<p>“The Iraqi dictator was so secretive and kept information so compartmentalized that his top military leaders were stunned when he told them three months before the war that he had no weapons of mass destruction, and they were demoralized because they had counted on hidden stocks of poison gas or germ weapons for the nation’s defense.”</p>
<p>secrets in government and people not knowing what is going on…gee, that sounds kind of bad</p>
<p>and if he had no wmd…well…</p>
<p>the warmongers whould have gone/did go to war</p>
<p>While I don’t often read political threads on CC, you truly made me laugh, Citygirlsmom when you wrote:
“secrets in government and people not knowing what is going on…gee, that sounds kind of bad”</p>
<p>:D</p>
<p>i try and be subtle when i can…</p>
<p>Ahhh, the point was even his own generals thought they had WMD. If we had captured one pre-war and got him to talk we would have been pretty sure they existed. So everyone was fooled.</p>
<p>huh? everyone was conning everyone…nature of politics…like that doesn’t happen here</p>
<p>so, the pre war intelligence that they didn’t exist was indeed accurate, is that right…so when certain people said they aren’t there, they were right</p>
<p>imagine that</p>
<p>do not forget that many people said they didn’t have wmd…please acknowledge that they were right</p>
<p>me thinks some people are looking for anything to show there was belief they had wmd when our intelligence showed over and over again they did not, but our government didn’t believe our own people and twisted the truth for their own purposes</p>
<p>so our administration had that in common with saddam, imagine that</p>
<p>According to the vast majority of dems and reps before the war the common belief was that they had them. Hindsight is always 20-20.</p>
<p>and who were they getting their information from- the administration, because many people in the CIA whos reports were ignored were saying, no wmd</p>
<p>hindsight? the intelligence community was saying no wmd all along, but whoever disagreed with Bush was silenced</p>
<p>so we have saddam lying about wmd to his people, our intelligence people saying no wmd, Bush ignoring our own intelligence, and now, saying that if we interviewed Saddams generals we would have thought they had WMD, so we would believe his Generals over our own intelligence</p>
<p>so when you say hindsight is 20-20, many people knew back then what some people are finally seeing</p>
<p>all those war protesters, the UN, the CIA, the intelligence community, gee they were right all along</p>
<p>
Your ability to write fiction that is orthogonal to any notion of reality is astounding. Do you do an ounce of research outside the lefty blogs and Air America?</p>
<p>fiction, please, I don’t write fiction!!</p>
<p>read something besides the bush ideologues</p>
<p>go back over some old posts on this site</p>
<p>kind of hurts when your guys have been proved wrong over and over again</p>
<p>please, insult me all you want, but that doesn’t take away what I have pointed out to be true</p>
<p>once again, insult the messenger, so typical of the “right”</p>
<p>I am not saying that the Official line was they didn’t have wmd, I am saying that several people that were silenced in various ways in the intelligence community said they didn’t have them</p>
<p>Bush heard what he wanted to hear and shared what he wanted to share</p>
<p>
So, you go from “all” to “several” and then still fail to cite any information from even the “several” to back up your twisted view of reality. Try checking out the reports from the Senate Intelligence committee, the Kay report, or the Duelfer report in terms of what the intelligence was and their finding that there was no coersion involved. Or are these all Bush ideologues as well?</p>
<p>
I suppose that Bill Clinton, Al Gore, Tony Blair, Dick Gephart, and a cast of hundreds of other Dems and Republicans also heard what they wanted to hear. Or is it your theory that Bush was working behind the scenes in a grand conspiracy that was hatched in the 90s to get all of these people to believe that there were WMD? Like I say - you have a tremendous ability to create conspiratorial fiction. Perhaps you could work with George Clooney on his next movie.</p>
<p>I highlighted mine!</p>
<p>“We urge you, after consulting with Congress, and consistent with the U.S. Constitution and laws, to take necessary actions (including, if appropriate, air and missile strikes on suspect Iraqi sites) to respond effectively to the threat posed by Iraq’s refusal to end its weapons of mass destruction programs.” – From a letter signed by Joe Lieberman, Dianne Feinstein, Barbara A. Milulski, Tom Daschle, & John Kerry among others on October 9, 1998 </p>
<p>“This December will mark three years since United Nations inspectors last visited Iraq. There is no doubt that since that time, Saddam Hussein has reinvigorated his weapons programs. Reports indicate that biological, chemical and nuclear programs continue apace and may be back to pre-Gulf War status. In addition, Saddam continues to refine delivery systems and is doubtless using the cover of a licit missile program to develop longer- range missiles that will threaten the United States and our allies.” – From a December 6, 2001 letter signed by Bob Graham, Joe Lieberman, Harold Ford, & Tom Lantos among others </p>
<p>“Whereas Iraq has consistently breached its cease-fire agreement between Iraq and the United States, entered into on March 3, 1991, by failing to dismantle its weapons of mass destruction program, and refusing to permit monitoring and verification by United Nations inspections; Whereas Iraq has developed weapons of mass destruction, including chemical and biological capabilities, and has made positive progress toward developing nuclear weapons capabilities” – From a joint resolution submitted by Tom Harkin and Arlen Specter on July 18, 2002 </p>
<p>“Saddam’s goal … is to achieve the lifting of U.N. sanctions while retaining and enhancing Iraq’s weapons of mass destruction programs. We cannot, we must not and we will not let him succeed.” – Madeline Albright, 1998 </p>
<p>“(Saddam) will rebuild his arsenal of weapons of mass destruction and some day, some way, I am certain he will use that arsenal again, as he has 10 times since 1983” – National Security Adviser Sandy Berger, Feb 18, 1998 </p>
<p>“Iraq made commitments after the Gulf War to completely dismantle all weapons of mass destruction, and unfortunately, Iraq has not lived up to its agreement.” – Barbara Boxer, November 8, 2002 </p>
<p>“The last UN weapons inspectors left Iraq in October of 1998. We are confident that Saddam Hussein retained some stockpiles of chemical and biological weapons, and that he has since embarked on a crash course to build up his chemical and biological warfare capability. Intelligence reports also indicate that he is seeking nuclear weapons, but has not yet achieved nuclear capability.” – Robert Byrd, October 2002 </p>
<p>“There’s no question that Saddam Hussein is a threat… Yes, he has chemical and biological weapons. He’s had those for a long time. But the United States right now is on a very much different defensive posture than we were before September 11th of 2001… He is, as far as we know, actively pursuing nuclear capabilities, though he doesn’t have nuclear warheads yet. If he were to acquire nuclear weapons, I think our friends in the region would face greatly increased risks as would we.” – Wesley Clark on September 26, 2002 </p>
<p>“What is at stake is how to answer the potential threat Iraq represents with the risk of proliferation of WMD. Baghdad’s regime did use such weapons in the past. Today, a number of evidences may lead to think that, over the past four years, in the absence of international inspectors, this country has continued armament programs.” – Jacques Chirac, October 16, 2002 </p>
<p>“The community of nations may see more and more of the very kind of threat Iraq poses now: a rogue state with weapons of mass destruction, ready to use them or provide them to terrorists. If we fail to respond today, Saddam and all those who would follow in his footsteps will be emboldened tomorrow.” – Bill Clinton in 1998 </p>
<p>“In the four years since the inspectors left, intelligence reports show that Saddam Hussein has worked to rebuild his chemical and biological weapons stock, his missile delivery capability, and his nuclear program. He has also given aid, comfort, and sanctuary to terrorists, including Al Qaeda members, though there is apparently no evidence of his involvement in the terrible events of September 11, 2001. **It is clear, however, that if left unchecked, Saddam Hussein will continue to increase his capacity to wage biological and chemical warfare, and will keep trying to develop nuclear weapons. Should he succeed in that endeavor, he could alter the political and security landscape of the Middle East, which as we know all too well affects American security.” – Hillary Clinton, October 10, 2002 </p>
<p>“I am absolutely convinced that there are weapons…I saw evidence back in 1998 when we would see the inspectors being barred from gaining entry into a warehouse for three hours with trucks rolling up and then moving those trucks out.” – Clinton’s Secretary of Defense William Cohen in April of 2003 ** </p>
<p>“Iraq is not the only nation in the world to possess weapons of mass destruction, but it is the only nation with a leader who has used them against his own people.” – Tom Daschle in 1998 </p>
<p>“Saddam Hussein’s regime represents a grave threat to America and our allies, including our vital ally, Israel. For more than two decades, Saddam Hussein has sought weapons of mass destruction through every available means. We know that he has chemical and biological weapons. He has already used them against his neighbors and his own people, and is trying to build more. We know that he is doing everything he can to build nuclear weapons, and we know that each day he gets closer to achieving that goal.” – John Edwards, Oct 10, 2002 </p>
<p>“The debate over Iraq is not about politics. It is about national security. It should be clear that our national security requires Congress to send a clear message to Iraq and the world: America is united in its determination to eliminate forever the threat of Iraq’s weapons of mass destruction.” – John Edwards, Oct 10, 2002 </p>
<p>“I share the administration’s goals in dealing with Iraq and its weapons of mass destruction.” – Dick Gephardt in September of 2002 </p>
<p>“Iraq does pose a serious threat to the stability of the Persian Gulf and we should organize an international coalition to eliminate his access to weapons of mass destruction. Iraq’s search for weapons of mass destruction has proven impossible to completely deter and we should assume that it will continue for as long as Saddam is in power.” – Al Gore, 2002 </p>
<p>“We are in possession of what I think to be compelling evidence that Saddam Hussein has, and has had for a number of years, a developing capacity for the production and storage of weapons of mass destruction.” – Bob Graham, December 2002 </p>
<p>“Saddam Hussein is not the only deranged dictator who is willing to deprive his people in order to acquire weapons of mass destruction.” – Jim Jeffords, October 8, 2002 </p>
<p>“We have known for many years that Saddam Hussein is seeking and developing weapons of mass destruction.” – Ted Kennedy, September 27, 2002 </p>
<p>“There is no doubt that Saddam Hussein’s regime is a serious danger, that he is a tyrant, and that his pursuit of lethal weapons of mass destruction cannot be tolerated. He must be disarmed.” – Ted Kennedy, Sept 27, 2002 </p>
<p>“I will be voting to give the president of the United States the authority to use force - if necessary - to disarm Saddam Hussein because I believe that a deadly arsenal of weapons of mass destruction in his hands is a real and grave threat to our security.” – John F. Kerry, Oct 2002 </p>
<p>“The threat of Saddam Hussein with weapons of mass destruction is real, but as I said, it is not new. It has been with us since the end of that war, and particularly in the last 4 years we know after Operation Desert Fox failed to force him to reaccept them, that he has continued to build those weapons. He has had a free hand for 4 years to reconstitute these weapons, allowing the world, during the interval, to lose the focus we had on weapons of mass destruction and the issue of proliferation.” – John Kerry, October 9, 2002 </p>
<p>“(W)e need to disarm Saddam Hussein. He is a brutal, murderous dictator, leading an oppressive regime. We all know the litany of his offenses. He presents a particularly grievous threat because he is so consistently prone to miscalculation. …And now he is miscalculating Americas response to his continued deceit and his consistent grasp for weapons of mass destruction. That is why the world, through the United Nations Security Council, has spoken with one voice, demanding that Iraq disclose its weapons programs and disarm. So the threat of Saddam Hussein with weapons of mass destruction is real, but it is not new. It has been with us since the end of the Persian Gulf War.” – John Kerry, Jan 23, 2003 </p>
<p>“We begin with the common belief that Saddam Hussein is a tyrant and a threat to the peace and stability of the region. He has ignored the mandates of the United Nations and is building weapons of mass destruction and the means of delivering them.” – Carl Levin, Sept 19, 2002</p>
<p>“Every day Saddam remains in power with chemical weapons, biological weapons, and the development of nuclear weapons is a day of danger for the United States.” – Joe Lieberman, August, 2002</p>
<p>“Over the years, Iraq has worked to develop nuclear, chemical and biological weapons. During 1991 - 1994, despite Iraq’s denials, U.N. inspectors discovered and dismantled a large network of nuclear facilities that Iraq was using to develop nuclear weapons. Various reports indicate that Iraq is still actively pursuing nuclear weapons capability. There is no reason to think otherwise. Beyond nuclear weapons, Iraq has actively pursued biological and chemical weapons.U.N. inspectors have said that Iraq’s claims about biological weapons is neither credible nor verifiable. In 1986, Iraq used chemical weapons against Iran, and later, against its own Kurdish population. While weapons inspections have been successful in the past, there have been no inspections since the end of 1998. There can be no doubt that Iraq has continued to pursue its goal of obtaining weapons of mass destruction.” – Patty Murray, October 9, 2002 </p>
<p>**“As a member of the House Intelligence Committee, I am keenly aware that the proliferation of chemical and biological weapons is an issue of grave importance to all nations. Saddam Hussein has been engaged in the development of weapons of mass destruction technology which is a threat to countries in the region and he has made a mockery of the weapons inspection process.” – Nancy Pelosi, December 16, 1998 **</p>
<p>“Even today, Iraq is not nearly disarmed. Based on highly credible intelligence, UNSCOM [the U.N. weapons inspectors] suspects that Iraq still has biological agents like anthrax, botulinum toxin, and clostridium perfringens in sufficient quantity to fill several dozen bombs and ballistic missile warheads, as well as the means to continue manufacturing these deadly agents. Iraq probably retains several tons of the highly toxic VX substance, as well as sarin nerve gas and mustard gas. This agent is stored in artillery shells, bombs, and ballistic missile warheads.”-- Ex-Un Weapons Inspector Scott Ritter in 1998 </p>
<p>“There is unmistakable evidence that Saddam Hussein is working aggressively to develop nuclear weapons and will likely have nuclear weapons within the next five years. We also should remember we have always underestimated the progress Saddam has made in development of weapons of mass destruction.” – John Rockefeller, Oct 10, 2002 </p>
<p>“Saddams existing biological and chemical weapons capabilities pose a very real threat to America, now. Saddam has used chemical weapons before, both against Iraqs enemies and against his own people. He is working to develop delivery systems like missiles and unmanned aerial vehicles that could bring these deadly weapons against U.S. forces and U.S. facilities in the Middle East.” – John Rockefeller, Oct 10, 2002 </p>
<p>“Whether one agrees or disagrees with the Administrations policy towards Iraq, I dont think there can be any question about Saddams conduct. He has systematically violated, over the course of the past 11 years, every significant UN resolution that has demanded that he disarm and destroy his chemical and biological weapons, and any nuclear capacity. This he has refused to do. He lies and cheats; he snubs the mandate and authority of international weapons inspectors; and he games the system to keep buying time against enforcement of the just and legitimate demands of the United Nations, the Security Council, the United States and our allies. Those are simply the facts.” – Henry Waxman, Oct 10, 2002</p>
<p>We were TOLD that he had the WMD, and I guess it was wrong for our people to believe the administration stories. We were lied to.</p>
<p>My goodness, we have also been told that Saddam was behind 9-11. ANd he wasn’t. And we were told he had nucluer weapons and he didn’t.</p>
<p>Powell acknowledges now he was misled. We were misled, but that doesn’t mean that there were many many people that stated he had no WMD.</p>
<p>We were told untruths and we made the mistake of trusting and believing Mr. Bush.</p>
<p>You can keep putting up quotes from people who trusted the “official” intelligence they were given, but who know realize they were deceived and ignore that there were many people that KNEW he didn’t have WMD.</p>
<p>Just this morning, Bush said WE were better off with Saddam out of power, I thought the latest line was that it was better for the Iraqi people he was gone and that is why we went in there.</p>
<p>Gee, what is the story gonna be tomorrow.</p>
<p>I am sad that trusting our President and his people turned out so badly.</p>
<p>Bush (State of the Union 2003): Iraq recently sought significant quantities of uranium from Africa.10 not true</p>
<p>n February 2001, Colin Powell acknowledged that Iraq has not developed any significant capability with respect to weapons of mass destruction.9</p>
<p>You have to remember that the people you quoted were briefed by Bush’s people and given misinformation; and they made the mistake of trusting that information. WOW, how wrong were they to trust…</p>
<p>"You can keep putting up quotes from people who trusted the “official” intelligence they were given, but who know realize they were deceived and ignore that there were many people that KNEW he didn’t have WMD.
"
Yes, I can keep putting up quotations from a pretty large timespan. A timespan that stretches over different administrations. But do not let me stop YOU from posting the quotations from the MANY people who KNEW the information was false. Their message must have fallen on deaf ears … from both sides on the political spectrum, but especially on the weathervane leftist politicos who only question information when it fits their political agenda built on the results of focus groups. Was it not the job of the opposition to question what they KNEW could be flimsy data?</p>
<p>“You have to remember that the people you quoted were briefed by Bush’s people and given misinformation”</p>
<p>Before 2001? Did Madeleine Notsobright called Austin, Texas for information?</p>
<p>
If you are going to persist with your fictional tales at least try to keep up with reality. I know that your sources of information don’t typically acknowledge things like actual studies, but you should check out the Butler report which specifically says that what Bush said was well founded by the evidence. The irony is that the continued repeating of these false allegations against Bush, the claims of “Bush lied”, are in fact the actual lies when you stubbornly refuse to acknowledge the actual findings. </p>
<p>Just in case you actually want to know the facts for a change, here is a quote from the report:</p>
<p>
It goes on to specifically state that the President’s State of the Union message was “well-founded”.</p>
<p>
unfortunately you have put your trust in the far-left web sites who continue to perpetuate the lies that have been long proven to be lies.</p>