Need some advice about my situation

Pre-Med & Medical School Pre-Med Topics
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This is a long read and it will have some aspects that may seem unrelated to this thread, but the background is important.

Basically, NYU and Cornell were my top choices for undergrad because of various reasons-strong pre-med programs, competitive and high achieving peers, and location as they both were in NY (my home state). I knew these were the schools I wanted to go since I was 10, so I worked really hard. I was valediction of my middle school. I got into a really competitive high school (consistently ranked in the top 40 public high school). In high school, I had a 4.0, took 11 APs (4s and 5s on all of them), had really great extracurriculars and scored in in the top 1% on my SAT.

I won’t go into all the personal and familial reasons, but I had to opt for a lowly ranked state school instead of NYU and Cornell because I couldn’t leave home. The difference between the state school and my dream schools is vast. The classes here are not competitive at all and I feel like I had harder classes in my high school than here. The students are like to brag about scores that are not impressive at all (had someone tell me a 900 SAT score is impressive). It feels like everyone around me is just praising mediocracy. I hate that I feel this way about my peers because I get that it comes off as rude and snobbish, but I can’t help myself. Every time I think about how I had to give on my dreams after working so hard and long for them, I get really angry and start to think horrible things about my university and its student body.

Fast forward to current time, but all the sadness took a hold on me and I started caring less about my classwork. Even if I didn’t like my school, I was still motivated to work towards being a competitive med school applicant. But as time went on, I became more upset and it eventually to depression and withdrawing from my courses.

Now this is the part where I need some sense to be talked into me. I recently found about NYU SPS. I took some to research and found that they have online degree programs that I could do from home. I thought that I could do this and it would allow me to finally be apart of the NYU community like I so very much want. I would continue to take pre-med classes from my current uni while doing my online degree from NYU. I would be a full time NYU student and then take the pre-med classes on the side depending on how much I can handle so that med schools see that i’m still completing my requirements. Then once my NYU degree is done, I would go back to my current uni and complete my science degree. This way I can attend my dream school but also have an in-person degree that med schools appreciate.

Now after all that I just said, be completely honest with me. I sound ridiculous, don’t I? I bet if med schools saw what I did, they would think I’m insane and I would not blame them. Be as mean as you guys want because I need the sense to be talked into me. But please no sarcasm, I can’t tell sarcasm from reading something through the screen.

Or on the other hand, if anyone thinks that I don’t sound ludicrous, do you think that this might actually work?

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@WayOutWestMom

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The pre med classes at your current school will be hard.

I don’t know why you are where you are -did you not get into NYU or Cornell or couldn’t afford ?

I’ll wait for way out west mom but I’ll say this - I was recently treated by a top academic hospital. When I look at the residents undergrads, it goes from the I never heard of it St Benedict’s to low rated flagships - such as Kansas, Kansas State, Kentucky, directional sich as Northern Illinois, and yes the Duke, Vandy and Princeton types but a small fraction.

You can dismiss your current school but no doubt the pre med classes are hard. But you have to have the right attitude.

You chose that school for a reason, that school is not limiting ( if anything you’d get a high gpa), but you need the right mindset.

Good luck and I look forward to way out seats guidance.

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Chasing NYU SPS online for prestige… thinking the students have higher than 900 SAT….
Be ware, you are young and sound a bit immature to be needing affirmation of surrounding yourself with NYU people online. How can you be part of NYU community if you’re online?

You’d have to think carefully, what would your reason be for wanting to enroll? I don’t think what you’ve shared here would help you be admitted.
From NYU SPS:
“ Application Requirements for Associate and Bachelor’s Degrees:

  • Free online application form
  • Transcripts
  • Statement of purpose
  • One recommendation (optional)
  • Resume”
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In my defense, when I tell people the college I currently go to, they automatically assume that I had low stats in high school and that really hurts me. How would you feel if you worked hard at something only to then have people belittle you because they don’t realize how much effort you out in it? As for the reason, I like their major for social science. It seems interesting and would help me see new perspectives that I’m not getting currently with my major.

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I get that you’re right, but it just sucks when every adult told me that if I work hard anything I wanted would be mind and then it never happened. I then think about all the wasted hours I had spend in high school studying when I could have made friends and actually had a good childhood that wasn’t spent in books. Just to answer why I’m so upset about the disappointment.

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That’s the thing though. The classes aren’t hard. I’ve taken most of my pre-reqs and had no difficulty getting As. I’m not happy with how little effort I have to put in currently. It doesn’t feel like I’m attending uni and I imagine that would not be good for me when I attend med school because of how rigorous their curriculum is.

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Kids are at safeties all the time. Both mine are - and both got paid to be there. It’s not why they chose them - they liked them - but both got into high ranked programs and both chose low ranked schools.

You know who you are - and you are no less a student because of the school you attend.

There are Ivy level kids likely at every flagship in America. They go for cost or location or sports or whatever.

It’s hard to understand this and perhaps there’s a confidence issue at play - but you know who you are - be proud!!

btw - many don’t get what they want. Not everyone stays at the Ritz Carlton. Some stay at hte Comfort Inn. But with the proper mindset and effort (go ask your profs for extra work, do research, etc) - with the proper mindset, the Comfort Inn resident can have just as good an experience as the Ritz Carlton person.

You are getting a college degree - and that is a very cool thing. Not everyone is that fortunate!!

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Can you tell us what college or university you currently attend? Also, what year are you in?

There are hundreds of very good colleges and universities in the US. You can get accepted to a very good medical school coming from any one of a very wide variety of undergraduate schools.

Cornell and NYU do get a higher percentage of their incoming freshman students into medical school compared to a lower ranked university. However a lot of this, and some might speculate maybe even all of this, comes from the consistent high caliber and competitive nature of the freshman who start off as incoming students at NYU and Cornell. For any one very strong and very competitive incoming freshman, you can get a great education at a wide range of colleges and universities.

There are almost certain to be other very strong students at the school that you are attending. They won’t be 100% of the student body as they might be at some very highly selective university. Maybe where you are 20% or 30% of the student body are very strong students, and another 30 or 40% are relatively strong. These students can still stand out academically and do well. Many might not stand out socially because in some cases they may be the quiet kid who just sits in the corner and pays attention.

Someone I know well went to a local university ranked in the 100 to 140 range with a very good merit scholarship, lived at home while an undergraduate student, and then attended an Ivy League university for graduate school. Someone else attended an undergraduate university ranked in the 100 to 140 range with a very good merit scholarship, and is now solidly on track to graduate from a “top 5” DVM program in the spring (ie, about 4 months from now). It is very common to see strong students attending affordable undergraduate programs near home that are not super highly ranked and then attend higher ranked graduate programs (whether MD, DO, DVM, PhD, master’s degree, or something else).

Your premed classes are going to get tough at some point. You will see some of the weaker students just not being able to handle it. However, the effort that you put in throughout high school and the effort you are putting in now will help you in the future when classes start to get tougher. You should not be surprised if your next mid term or the one after that or a couple next year are harder than you expect. You will probably see some mid term exams with a class average under 60, and maybe under 50. The students who can pull off a 75 or 80 or 85 on these tough exams will be the ones who are at least somewhat more likely to be on track to get into medical school.

A lot of the premed classes have labs. I do not understand how you can do these classes on-line.

Getting an MD is a long and tough path. It takes a full 8 years. If your dream is to become an MD then keep your eye on the dream. You can get there.

I might add that our daughter who is getting a DVM had a few discouraging moments. Some patients (animals in her case) died. At least one vet tech was annoying. A breakup occurred at some point. The same message “keep your eye on the dream” was useful in her case also. Her dream is a DVM rather than an MD, but the need for focus over a full 8 years of university is the same.

Both daughters had majors which overlapped a lot with premed classes. They both found some classes to be more difficult than other classes. One for example said that organic chemistry was “the hardest B- that I ever had in my life”, but then looked forward to the math and physics classes as easy A’s. My other daughter regarding organic chemistry said “what’s the big deal”, but had to work hard in biochemistry and parasitology (I am not sure whether these are required premed classes, she has a research focus). You might similarly find some premed classes to be easy, but do not expect them all to be unless you are graduating in four months and have already completed the last premed class.

I also wonder if you should discuss some of your concerns with your guidance counselor.

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Ask yourself this very important question: What is your goal?

Is it more important for you to attend a “prestigious” college for your undergraduate degree, or is it more important for you to be a physician?

If the former is more important for you, than do your best to transfer to a more “prestigious college”.

However, you are saying that your goal is to be a doctor. For that, an online degree is not a good idea.

Many people will tell you that what determines whether you are accepted to medical school are your GPA, your MCAT, and your medical-related activities, which include things like research experience, shadowing doctors, etc.

Those “many people” are correct.

The problem with an online degree, even from a “prestigious” college, is that you cannot get the research opportunities in biology labs (because your professors are in NYC), you cannot make connections with faculty for recommendation letters (because it’s very difficult to do this online), and the advisors cannot help you get opportunities to shadow doctors in local hospitals and clinics (because they are in NYC, and don’t have connections in your city).

More importantly, your main complaints are about your peers, but taking online classes at NYU will not provide you with NYU peers, because it is extremely difficult for you to develop those relationships online.

As I wrote - you need to be finding opportunities to work in research labs and in hospitals. You are also much more likely to find similarly minded people in those labs and hospitals than in your classes.

Bottom line - you need to stop focusing on your four years in undergraduate, and focus instead on your decade or more of medical school + residency + fellowship, and your decades of being a doctor.

Your undergraduate isn’t your goal, it’s something that you need to do in order to achieve your goals. Stop thinking of how you can have a “better undergraduate experience” and start thinking “how will I use these four years in a manner that will help me achieve my ultimate goals?”.

I will again bring up a friend of mine who attended a college with students whose academic are no better than those at your college. Yet they did their PhD at one of the top universities in the USA and are now faculty members at a very top university. That is because they focused on their ultimate goal of a career in their chosen field, not on minor goals like “I want to attend a prestigious undergraduate college”

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I am going to assume that you are at one of the smaller SUNY schools. One of my kids attended a small SUNY college and went to an Ivy League for grad school. Her advisor told her that she came in very well prepared.

I struggle to understand how an online degree will help you feel like you are part of the NYU community. I do not recommend doing this.

You reported that you get A’s with little effort. I suggest that you use this to your advantage and think about your long term goal. I would reach out to professors and ask about research projects etc. I would reach out to local hospitals and schools and ask to volunteer. Why not volunteer in a title 1 school?

I just looked at my daughter’s small SUNY (and it is not one of the more popular ones) and read that students were accepted to many, many different medical schools, including Harvard and NYU.

I would try and embrace your current situation by looking for opportunities- one of my kids taught yoga to homeless women. Again, speak with a Prof and ask about available opportunities.

Good luck!

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If med school is your goal, there’s no need to peak, prestige-wise, with your undergrad university. As others have suggested, keep your eye on the prize and keep getting those A’s. Since they come so easy for you, use your spare time to get some hours at hospitals, nursing homes or even become an EMT. Those experiences are gold when applying to medical schools.

I can imagine it stings not to be able to attend a school that you worked so hard to get into - but undergrad is such a small blurb on your whole life. Once you begin your work as a board-certified doctor, all of this will fade into obscurity. No one will ask where you went to undergrad at parties. They’ll ask where you went to med school or where you did your residency or fellowship.

Also, applying and getting acceptances to med school can be a very humbling experience. I have no doubt that you are an excellent student but you’ll be competing against many other excellent students for a few highly coveted spots. Best to adjust your expectations now and focus on setting yourself up to be the best applicant you can be.

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I hope you can have a good day, have some fun as you sound stressed. You are doing the best you can where you are and making sacrifices.

You don’t need to be a science major at your college, you could try social science.

I’m sorry you’re unhappy with peers or feeling lonesome. I hope you can get some help.

As others have said, there are other strong students with med or grad school goals and ambitions.

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I don’t understand how NYU SPS online is appealing, or what community you would be part of?

Separately, an issue that hasn’t been raised is you say the classes at your current school are easy. It is important that the classes prepare you to do well on the MCAT…do you feel that’s the case? Is there a track record of people from your school doing well on the MCAT?

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In my opinion, you need to look at why being at a “lowly ranked state school” sent you into a tailspin instead of a 4.0 (if it’s as easy as you say).

Med schools look at GPA, MCAT scores, essay, recommendations, medical experience and interviews. They don’t need to be impressed by an Ivy League education because they are in their own league.

I couldn’t even tell you where my doctors went to undergraduate school, or even medical school, unless they have a diploma hanging on the wall.

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Can you reach out to former students who were accepted to medical school?

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I’m going echo everything you’ve told above.

Med school admissions are not driven by prestige. The school name on the diploma, while not entirely irrelevant, is among the least important factors when deciding who to interview and admit for med school. Everything else–GPA, MCAT score, ECs, LORs are 1000x more important.

(You don’t need to believe me–believe actual adcomms. See p. 15 of this document for the national survey of med school admission offices: https://www.aamc.org/media/18901/download)

Med schools strongly dislike fully online degrees. Many will not even consider students with online degrees for admission. So earning an online degree will be held against you during admissions. (Unless you have very good reason not to attend an in-person college. Are you working full time to support your family, unable to taken even weekend or night classes? Have you been stationed aboard a navy destroyer in the South China Sea for the last 5 years? Those are reasons adcomms might find acceptable. “I don’t like the relative lack of “wow factor” at my undergrad” is not.)

Online school has some pretty strong disadvantages. Online instructors are often not the same professors who would teach you on campus. Most often they are part-time adjuncts. So the educational experience you think you’ll find NYU just won’t be the same in the online sessions. Plus asynchronous instruction makes getting to know and interact with your classmates and instructors difficult to impossible. How can you engage in a vibrant discussion when most people aren’t even “there” at the same time you are? It’s frustrating and discouraging. Also consider-- how will an instructor you never met and have never had a face-to-face conversation with be able to write you a strong LOR for med school? They don’t know you and really can’t say much about you other than she did her work in class.

I can understand you feel disappointed that you’re not at the university you think you deserve, but you need to think about your goal. If med school is your ultimate goal, keep your eye on the goal line. Your undergrad will get you there IF (and this is a big IF), you are willing to give your whiny attitude and work toward it.

No undergrad prepares you for med school or the MCAT. Not even Harvard You have to prepare yourself.

Classes too easy? Intro level classes are often not especially challenging by design. Upper level classes will be harder. And if they’re not? You can always make them harder by asking the professor for extra readings or projects. (My SIL is a university professor–he’s always willing to help out students who want more.)

Pre-meds also need to work on getting those all important ECs. If you want to go to med school, you need to find a way to engage in face-to-face patient contact. Work on earning a CNA or EMT license, then volunteer or work using your training.
(These job are not prestigious. They’re grunt work. But you have to pay your dues if you want to go to med school.) Find a cause or charity you feel strongly about, one that helps to relieve the day-to-day suffering of those less fortunate than yourself. Start volunteering a few hours each week. Med school expect applicants to have this. Plus helping others will help you feel better about yourself.

One of my daughters went to a less than prestigious undergrad (University Near Mom) because of a number of complicated family factors. (Father and grandfather with terminal cancer diagnoses–among other things.) She did OK, ended up with multiple med school acceptances. She decided to attend her state med school because it’s very inexpensive and did her medical residency at Yale.

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OP- hugs. I know it’s hard letting go of a plan you’ve been emotionally attached to for a long time.

Online school is the exact opposite of what you are looking for. It’s NOT about building community with academically strong peers-- some of your classmates will be 45 years old and looking to get the degree they weren’t able to get in their 20’s. Some of them will be active duty military who barely have time to study, let alone develop social relationships with other students (If they are on a base they’re already living with thousands of people!) Nothing wrong with these people-- but they aren’t looking to compare notes with you, or meet up for coffee.

“Bloom where you are planted”. That could be step one for you. Figuring out how to make your current situation more intense intellectually. Professors love students like you- so seek them out. Ask “do you need an assistant- fact-checking for an article, editing a grant application, joining your research team?”

Step two- go outside your comfort zone. Ask for a meeting with the Health Careers advisor and find out if there’s a hospice training new volunteers in the area, if there’s an EMT class starting soon, if there’s a mobile dental clinic in the area that visits homeless shelters that needs an untrained but eager volunteer. If you are serious about becoming a physician, any experiences you have with actual vulnerable people is going to help you. No, not to make your applications look good (you can worry about that junior year) but because the best way to validate your interest in medicine is to see- up close- people who need help.

Step three- explore new activities. Salsa dancing, Poetry readings, the Science Fiction club, the sourdough bread bakers. Once you take your mind off your “Woe is me, I’m not at NYU” feelings, they may be replaced by different feelings- “hey, that was fun”, or “I never knew that Aldous Huxley experimented with so many psychedelic drugs”.

You can do this!

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You asked us to be honest, so I will. I am not trying to be mean, but if you want sense talked into you, I hope this is helpful…

First, having good grades in high school entitles no one to a prize. The prize is that you worked hard and it will serve you well as you go through life. That’s it. That’s the prize. Not Cornell or NYU.

You did not “have to give up on your dreams.” Circumstances beyond your control lead to decisions that you couldn’t do much about. Instead of being the best student you could be at the lowly college, where you could distinguish yourself, you felt as though you were better than others at your school. You didn’t want to be around people you deemed to be slackers.

  1. Maybe a lot of kids at your college also had circumstances beyond their control.
  2. Maybe they have to commute from home and it’s the closest college.
  3. Maybe they messed up in high school and are excelling in college. Not everyone enters college as an acdemically inclined student. Sometimes people have to mature.
  4. Maybe they were offered a scholarship and it was the most affordbale option.
  5. Maybe a hundred other scenarios.

I think you have allowed this idea that you deserve something better to steer you away from the goal: a degree, and med school.

Others have given you great advice. I’ll add that if you need to remain in your college, do so. An online degree for med school is not helpful, at all. Get the best grades you can. Retake classes if you must. Get to know your professors because good recs are really important. Knowing profs will be useful in getting research and other opportunities. Get involved in something that is relevant to med school.

It’s okay to feel disappointed when things don’t go as you expect. It’s not okay to blame all the stduents around you. YOU are responsible for what your future becomes. You work with what you have. You go forth and conquer. Good luck.

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I’m a Cornell grad. Started out with pre med intentions. Only three people in my entire circle of friends actually stayed premed and went to med school. It was brutal. Means on exams were in the 30s and 40s. Hyper competitive. Most of us weren’t in any of the stats published about med school acceptances because we figured it out early and switched intentions/majors. Based on my experience, I always take med school acceptance rates with a very big grain of salt. I have heard from current students, it is still extremely difficult today. I often wonder if I would have stuck with it if I had been at a less competitive school.

IMO, you have a better shot of med school from where you are. Knock your grades out of the park, do well on your MCAT, and get the experiences you need. If you are the top of your class, work hard and connect with your professors, you’ll get great recommendations. Be the big fish in your pond!

Don’t waste your time with online NYU, for all the reasons mentioned above and that it takes time away from you building what you actually need for your med school application.

Good luck!

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