Third time parent here, but this is the first time I have a kid considering smaller, liberal arts colleges. Older kids go to state flagships and we pay full price.
Youngest kid has one school that she has been eyeing. We are going to visit next weekend. I did the net price calculator a month ago and it said she would qualify for a 40k merit scholarship. So it fit our pricing parameters. I got an email from said school tonight asking if I wanted to run the NPC and I did it again. It no longer included questions about home equity, which was interesting, but also included no merit aid with the exact same stats. I typically fill the NPCs out anonymously, but I didn’t on this one when I completed it a month ago. Do you think that schools will start targeting families that they think can full pay? I’m super annoyed because it may look (on paper) like we can afford 90k a year, but we are not able to do that for any of our kids. So I feel like this is going to shift the list for this third kid. Anyone else seeing this change with the NPCs?
It is certainly possible that a college could change its financial aid and merit scholarship formulas, and change its net price calculator accordingly. The time frame that you noticed the change seems to be a likely time for colleges to make such changes, going from the previous application year formulas to the upcoming application year formulas.
OP, so many of the posters here in the cafe are well past having college-age kids. You might get more responses about people’s experiences if you post in the Parents Forum. Good luck!
Thread moving to “paying for college” by moderator
It’s possible that this school’s merit aid parameters changed for the next school year. This could be due to financial constraints on the school, or they may have shifted their financial aid focus from merit aid to need based aid. Why not call the school, explain the situation, and ask about the difference?
Depends on the school.
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Most schools need you more than you need them - so there’s a chance they price themselves out of customers, which with less students expected going to college, makes their job even tougher.
Don’t forget, they are a business.
Short of a few tippy top schools, this is most schools.
It might simply be they removed it from the NPC. You should verify on their website that they continue to offer merit aid.
Good lucck.
I didn’t want to blow up the college without understanding if the change was specific to the school or part of a larger trend. Mainly, I have been thinking about the coming demographic cliff and economic crisis as a reason that colleges might want families that are able to pay full price. I was thinking that they would continue to throw some merit to entice cash pay families to attend. But, I’m realizing that our kid may need to change her list to state flagships like her siblings, if our goal is to pay 50-60k max per year. Just wondering if some of the smaller colleges with strong merit might be pulling back?
Most small colleges will need to get more, not less aggressive.
At $50-60K, you can find - likely most LACs - and a boat load of publics - both instate and OOS and including public LACs.
Agressive meaning you think that they would be pursuing full-ish pay kids? I assumed that schools would be courting this kid because of our ability to pay 50-60k/year. This not a top LAC, but well regarded in the northeast. I’m just not sure how to guide our kid because we are definitely not spending 90k a year, but I thought it could be a good fit.
Everyone wants full pay kids - but not everyone can get them.
The tippy top can.
Most can’t - hence they discount.
What kind of school are we talking about.
In the end, you guide like this - son, we can spend $50K tuition room and board. Don’t say $50-60K.
Pick a #.
If the school meets that cost, you can go.
If it doesn’t, you can’t - end of story.
Since we don’t qualify for need aid, you’ll need to get at least x merit for us to send you.
It’s that simple.
My daughter had a $50K budget. She liked American a lot. They gave us $15K.
There was no discussion - she knew it wasn’t on the table.
It’s all about setting expectations up front.
If he wants to apply and they offer merit (some don’t), then let him apply - but set the rule up front - even write it down and sign it like a contract if needed.
And ensure he has another school that he’s be happy to attend, that’s near assured and affordable.
And by the way, there are public LACs that will be under budget.
Yes, same with our older kids. It’s a little more fluid this time because we will only have one in college, so it gives a bit more breathing room.
What is a public LAC? We are a flagship state school family to date, so public LAC is a bit of a foreign phrase to me.
Everyone is different, of course, but when you say, you have more breathing room - if you say $50-60K to a kid, that’s $60K - and who knows, they might think you’ll bleed to $63K.
What I don’t understand is someone who doesn’t qualify for need, says $50K, and the schools offers no merit aid. Let’s say they say, I’m applying to Amherst and we’ll deal after all the decisions are in.
Well if your budget is $50K, you can’t go - right?
On another thread a student has a $35K budget but they are applying to Purdue. They asked again - will I get in. I said, hope not because you can’t go. It’s over budget - and he said I know. What’s worse than getting in somewhere you can’t go.
In your case, the school may or may not hit cost. And I’m ok with that - but you need rules. Mine got into Wash & Lee - no money. It was $81K. Off the list. Why did I let her apply? It could get to cost.
But schools like Cornell, Gtown - once I learned no merit, came off - there was no point.
If you’re saying - well the budget is $60K but we can flex higher if needed and you tell that to your son, then your budget is not $60K.
All are different of course but I think having defined rules help.
What’s a public LAC - it’s simply a liberal arts college that is public. My kid went to College of Charleston - it’s 9k kids but they call themselves an LAC.
Alabama - Montevallo
Colorado - Ft. Lewis
Connecticut - ECSU
Florida - New College
Maryland - St. Mary’s
Mass - College of Liberal Arts (MCLA)
Minnesota - UMN MOrris
New Hampshire - Keene and UNH Manchester
New Jersey - Ramapo
New YORK - SUNY Geneseo, New Paltz, Purchase.
No Carolina - UNC Asheville
Virginia - Christopher Newport, UVA WISE, Mary Washington, W&M some would say.
Just like private LACs, the term LAC is sort of up to interpretation. Is Bucknell with engineering and management an LAC or Richmond, dominated by business, an LAC.
Typically, these are also bargains relative to other LACs but you can be rest assured most every LAC at #50 in US News and below has to throw money to get kids!!
Look at a school like Connecticut College - not top but very well thought of - sounds like it might be the kind you are talking about.
Per the CDS, they accepted 2937. 216 were ED so if we take them out, that leaves 2721.
451 enrolled so take out the 216 and that leaves you with 235.
So 235 of 2721 they accepted made the decision to go. That’s 8.6% - so they gotta work real, real hard to get kids there. They need you more than you need them - so they will come with $$. Maybe not enough - but they have to pay to get butts in seat. If they are waiting for full pay -like rich kids who underperformed but want a big name - there are some but maybe not by and large.
btw - they are so concerned with this they Wait Listed 1550. Only 451 enrolled and yet they WL 4x that - in case they need to go deep, etc.
So perhaps I’m off but the way I see it, short of the Williams/Amherst/Wesleyan types, the consumer sits pretty good.
One last thing - if he wants an LAC or smaller school - there are many. He doesn’t have to settle for the flagship unless that’s what he wants. We can find you schools at $60k no problem.
To me a liberal arts college is a smaller school that focuses primarily on undergraduate education. There are quite a few that are public.
One example is the Massachusetts College of Liberal Arts. I honestly do not know whether it will fit your 50-60k / year budget out of state but it would surprise me if it doesn’t. If you are in state (which seems possible given your screen name) then it should be way under budget.
UVM (Vermont) is a bit larger but is still not a huge school (perhaps 12,000 undergrads). The full cost out of state would be over your budget, but they do have quite good merit scholarships possible for out of state students. The last time that we checked (quite a few years ago) the NPC did predict merit aid, and for us was spot on accurate. U.Maine is another relatively small public university (8,000 undergrads) that can be relatively affordable for an out of state student.
While Canada does not use the term “liberal arts college”, they do have some smaller universities that focus primarily on undergraduate education. As some examples in eastern Canada, you might look at Acadia, Bishop’s, Mount Allison, and St Francis Xavier. All are relatively small schools that focus primarily on undergraduate education, although some have a few graduate degrees (such as master’s degrees). UNB and U.PEI are also smaller schools, although I will admit that I think of U.PEI mostly for having a superb DVM program which is of course very much a graduate program. The last time that I looked most of these would fit your US$50k-60k per year goal even for an international student without aid (I have not looked recently, keep the exchange rate in mind).
I agree with others to set a budget and stick with this. We did this.
We had a similar experience. One daughter got into NEU and BU but both would have been full pay and way over budget. We said no. She went elsewhere (UVM, with good merit aid), did very well, loved in, and then switched to a major that NEU and BU don’t have (something about a lack of cows and horses on campus in downtown Boston – we got lucky). Then she graduated and thanked me for not letting her take on debt for her bachelor’s degree. At the age of 22 when on the first job a former student’s perspective may be different than when they are 18 and graduating from high school.
She wants large because that’s what her siblings have done and that’s what she’s familiar with. As a parent, I think she would thrive in a more close knit environment. But, both older kids do Greek life, which makes the large state schools feel smaller. So, I know that could be an option.
My main point with this whole thread was that I was surprised that the merit went away in the NPC. It means if she does love this college, she can’t ED, because it’s no longer likely to be in range of what we want to pay. We always say max of 50k to the kids, we just know we could, as the parents, flex to 60k a year for the right fit. But, flexing to 90k?? That would be a no. I’m surprised that a school would want to turn away families that would be “bird in the hand” with ED.
The reality is most schools want their “bird in the hand” families to be the 90k kind, not the 50k kind. But it’s better to find this out now and you’re going about it the right way. And you realize you shouldn’t apply ED as that takes away your ability to compare packages. Some families don’t understand that.
My kids had luck with merit in LACs. You just have to apply strategically in a range of selectivity and location and roll the dice in RD. Include a few more LACs that are similar to what your daughter likes so when time comes if the number one does not come through perhaps number two or three delivers. It worked for us and most of my friends. Usually what happens is the location might not be ideal or the selectivity a bit lower. But when looking for financial aid or merit something has to give. We found out that if a family is open to reasonable compromise there is always a happy outcome. Good luck to you!
And don’t forget, most LACs, as I showed with Connecticut above, don’t have good yields.
Everyone says - but have the class comes ED.
But look how many more they have to admit (and Wait List) to fill that other half!!