurt him? I’m thinking that because he would be entering med school at the late age of about 30, that would hurt his chances of getting in?</p>
<p>Also what I’m really seeing is that med schools STRONGLY look at extra curriculars. What type of specific extra curriculars look the best on an application?</p>
<p>Minimum expected ECs for medical school applicants include all of the following:</p>
<p>—community service (consistent, long term volunteering in non-medical activities)
—physician shadowing
—clinical volunteering (meaning having direct patient contact) at a hospital, nursing or group home, ambulance service, stand alone clinic
—science research (bench or clinical)
—leadership positions in activities</p>
<p>“Best” is dependent on what specific interests the applicant has. Generally one’s ECs should reflect the applicants personal interests while at the same time fulfilling all of the above activities.</p>
<p>Wow, so Med schools want to see all of those EC’s on an application? What if he just has some of those? Would he still be able to get in then? </p>
<p>The good news is that my friend and I are both friends with another guy who’s father is a very successful doctor at a local hospital around here. The guy owns his own practice, is on the board of directors at a major hospital in our area, and knows anyone who’s anyone that’s in the medical field here. My friend’s father could probably hook him up with some great volunteering activities. Also, I bet that his dad would let him shadow him as well.</p>
<p>Okay I will tell him about this. He really needs to know this. Thanks a lot. </p>
<p>Also though, do you think that the Ph. D will hurt his chances at Med School? Also, why would you say that his chances of getting in would be slim even if he had all of those volunteering things on his application?</p>
<p>Because initially all you told us is that he has a high GPA in his MBA that’s one piece of the puzzle, and while a high GPA keeps you from getting rejected, it doesn’t get you accepted anywhere. His high GPA does not include the courses that actually matter and we have no sense what his MCAT score would be. But again, these are just the things that keep people from getting rejected, not the things that get them accepted. That’s where the ECs, LORs, personal statement, and interview come in.</p>
<p>You and your friend have a lot to learn. I suggest going to the library or even just a bookstore and flipping through the guidebooks on MD admissions and such.</p>
<p>A PhD in business will almost certainly not help his application. Will it hurt? I don’t know. I don’t even know what a PhD in business is. I assume it’s not the same thing as a PhD in economics, right?</p>
<p>the PHD in Business wouldn’t hurt his application, but it wouldn’t really help it either. It’s like a neutral factor. There are quite a few lawyers who switch to medicine, and I don’t think there JD helped that much or hurt them that much.</p>
<p>Was going to ignore this but I can’t: there are a lot of well-intentioned, very knowledgeable people on this forum-but why in the world did anyone respond to this? A Ph.D in “business”? And the “friend” will be picking up the Ph.D for “free”? Our fearless OP promising to “tell him to hop on those EC’s right away”? Seriously, if the potential applicant-and it is, per OP, just talk at this point-can’t motivate him/herself to visit this forum, what are the chances s/he cares about, will let alone listen to, third hand advice?
If OP posted that he had a “friend” who planned to become a Soyuz astronaut(because no NASA flights were available) while playing in NFL for two years along the way to medical school, would anyone take that seriously?</p>
<p>I’m just trying to help this guy out. Yeah, the guy doesn’t have a lot of common sense. However, it was nice to know about the extra curriculars though. I can at least tell him that. But I agree with you: the PH. D in business is a ridiculous idea. Also, I have no idea how he thinks he is going to get a free ride. The man is a very strong academic but if he only had common sense, ya know?</p>
<p>“the PH. D in business is a ridiculous idea.” - yes, agree 200%
I have an MBA. Even an MBA is practically useless, unless you are going into finance/accounting (maybe) and getting an MBA from the Elite place. My MBA has helped me to find several jobs in very economically depressed city, it impressed my enterviewers (at least they told me so). Howsever that impression came mostly from the fact that I have completed both Bachelor and an MBA while working full time and having family. I had my MBA only becuase my employers paid. I do not use any of my MBA knowledge at any of my jobs (total 9 jobs). I also graduated Magna Cum Laude with business degree (in Information systems)
Any way, if your friend wants to go to Med. School, as long as he has met all requirements, high college GPA, decent MCAT, various medically related ECs, he is good to go. His age is also perfect.
I do not believe that Med. School will be overly impressed with the PH. D in business. Again, why do I think so? My D’s Med. school class has a Ph. D in science from Harvard, several Masters in science (including from JHU), several lawyers. I imagine that the adcom will have only one question that might only hurt an applicant: Why Ph.D in business? Not easy question to answer,especially without showing much of the job experience.
In regard to full rides, they are very rare at Med. Schools.</p>
<p>Miami, why did you edit your post? While I understand yours/hers choice to go to her particular UG, you had posted before editing that she valued her time at UG with students “different” from your daughters elite prep high school and that she was glad to socialize with other students that didn’t have the same academics as top 20 school students like all her high school classmates were qualified for. Your daughters HS average SAT was 1888, all 32 students, hardly qualifying them for top 20 schools as you stated. No need to defend your daughters UG to say she was diversifying her social and academic self to slum with her UG classmates…sheesh, 1888 wouldn’t get them into elites. Just saying since we have heard so many times how “elite” this private prep was. Just saying.</p>
<p>No offense but your friend fits the description of a “professional student”. There are some who are so comfy in school that they never want to get out in the real world. On a serious note, its good that your are concerned as a friend but at the end of the day its his life, you can’t stop him from doing whatever it is that he wants to do. All you can do is tell him the pros and cons and thats pretty much it.</p>
<p>^Very true…but what are the pros? Med. School or not, what is the purpose of the PhD in Business? I believe that this needs to be answered regardless of the Med. School goal. If one is planning to be in business, then the first and most important thing is to start WORKING ASAP.<br>
My D. calls herself a “professional studier”. She has no choice - she is a Med. student. But she is absolutely desparate to get out of “studier” mode and start working.<br>
However in business it is much more important. While Medicine requires huge anout of academic preparation, business requires job EXPERIENCE, which is very different from place to place, but having lots of it is always a plus. Unless one is planning to stay in academics, I do not see ANY value in PhD in Business. The person who is planning to pursue it have to have a clear understanding of why he wants it, what are benefits of having it (vs. working experience). In addition, there are many who pursue various PhD’s while working (including my own brother who has received his PhD while working full time).</p>
<p>Thanks for your comment. I also just did some digging and found out that my friend wants to do a PH. D in marketing and the only place that he has applied is at the University of Florida (UF). He also says that this is the only place that he will apply because he says he is a shoe-in! However, as it turns out, that is one of the best marketing Ph. D’s that you can get! Apparently that particular PH. D is in the top 10 in the country and the top 20 in the world for marketing! Plus, it says in black and white on the UF website, “Only 2-3 applicants are accepted a year”. Yes, you read that correctly. It wasn’t 23, it was only 2 or 3 applicants a year! How on earth does he expect to get into a program like that?!!</p>
<p>I’m trying my hardest now to convince my friend to reconsider and to stop being an idiot! He needs to just finish his master’s, do the prerequisites, and then go to med school.</p>
<p>No offense taken, my friend is a professional student. It’s like the man just never wants to leave school. I don’t get it. If he goes the Ph. D then med school route, he is not going to start really working a job until he is like 36 or older, and that’s really sad. </p>
<p>@MiamiDAP</p>
<p>I have asked my friend over and over again what his reasoning behind getting he PH. D is. He tells me that he has to take all the prerequisites for med school and that will take a while, so he figures that he can knock out an additional PH. D while doing this. I tell him that this will be impossible, but he doesn’t believe me. Again, he also thinks that getting the PH. D will make him a shoe in for a full ride scholarship to med school, but I think that he is wrong. </p>
<p>The man told me point blank that his grandfather left him enough money when he died to pay for med school out of pocket, and support himself while going through med school, but my friend doesn’t want to spend the money. I wonder if my friend can be helped. He is making really stupid decisions right now.</p>