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Sure.
The point of that example is that you can’t just assume that you are dealing with a “paper tiger”. Some people will follow through on the most ridiculous threats.</p>
<p>“If you mostly identify with the parent, that’s your prerogative and you are free to express yourself. What is not OK is for you to preach to other posters who are giving very different advice for being somewhat below the level of civil discourse.”</p>
<p>Let me be clear. I’m not preaching and it <em>IS</em> ok for me to speak my mind. I’m not defending the OP’s mother and I don’t “mostly identify” with OP’s mother. IMHO, therapy would help immensely. That said, I see no need to make such strong negative comments about a woman who’s not here to defend herself. I wish OP the best and hope that she’s successful in all that she strives for. Momma-three said it best when she said to be kind with your advice. Also, as my momma used to tell me often, sometimes it’s not what you say, but how you say it.</p>
<p>The OP may be in college but she is still young. Counseling and the distance that being in college out of state gives her will be more helpful to her than anything anyone here could say.</p>
<p>As for POIH and his family, I too can tell that he cares very deeply for both his wife and daughter. Whatever anyone here might think, their family is working out what works for them. I find the snide remarks offensive and rude. But that’s me.</p>
<p>I also think that perhaps some of the comments being perceived as defending or identifying with the mother might instead be more a reflection of the personalities of those posters in that perhaps they’re more empathetic by nature. I don’t mean that as an affront to anyone at all but as a recognition that different personality types and styles approach issues differently.</p>
<p>“Counseling and the distance that being in college out of state gives her will be more helpful to her than anything anyone here could say.”</p>
<p>Yes, both will be helpful to her. But it is also helpful for her to hear from lots of other caring parents on this thread that yes, her mom has serious issues, it’s not all the D’s fault, and that many other adults on CC also had controlling-parent issues that they have managed to grow beyond. I think by the OP reading all these posts she will see that many others are thinking of her, that there are many approaches to improving her situation, and that all that will give her some other ways to think about her family.</p>
<p>This thread reminds me of a friend I knew in California. Her parents were very wealthy; she was an only child.</p>
<p>Of course, her parents paid for everything - because it bought control. When she got married, you would have thought it end. She was a Speech Pathologist. When she had her first child, they insisted that she quit her job and they “paid” her what she lost in salary (plus more) If she wanted to go back to work, they’d threaten to cut her out of the will (we’re talking millions and millions). </p>
<p>Well, that just meant they had bought more control…and it never ended. This control destroyed 3 of her marriages. She was as nice as you could imagine, but her husbands felt castrated by her parents’ money being thrown around all the time. </p>
<p>sick!</p>
<p>You gotta cut the umbilical cord before you’re momma uses it to hang you from the rafters.</p>
<p>somemom’s story about how she and her H cringe at his parents’ phone calls reminded me of my own reaction to my mother’s phone calls. You can’t fake this stuff. If your body goes into fight/flight mode when the phone rings, you know there is something wrong. There is probably an aspect of this in the twice daily phone calls the OP is required to make. Unless you have had this type of relationship to a parent, it’s hard to imagine the kind of duress a simple phone call can cause.</p>
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<p>I find this statement curious. Through out this thread, overwhelming majority of the posters were exceptionally empathetic toward the young lady who started this thread. Our empathy is with OP. I scanned the posts by the above poster, and found this little gem: </p>
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</p>
<p>Unless my reading comprehension is failing badly, this sure sounds like throwing a guilt trip on this young lady. The other posts by this poster are all about giving “voice” to the mother who is not there to present her side of the story, and about expressing her doubt about the veracity of the daughter’s account. So, this poster is very “empathetic” toward the mother, but I don’t see much evidence for her empathy toward the “daughter” who is sending all of us this distress signal. </p>
<p>I stand by my position: if OP is talking about the same behavior by a BF or a husband, how many of us would be advising patience, accommodation, empathy and understanding toward him???</p>
<p>The fact that most of us, parents, are actually showing a lot of empathy toward the child rather than siding with the parent and defending the parent’s position says a lot about the integrity of the posters on this thread. It would much easier for most of us to take the parent’s side. Granted the diversion toward the POIH got a bit out of control, and some of us may have been a bit direct. However, the overall tenor on this thread is a LOT of empathy and good will toward OP. We have been indeed very empathetic. Especially helpful for OP is the sharing of painful personal stories by some of the posters about their own problem with their parents. I have no doubt that this was enormously helpful for OP. Knowing that you are not alone and yes the problem can be addressed is a very important step toward handling it maturely.</p>
<p>Most of us also feel that the OP needs to hear from other conscientious parents that her mother’s behavior is not normal. Even without the mother’s side of the story, examples provided by OP give us an ample reason to realize that the OP’s mother’s behavior is way over the top. In order for OP to sort this all out, move on, and yes, reconcile with her mother, she needs to be able to call a spade a spade. Telling her repeatedly “oh, but your mother loves you so” does not help, and if anything it is a barrier to the solution since it completely obfusticate the real problem at hand. It’s obvious that this does not sit well with posters who mostly identify with the parent’s position, but so be it. This is an open forum. </p>
<p>As I mentioned earlier, I can accept this poster identifying with the mother and feeling sympathetic toward the mother. However, I find this “I am more empathetic than you” line of thinking and the lecturing tone for other posters rather lacking in credibility, and rather off putting and condescending. </p>
<p>What most of us are saying on this thread is, love is not enough to justify and rationalize anything and everything, and being a parent does not mean automatic free pass for dysfunctional behavior toward the children regardless of how much “love” the parent professes to have toward the kids. </p>
<p>Parent or not, people should be judged by their action, not loud proclamations about how they feel and what their “intent” is - especially more so for parents since we can do so much damage because of the total dependence of our children on us and the totality of the reality we represent to them during their early, formative years. we have that much power, and some people abuse that power. We need to be exceptionally vigilant of our own motives given near total power we have over our young children.</p>
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<p>Ya gotta feel for that Hitler, just a couple of text messages a day from Poland? Was that really too much to ask?</p>
<p>Lizmane, I find you anything but empathetic. Period. You seem determined to twist any words that <em>YOU</em> don’t agree with.</p>
<p>“The other posts by this poster are all about giving “voice” to the mother who is not there to present her side of the story, and about expressing her doubt about the veracity of the daughter’s account. So, this poster is very “empathetic” toward the mother, but I don’t see much evidence for her empathy toward the “daughter” who is sending all of us this distress signal.” </p>
<p>You don’t know me or my story. You seem convinced that I’m defending this mother, which is not the case at all. If you actually read my posts, you would have read in the same post that you quoted, that my own mother has been and still is at times controlling. However, I (like the OP) know that my mother loves me. Hindsight is alot clearer than when you’re 18. I’ve lived this for 50 years and have made my peace and learned how to deal with my mother and to create that needed space so that she doesn’t control my life but that our relationship stays intact. My mother is now elderly and in poor health; maybe that’s one reason why I find sympathy for this mother, because I think it’s sad that they feel the need to control and I feel sorry for them. Maybe you’re a younger parent and haven’t gotten to the point in your life where you’re taking care of your parents but I’m there so I feel like I’ve gone full cycle with this. Controlling or not as she was, I held my mother’s hand in the ambulance as she was having a series of strokes…maybe that gives one a different perspective on life.</p>
<p>I never questioned the OP’s veracity; once again, those are words that you put out there. I only attempted to make the point that the mother isn’t here to defend herself and you only have half of the story. The OP’s comments are taken out of the context of knowing her entire family situation. Other posters have made these same comments but <em>YOU</em> only seem to take issue when I say it.</p>
<p>I’m not seeking your agreement or approval and quite honestly, I find you to be abrasive. Just the fact that you recognize that your comments to POIH were “direct” as you call it (I call it <em>rude</em>), shows me what type of person you are.</p>
<p>I feel the need to apologize to posters and those reading for what has turned into a personal tit-for-tat. I’m going to take the sage advice of two posters that I most respect on this board and just leave it alone.</p>
<p>I wish all of you and those you care about a very happy and safe Thanksgiving.</p>
<p>I just wanted to add…my mom would call me at 2 am in the morning…hours before mid-terms…and those types of problems did not end until I got married and hubby installed an answering machine. He saved my life. She ended up getting professional help. Take care of yourself.</p>
<p>OP, how did the talk with your mother go?</p>
<p>I hope the OP is doing okay on this Thanksgiving day.</p>
<p>The original question posed in #1 was
</p>
<p>Some of the limits described in the OP (ie. cellphone, texts, TV time, etc) don’t seem completely unreasonable. However subsequent posts reveal behavior that has clearly crossed the line. </p>
<p>OP - you’ve received a lot of good advice from the parents, most of whom agree that mom has overstepped her bounds. You have a range of options on how to proceed:</p>
<p>1) You can continue the daily calls but keep them short & devoid of emotion. This is the least confrontational approach, but it perpetuates your mother’s pattern of control. If you take the route of appeasement, as kantianethicist noted, it will never truly be over. And the pattern will continue with your younger siblings.</p>
<p>2) You can take a step back, limit calls and communications, establish your own bank account, and take other gradual steps to reduce your mother’s control. At the same time, you will be taking gradual control of your own life.</p>
<p>3) You can seek advice and counseling from the college on how to deal with your mother. They may also be able to advise you how to deal with her threats of withholding funding. This will empower you to stand up to your mother. It will also set a precedent for your siblings.</p>
<p>4) You can transfer to another school, join ROTC, liberate yourself, and/or sever ties with your mother. If you take this route, you will certainly have more freedom, but you will also repercussions for years, and you may have regrets over them. </p>
<p>I’ve probably overlooked a few suggestions in summarizing. It seems to me that the two extremes will be the least productive over the long run. A combination of the middle two options will be the most empowering and will help you to set limits for your mother, as well as setting an example for your sibs.</p>
<p>Good luck! You seem like a caring and mature student. Let us know how you are doing. Judging from the number of posts on this thread, there are a lot of people who are concerned for you.</p>
<p>I hope the OP is doing O.K this weekend—If you are reading this thread this weekend remember to stand strong regarding your moms contact with friends and professors. I hope you can manage to send the message that you are happy and doing well. Please let us know how the weekend turned out. We are all thinking about you.</p>
<p>I have been thinking about the OP all weekend and hoping all went well. Please check in when you can.</p>
<p>Any updates? Anyone get anything back by PM from OP?</p>
<p>I wonder if the OP is reading the boards anymore. Perhaps with the end of the semester, the OP is just really busy though.</p>
<p>Hello, another post from the OP- I’m so sorry that I forgot to get back to all of you. You have all given me such great advice, which some of it I applied during Thanksgiving break. Sorry if I kept any of you in the dark, or concerned; you are owed an explanation:</p>
<p>Over the break, after Thanksgiving dinner, I approached my mother with the request that we have a talk after the family leaves (by family I mean the grandparents, and other relatives who had come for dinner). I tried not to be pushy, but I was very nervous about what I was going to say, and I felt if I didn’t approach her about talking to her, that I might back down. This set both of us off on the wrong foot, and my mother got annoyed with me because she said it was a “bad time” to ask her for a chat. </p>
<p>After everyone left, I sat both my parents down and told them I had something to tell them. My mom looked really worried and she thought it was something really bad (I have never had a "heart to heart"with them). I brought up what had been bothering me, etc. Basically spilled the whole story. My dad asked a few questions here and there, while my mom just folded her arms and looked at me. I brought up the fact that I had been talking to someone (Basically all of you parents here at CC-but instead I said “someone”) about how I had been feeling, and about the way my mom had behaved. My mother immediately flew off the handle, and said, “Well… why are you telling people about your private life? Do you want attention?!”. I just told her I was trying to be as honest as I could, and that I loved her; but sometimes I felt like she was smothering me, like I wasn’t free to be my own person. I told them both that I would really appreciate the opportunity to succeed on my own, as an adult. That I thought I was responsible enough. I even gave them a quote on the grades that I would be earning for this semester, just to prove my case.
It was a really long talk, and my mom (to my surprise!) did soften up a bit. She said that she cared about me, and that she does want to raise me with good morals. She got angry a few times and asked me if I thought I was “too good now as a big college student”, to listen to her. She also questioned my motives with approaching them with this- at one point she blamed it on the fact that I had friends or maybe a boyfriend who was “influencing” me to question their judgement. I said that through talking with someone else about my situation, I had come up with the conclusion on my own.</p>
<p>Did I get through to them? Yes and no. I still have to call two times a day, and I do have certain rules I still must obey. My father didn’t say much, but he did say this to me later: “If you want to cut off ties like you brought up before: go ahead. But we will both not support you financially. This includes college.” I did bring up that sometimes “I felt like I could do that”, but I never said I would. I guess he just felt I said it as a threat.</p>
<p>Had another talk with my mom a day before I went back to school- she told me the rule were still the same, but that she loved me, and she hugged me and said she was worried about losing me, that I’d go away, get pregnant, and get hurt by someone, all because I was out of her reach. I explained that I wouldn’t do that, and she said she wants me to “go to church at college” and pray. We’ve never really been all that religious but the talk definitely had a lot of it. I told her I wanted to wear jewelry, have friends who were guys, and dye my hair. I told her I was frustrated. She basically sighed and told me that I was an adult now, and legally she couldn’t stop me. She told me to have fun, and that I was lucky that she’s not going to be there to see me do those things. (She actually laughed a bit after she said that. Surprising but good).</p>
<p>So now I’m back, and I call her two times a day, still. Although, three days ago I didn’t call her twice and she didn’t freak out or anything. When I do call, if I’m not too busy, I try to talk to her more, ask her how everyone is doing, how her day is. I always hear her drilling my siblings about something, funnily enough. And it all comes flooding back to me, ha ha.</p>
<p>She’s still a little crazy, and they’re both still doling about my money to me, but… as I’ve thought more about this, I realize she’s not going to change in a day. I feel bitter toward her in a lot of ways, as well as my father, but, they’re the only parents I have. I’m going to try to be as nice as I can. If it was to ever get worse, honestly, I might reconsider things and look into alternative methods of working the financial situation out, but I am going to open myself up a bank account, and look for a job somewhere. Gain more independence.
So all in all, I don’t know if the talk is going to change everything, as I said, I am still expected to abide by certain rules, at least the ones my mom can control from where she’s at. But honestly: I’m not going to go to church…because I don’t want too. But she doesn’t have to know that. And I’m going to work on her a bit more, make her trust me. If not: her loss. I’m going to put up with some of it, but not all. If she doesn’t like who I am, the things I do, or freaks out if I “don’t obey her rules”- then we’ll just have another talk. And another. I’m going to stand my ground.</p>
<p>Cannot thank all of you-yes all of you- for taking time out of your days to help me. Because you truly did. I cannot thank you enough.</p>