<p>I agree with waiting to call lawyers and advocates. It might be wise for the OP to get the son tested for LDs or other issues first.Teachers can often help by giving a parent a glimpse of what the student is like without parents present. I skimmed over the “gifted” stuff because at a young age that can often be a child who is really just precocious so didn’t add value to the current situation from the sounds of it. 8th grade is a tough year and probably best to get a strong foundation and understanding of the situation before trying how to manage the son (and the current school) into high school. </p>
<p>OP, here’s a pamphlet explaining the evaluation process in NY state. The school district has 60 days to complete an evaluation once it is requested. (I know that’s the requirement in NYC but apparently it’s the same throughout the state.)
<a href=“http://www.supac.org/files/1913/7485/0148/SUPACAdvocacyBriefNo4SpecialEducationStepsinNYS.pdf”>http://www.supac.org/files/1913/7485/0148/SUPACAdvocacyBriefNo4SpecialEducationStepsinNYS.pdf</a></p>
<p>To the OP…is this the SAME son who wasn’t working up to his potential as a 9 year old in 2008. You wrote some lengthy posts about some issues with him here in 2008. If so, this is a long term issue. Beside switching schools, what has been done to help figure out what your child needs to improve? </p>
<p>Has this youngster EVER had an IEP? Has he ever been evaluated for learning disabilities or any other disability?</p>
<p>I don’t understand the Regents system enough to comment on course placement, but I did want to second the call for a full set of testing for learning disabilities–the kind that requires multiple tests over multiple days. What I’m getting from your post (though I admit it confused me) is that you want the school to follow a 504 plan based solely on an optometrist’s recommendations. I think most schools would want a more substantial medical diagnosis. The field of “behavioral optometry” is pretty sketchy and the home of a lot of quacks. In any case, you don’t seem to have a firm grip on why your son is having problems with his schoolwork, and figuring that out seems to me to be the first order of business. Best of luck.</p>
<p>OK, let me see if I can nail all of these succinctly:</p>
<ol>
<li><p>No, he has never had an IEP, nor been referred to the CSE. His vision therapist said that with vision therapy, this would all be corrected. He has a 504 Plan. Bookshare (books on audio), extra time, testing in a separate room, second set of books. However, despite the actions of the school counselor’s, the teachers do not provide syllabi, notes, or even tell me the chapters so I can assist. I am aware of an IEP, due process hearing, etc. The point of the vision therapy was to avoid the IEP process. </p></li>
<li><p>While in the public school in grade 4, his grades were not great, and he resisted reading. Forgot papers. Took him for an eye exam, was told he was farsighted a little, and he got plain old glasses.</p></li>
<li><p>For reasons separate from my son’s issues, I had issues with the public school. Constant staff turnover, constant changes to curriculum. Majority of community is H.S. Diploma or less. 3.9 percent of population has more than a Bachelors (and that would include me). </p></li>
<li><p>The week of the 4th grade tests I tutored him. He scored over a 90 percent on both. He likes when I teach him. I think that if he had his way, I’d homeschool him. But compliance on his part would be an issue for me.</p></li>
<li><p>In the 4th grade, he was in a class with both a regular and special ed teacher. I had him read aloud, and noticed him skipping lines. I asked the special ed teacher about it, and he said it was “Nothing”, and he’d outgrow it. My son also lost his glasses that year. When I took him back for an exam, he was not prescribed new ones. In the summer between 4th and 5th grade, he picked up the only books I’ve ever seen him read. A series called “The Story of the World”. When he returned to school, he had raised his own reading lexile by 200 points. I’ve never seen him voluntarily read anything else. No matter what I do. In the 5th grade, he had one teacher. His report cards came back with him being above average on most tasks. I know now that had to all be a lie. He also played the oboe in school. He danced, was a gymnast. Private schools practically threw scholarships at him. </p></li>
<li><p>For 6th grade, we accepted a scholarship to a Jewish Day School that offered a dual curriculum and accelerated math/science. Within a month of getting there, I was informed that he did not know what an adjective or adverb was, did not know what the scientific method was, and refused to write. They assigned him to a private tutor for Hebrew. Although he did poorly in English due to not turning in papers, he went from zero Hebrew to 100 percent proficiency at the 5th grade level in 2 years. </p></li>
<li><p>He was assigned to the Jewish School’s guidance counselor every Monday. Nothing came of it. I suggested that his vision might be the problem. She said she’d have the nurse check it out. I never heard anything.</p></li>
<li><p>He left the Jewish School because they lost their property, principal. </p></li>
<li><p>Additionally, let me be clear and point out that he has the word decoding ability of a college student. That means that when he reads aloud, he appears to do so very fluently. However, other than the 4th grade teacher who said he’d outgrow it the line skipping, nobody ever noticed it but me. </p></li>
<li><p>When his disability was revealed to me, it was so profound that I can’t believe he ever read aloud in school between grades 6-8. I guess my question there would be “What exactly were the reading and special ed teachers doing with him then”?</p></li>
<li><p>It was not until he went to the behavioral optometrist that I was shown what happens. When a wand was brought to his eyes, both of them skewed outward to the wall. It was explained that while he’d pass a wall test far away, he needed to converge his eyes on a page to read. When tested, he couldn’t sustain it for more than a few minutes without breaking down. He also didn’t know when he was skipping lines. I was told that he’s always seen that way, so he couldn’t tell anyone. He was asked to read a full article and when questioned, he couldn’t remember most of the details. I was told that the effort to converge the eyes taxes the brain and interferes with comprehension. Also, the effort to read will put him to sleep. I sat through every single one of his 20 weeks of vision therapy and participated in his exercises at home. All while he was trying to keep up with schoolwork. It was heartbreaking.</p></li>
<li><p>Studies show that 70 percent of children diagnosed with ADHD actually have convergence insufficiency. The behaviors are the same. Inability to focus, distracted, avoidant behavior, etc. The vision therapy is supposed to correct the eyes and therefore correct the behavior. My son still doesn’t want to read, which I know is learned behavior. </p></li>
<li><p>Given the severity of his eyes, his utter lack of reading at home, and that the only reading he did was in class, he would actually be illiterate if he were not so intelligent. Keep in mind, despite all of this, he was able to comprehend at a 7th grade level (his grade then) even before vision therapy. </p></li>
<li><p>One main problem with not having read for years that acts as a deterrent to reading is that he lacks basic vocabulary from years of not reading, which makes reading at this higher level more frustrating. For example, in 8th grade, he knew all of the difficult Greek and Latin words he learned that year. But he didn’t know the word “dainty” in To Kill A Mockingbird. He can free write fairly well. But he still speaks like a young boy when he writes. Not the sophistocated vocabulary that is expected at his age. In other ways, he is very emotionally immature for age. He was just starting puberty when the vision therapy began. The whole point of this “gap year” was to allow him time to benefit from the vision therapy, to mature. </p></li>
<li><p>During vision therapy, he was often told to “breathe”. I never noticed or realized the anxiety he had while getting ready to read, but his vision therapist did. When getting ready to do any homework, he’d frequently need to eat, go to the bathroom, or he’d “have to sleep”. </p></li>
<li><p>He is too interested in Minecraft. He built an elaborate mansion for himself on Minecraft. When he showed it to me, he had bookshelves in every room with books (like our house). He said “I don’t know why I even put books there.” I think he wants to read, but is still frustrated. Yes, I’ve tried taking things away, although he doesn’t actually have much to take away. Yes, I know I could take him to a therapist to discuss his feelings. At the end of the day though, no matter how he feels, he ultimately has to choose to read. </p></li>
<li><p>He’s very popular with kids whereever he goes. If anything, I’m worried this scholastic issue won’t be resolved before he becomes interested in dating. The private school community is small. So is the dance community. When leaving the Jewish School, he did so with a friend. After leaving the Jewish School, he knew girls from dancing at the Catholic School. The boys like him too because he is personable, funny, and he can crush an apple with his arm. 
Everywhere he goes girls fall in love with him, but then they don’t bother because he doesn’t respond. He still holds open doors for everyone. </p></li>
<li><p>I haven’t “lost him” yet. He still talks to me. I tell him that I’m only human and I can’t fix everything, but he’s got to do his part. He hears what I say, even if he doesn’t always do what I ask. He could have stayed at the progressive school, I left it up to him. He voluntarily had his long hair chopped off to change schools to the Catholic one. Aside from the Now that he’s in a Catholic School, I’ve commented that he’s had comparative religion before college. He tells me that he thinks the private school teachers should not be allowed to dye their hair since he had to cut his, and he said they should wear a uniform like he has to. He’s very observant.</p></li>
</ol>
<p>I guess that was another very long, but hopefully more thorough answer.</p>
<p>When a kid has a seemingly persistent problem, over time, you get him tested- not just for IQ, reading level, or admission to a school, but to learn what affects his ability to tick more or less on track with other kids. It’s not unusual to see delays in how some kids grow, but this has gone on a long time. You need a professional able to look at a host of possible reasons or causes. How did the idea of a behavioral opto doc come up? What was the 504 predicated on?</p>
<p>Part of dealing with a challenging child is being aware of our own actions and interactions, too. How we may be contributing, etc. </p>
<p>I’m really confused by the lack of understanding of all of the inquiries I’ve made. Neither the private nor the public school suggested he be referred for an IEP. On my own, I made an appointment with a neuropsychologist in 12/12 for testing for learning disabilities to be conducted on 2/13. In the interim, I made him read aloud, and discovered the line skipping. I googled that, and found out about vision therapy. I sought out the behavioral optometrist. I paid for the testing myself. I took the results to the private school and demanded accomodations. The behavioral optometrist has a license as a Dr. of Optometry on his wall. He said gave me abundant literature, he said that the behaviors of my son all are caused by this lifelong convergence insufficiency of the eyes. He said that 20 weeks of therapy would resolve the whole problem. Neither he nor the private school ever suggested an IEP should still be sought for a child who could be cured. In fact, when I told the neuropsychologist what had been discovered, and that he was going to vision therapy, she cancelled the appointment pending an outcome. My son just completed the 20 weeks in 7/13. He was not in school then. Even after “fixing” the eyes, the brain has to adjust. They were in conflict, and they still may be. Additionally, I don’t know, maybe his brain is wired permanently based on this eye problem in a way that he may continue to struggle with visual processing. I have amblyopia of the eyes, and I know what the brain can do, because it shut down vision to my weaker left eye. He just went back to school 9/13 of this year, and here I am now saying “I’m not sure this worked, not sure if this was enough time to see results”. He’s got an appointment with the vision therapist to check progress this week. </p>
<p>I understand that an IEP is a legally enforceable document at the public school. I’ve been flat out told by private high schools that they won’t accept kids with IEPs, only 504s. Hypothetically, if I were to call this neuropsych back up and say “vision therapy didn’t work, evaluate him”, what would really be the outcome? A statement that he has verbal and comprehension deficits due to visual processing issues, and anxiety as a result? What’s the solution that hasn’t been tried? What good is the piece of paper when the teachers don’t even follow a 504? I have a friend whose son has autism, she’s got to pay the private school tuition, plus the cost of an aide at the private school to assist him, plus she pays a private tutor at home. Her daughter with a TBI is also at private school and has to keep up with the work or get out. </p>
<p>Also, I don’t have 60 days to discuss with the principal what to do about math! She’s going to get notice on Tuesday that he passed the Algebra Regents. He’s currently in that class. Do I agree that despite passing, his grade was low, and he might benefit from solidifying his Algebra skills? Would I rather he continue to do that, rather than drop into an 8th grade math course? Sure. But not with her, a teacher who doesn’t honor a 504. He’s at risk of failing any class with her. Because it’s not going to serve his interest if he fails her courses. Because as it stands now, as far as the state is concerned and any high school is concerned, he’s got a 74 in the course from the other school and a passing Regents. Why would I want to add a failing grade from a teacher who does not respect a 504? I’m not going to trade one set of problems for another. I’d rather he get out of her class altogether, yet they do not have another middle school math teacher. And if he’s going to take Geometry in 9th grade, maybe he should get a head start. But again, there’s the issue of whether he has to be registered for a math class at a school, since he’s not homeschooled. I do appreciate the link that it’s seat time, not credit. I just wonder what flexibility there is on where that seat is.</p>
<p>My son went to a Catholic elementary school where it was a very big deal in 8th grade to get into certain Catholic high school which was want most of the class did. One of my son’s close friends was a young man who simply had so many issues, that it was highly likely that unless they were quickly resolved, high school was going to be even more of a struggle. But despite what many of us told her, including some at the school, she and her husband really pushed to get him into one of the better schools. He did not get into the ones most wanted, but the parents (and he) absolutely did not want to go to the ones that I truly believe would have done the most good. So he’s struggling in high school now and how much he has absorbed during these high school years is questionable making him a poor candidate for college. </p>
<p>I truly believe smaller, less intense school can be the answer for kids who have gaps, not just in their academics but in study skills, class participation, organization, behavior, motivation, and executive function skills. It is much more important for our kids to advance in those areas than learn more in on the academic ladder, sometimes by pure osmosis or by family help that cannot be continued as the student gets older.</p>
<p>I do suggest you look for a smaller, less strenuous school. I suggest Catholic schools because they are often the only affordable options for many of us, and even then barely so. Finding a public district to address these sort of needs, I have not seen successfully done. i went the private route, because I could not find a public district that could address my kids’ issues as well as the private schools. I tried, oh, yes, I tried and it sadly did not work out. I wish it had, as I spend a lot of money on K12 education that I could have used for the kids’ college and could use right now.</p>
<p>Cptofthehouse, I appreciate your post about school choice. It is similar here. My son’s first choice school is an all boys school, it is highly ranked, and he’s on the waitlist. My attraction is that they have a computer department he’d like, I think that he seems to need structure. Frankly, I admit, I think he’d be more compliant with work with male teachers. On the other hand, he did make it into the 2nd choice school. It is co-ed, definitely not as rigorous as the first, but you can grow as you want. I’m truly not sure how much they’d help kids with disabilities, but his former science teacher recommended the co-ed school. She felt that my son was not up to the culture of academic competitiveness at the 1st choice school. She’s probably right if I were to judge him now. But at the same time, he has time to grow until September. Both of these are very close to home. My son shadowed at the all boys school and said that he’s not sure if he wants to be at an all boys school because he’s always had girls around at dancing. He knows kids at both schools.</p>
<p>For all the info you have provided, I’m still not clear if you are being advised and referred by a doc or clinician. It seems the only exploration was the opto-? </p>
<p>
</p>
<p>In order to get a Carter or Nickerson letter, your child must have an IEP and it must be determined by the CSE that there is no school in NYC that can offer him a free and appropriate education . However, with the flexible special education models in many schools, Nickerson letters are getting harder to obtain. There use to be a time when a parent would call and ask do you offer A, B, C or D a school said no, and that was the basis for the letter. The process has gotten much tighter.</p>
<p><a href=“http://schools.nyc.gov/Academics/SpecialEducation/SEP/determination/timeline.htm”>http://schools.nyc.gov/Academics/SpecialEducation/SEP/determination/timeline.htm</a></p>
<p>My son has a pediatrician with an excellent reputation. Over the summer, he was informed of my son’s school issues, and he was aware of the vision therapy. At that point, we were on the fence as to whether to allow him to proceed to 9th grade, or to provide a gap year by moving him to another school. My husband and I had purchased books on required reading lists not just for one, but numerous potential private high schools. We went camping for 2 weeks, and everyone read but him, unless there was yelling. We ultimately agreed to allow him to earn comic books (which he was willing to read!) in exchange for reading and doing math work. Our son was allowed to visit numerous high schools. The first choice high school required 3 300+ page books! My son acknowledged to the pediatrician that he couldn’t read all of that, but still wanted to go to the school. Giving him the year to grow was to help him still have a chance at that. After hearing it all, the pediatrician said to my son, “Well, you are either going to repeat this grade, or you will likely be repeating the 9th”. Also, my son had been a failure to thrive baby, had been very physically weak and allergic until he was about 6 and went into gymnastics. He is a summer baby, and for him, it was a mistake to start him in school when he could have waited another year. Frankly, I couldn’t wait to get him out the door. The pediatrician stated that he had delayed Kindergarten for his own child, and said that doing this gap year was really the last chance to allow him to grow before high school.</p>
<p>He also has a cardiologist. Again, I told him there were school issues. My son grew enormously this past year, and despite being an athlete, he’s often short of breath when running/doing aerobics. All he had to say was that his heart looked good. </p>
<p>I’ve consulted with the school counselor at every school I go to. The last one, they put him in “metacognitive strategies”. I do think that his organization improved. I also think it’s somewhat disintegrated since he’s come to this new school. The first week he was there, the math teacher did not know of the 504. He left the room with a test to go to the room he was supposed to, and when he returned, she yelled at him “What is your problem?” and demanded my phone number. When I came to get him afterschool, he was shaking and sobbing in the hall, and said he wasn’t going back. We told him that he had to. I really feel that I have to give him credit for agreeing to repeat the grade even though he was entitled by law to move on, and he cut his hair for their rules, and he was really mistreated at the school prior but still packed his bag and gave this school a chance, and he now feels powerless and unwanted again. But I also don’t see how it’s going to be any better if I were to yank him out with only 5 more months of school and put him in a failing public school. And I do think they’d force him into 9th grade, which would also be a disaster. So I’m trying to find a way for him to finish out this school, be prepared to move forward, and meet his math requirement. I want my son to reach his fullest potential, and I’ve spent tons of time and money to make it happen. There are ideals, and then there are realities. The good news is that my son did pass Algebra Regents, which is technically the only math exam you must pass to graduate high school. If he finishes living environment, he will also have met that graduation requirement.</p>
<p>Yes, as for what Sybbie said, I believe that even if I had an IEP, the public school would say they have a plan at their school. I read a review on google from a person who complained that he was dumped into a room for 2 years where every child was violent, and that he had undiagnosed autism. I know of a child who had to have a spinal fusion in October and the school didn’t give him work for 5 weeks. I actually think that the Gow School may be appropriate, and they now take days students and are only 45 minutes away (or you can board). But at 50K, I don’t see that there’d be enough aid for us to afford it. As it is, I’ve cut back on work so much to help him, and we had to pay vision therapy out of pocket. I’ve looked it up, and there’s at least one lawsuit where a parent was turned down reimbursement.</p>
<p>Also, for some background, I put his sister through this public school. In 2nd grade, I had to drag her to school kicking and screaming. Her teacher told me that not only did she not know math and reading, she lacked common sense. Accused her of ignoring her directions. I could not get a change of teacher. The school did a psych eval and said she could word decode 3 grades levels ahead, although could not comprehend. Said her issues were “behavioral”, and recommended grade retention. I took her privately to a speech/hearing clinic, and she had an auditory processing difficulty whereby she could not remember anything she heard. With this diagnosis, I told her sternly that I was going to advocate for her to move on, but if she failed again, I was not going to ask them to pass her on. She never was a problem again. I obtained an FM Trainer. I found out later they didn’t put it on her. She had speech and AIS services for years. She sang, played the flute, and learned to compensate for her hearing by reading. By 7th grade she won the spelling bee. By 9th grade, she complained the math was too easy. The school said “Too bad, we made those decisions in 6th grade”. Her speech and handwriting began to degrade at times, but the school refused to give her a 504 because they felt grades in the high 80s/low 90s were good enough. I didn’t really know my rights back then. When it came time for college, they did nothing for college readiness, I did it all. She graduated 1st chair flute and was the only one of her class to make it to SUNY Geneseo and Binghamton. They actually tried to convince her in guidance to not go away, and go to the community college. She now has her B.S. in Speech Therapy from SUNY Geneseo.</p>
<p>Why did you wait to inform the pediatrician? </p>
<p>
</p>
<p>What did he score on the integrated Algebra regents? </p>
<p>If he scored below an 80 (the minimum threshold to determine college readiness) it may be to his advantage to retake. </p>
<p>Also since the state has recently added 3 new diploma, is he remotely interested in getting an Advanced Regents with Mastery Diploma? If yes, then he will need an 85 on the math regents to demonstrate mastery. </p>
<p>Lookingforward, it wasn’t the first time I mentioned school issues to the pediatrician. I mentioned them the year before as well. I was specifically referring to the fact that I consulted with someone about efforts that had been made and a difficult choice to be made. And seriously, “Why did you wait to inform the pediatrician?” </p>
<p>Let me ask you, and anyone else of the same ilk, because I have shared a lot and have been very polite thus far about the lack of constructive help vs. criticism from some-- what is the purpose of the question like that? What difference does an answer to that make? To berate me for not doing enough, for not having a crystal ball, for not being at the perfectly right professional at the perfectly right time? I’m HERE, aren’t I? Will this again be another effort for me to handle a problem correctly, only to be blown off? Please, if you are not going to help me solve the issue of current math placement, or provide constructive advice on HOW TO MOVE FORWARD, then why are you here?</p>
<p>Otherwise, I am aware that if this reading/verbal comprehension issue continues, he will not be able to manage the foreign language requirement in high school, and I will be compelled to get an IEP to get him exempted so he can still get a Regents diploma. Since nobody seems to know the options and what will happen if he does not continue with this teacher, I’ll go and research as to whether an 8th grader can get math credit via independent study.</p>
<p>Sybbie, yes he did get below an 80, he got a 69. Which I know is not good. However, considering he only studied the test for a few days due to homework, and he never actually learned cos/sin/tan and several other topics at the non-Regents school he took it at, I’m surprised he passed at all! I left him on his own to study the weekend before, and he was scoring only about a 50 percent. The night before the test, I sat with him and we both had a copy of the test, and we saw who could answer each question first. Whatever he didn’t know, I taught, or got out the Barron’s and showed him. We figured out his calculator was misprogrammed too. I regretted that I didn’t do that with him sooner, as I knew that one practice test couldn’t have covered everything. But still, he scored almost 20 points higher on the real test after one practice test with me. I’ve already informed him that I expect him to retake the test for a higher grade and achieve at least an 85. But he doesn’t have to sit in this woman’s Algebra class to do that. I’m also thinking of having him study for and take an SAT subject test for whatever correlates to the Algebra material. And have him study Geometry in the summer.</p>
<p>…Because, despite the voluminous detail you have offered, it is not clear you had followed some pattern guided by a professional. And because this has gone on for so long. “Over the summer, he was informed-” I am not of any ilk. </p>
<p>You may have a math issue, but you also have a reading issue, how it puts his development behind, and his sensitivities to deal with. As I understand info I followed through Sybbie’s link, an IEP follows an evaluation. You have not said you got this evaluation for him (or I missed it in the long posts.) </p>
<p>The “long posts” were an effort to be exhaustive and eliminate repeat typing. He has a reading issue because of visual convergence insufficiency that remained undiagnosed and untreated until he was 13 years old! Nobody guided me, no professional. Which despite spending 6 hours a day with licensed teachers, none of which figured it out. Which again, I figured out myself, sought out a professional to diagnose and treat it, and said treatment has only concluded in the past 6 months. Which, again, was supposed to eliminate the eye pain that caused my son to avoid reading like the plague, and thereby resolve his “reading issue”. I spoke to the optometrist on a weekly basis about how my son was being treated at his former school. They were horrified and said I should get him out of there. They said resolution of the issue was presumed to eliminate any need for an IEP or any other problem. As the Dr. looked at my son last month, and said to him “I have 3 things for you to do to maintain your therapy–You need to read, read, and read!” Heck, I am not a Dr., for all I know the vision therapy was a failure. Why would the Dr. tell me after taking $3K of my money? But yes, there is a “reading issue” in that my son is still trying to get by just on listening to class lecture. Which he cannot do at this level. </p>
<p>
Good grief. This is patent nonsense, just garbage the optometrist is feeding you to convince you of this questionable diagnosis, get your son back for multiple appointments and put thousands in his pocket. The following New York Times Magazine article makes it clear that the “therapy” practiced these “behavioral optometrists” has never been proven effective in any controlled clinical study:
<a href=“http://www.nytimes.com/2010/03/14/magazine/14vision-t.html?pagewanted=1&hp”>http://www.nytimes.com/2010/03/14/magazine/14vision-t.html?pagewanted=1&hp</a>
No wonder your son is still having difficulties after all the “therapy”. I’m sorry this happened. But please, for the sake of your son’s future, get him to the neuropsych to be evaluated for learning disabilities NOW. </p>