<p>$200/day x 30 days is $6000, that is more than the nice place. I vote with the crowd, home from the pacemaker into the ALF</p>
<p>LF: “No, you didn’t say 3 months advance, you said first and last, plus $500.”</p>
<p>Whoops, that was a typo - I meant 5,000 (actually, more precisely, I think it is $5,450.</p>
<p>It seems I can’t save a reply and go back and forth between pages so sorry I will have to post little posts responding to positive comments.</p>
<p>I was released from the hospital the day after my pacemaker was inserted. Can’t imagine sending an 88 yo home! My left arm was in a sling for 48 hours, I had limited use for three weeks after that, and then I went to cardiac rehab. Is there a compelling medical reason for a pacemaker at this point? Have they tried various combinations of meds? Seems overly invasive and could become a cascading event.</p>
<p>Dharma, go down to the favored AL tomorrow morning and reserve the apartment. Then tell Mom “Since you’ve agreed to go to AL, it’s going to be less disruptive for you to go directly there, instead of back home and then out to AL.”</p>
<p>CF "So that’s five months. The house will be sold in five months, and if it isn’t, you can move her out of the AL then.
CF, it would be GREAT if it were five months, but the three months they want up front meanly only covers the first month’s rent. The second month up-front they “hold” for the last month’s rent. And the third month’s rent sounds like a rip-off because it seems to vanish into thin air. They call it a "community fee."So you pay $15,000., and then 30 days later you pay $5,000 again. I have to seriously do some thinking–when I examine her assets with her staying in the house with the caregiver, she can last through January. I have to think carefully and listen to what you are advising about moving her to AL sooner than 10 days before the closing. This is a major psychological/fear/roadblock for me–it stems from the realtor telling me not to put down a downpayment until 10 days before the closing because then you are sure you’ll get your money then. I am afraid of making an AL commitment when the contract if/when there is one might fall apart. Important to add, because of my so nice and generous husband, there will be money in fact to keep her in the house with the caregiver past January. so I really should stop fixating on January…</p>
<p>Since I have my own thread now, may I digress and indulge in a little complaining? My BIL’s father was an MD and my sister/BIL inherited money. They have a 70 acre property in Nevada with a sprawling ranch and a caretaker’s house, all assessed at 1 million dollars. They have no mortgage. I have asked her several times to also consider taking out a home equity loan (there are some out there with no early payback penalty) through the transition over the next few months and she just ignores the question. But I don’t let it bother me like before.</p>
<p>I have to post so I can review comments.</p>
<p>Then get the house sold asap. That’s going to solve a lot of problems and make a lot of decisions for you.</p>
<p>BTW there is nothing magical about 10 days before closing. Contacts can fall through literally on closing day. Literally. If you don’t feel comfortable moving her until the house proceeds are a 100% sure thing, then do whatever you have to do to get it sold. </p>
<p>OK, so you need to have the house sold by January. Just sell it to the buyers that want it! Get it done, and get your mom in AL.</p>
<p>Somemom, thank you for delving into the lugubrious finances. The caregiver has worked 53 days at $200 a day which is “only” $10,600. There is still enough to last through January. Besides that $10,600 she has had to pay employer taxes and workman’s comp which adds a couple of more thousands.We had to pay the eldercare lawyer and a fair amount to the employment agency, so that brought assets down, but she is still all right. I have to examine my thoughts about whether how I am planning is misguided or prudent. That’s where and how your comments are so useful. I am operating on the assumption that it may take a little time to sell the house, and then time to close, and that the end of January is a reasonable time to expect the closing. I may be unreasonably paralyzed by fear of putting her in AL without months of money ready to continue to keep her there - that’s why I keep dwelling on this “10 days before closing” mantra. “Paralyzed by fear” may not be sensible. But I do keep coming round to thinking, this is what my realtor advised. </p>
<p>CT mom2018, I REALLY want to thank you for your vote of support for paying the caregiver legally. I was so surprised that she asked me why not pay under the table? I replied Because I might get caught! He/she said You won’t get caught!!! You are not Kimba Wood (was that her name?) running for the Supreme Court!</p>
<p>It won’t take a little time to sell the house if you sell it right now to the people who want to buy it. Time is money. If you clear $10K less, but it happens two months sooner, you’re better off than waiting.</p>
<p>I’m confused about this January timeframe. There have been offers and counteroffers, inspections, negotiations about repairs. It’s only September, and the thing is moving along. Unless the buyer has asked for an extraordinarily long escrow period, I don’t see why it couldn’t by closed by Halloween, or before.</p>
<p>From Somemom: “And allow me to make it unanimous: DO NOT ALLOW HER IN YOUR HOME FOR EVEN ONE NIGHT, don’t do it to yourself or your family, Dharma”</p>
<p>My own primary care physician knows me pretty well and knows my family history (my mother’s mother was also manic-depressive). And she insists I am perfectly healthy and sane. But there was, over the past day or two, most certainly a lapse in my sanity of remotely considering having my mother here. I will move heaven and earth to avoid that. </p>
<p>LasMa, yes you did miss - she is back in the hospital .Pacemaker installed tomorrow. I had to return her call. Boy, like a CEO (no offense to CEOs) she can enumerate her desires and thoughts bam bam bam, and she is an ill 88 year old lady. She said she wants “an hour of my time” on Friday and like I wrote earlier I know she wants to talk about replacing Barbara. I will get up from the table and leave the house.</p>
<p>jym626 - “Of course deals fall through. And there will be stuff that happens all the way up to the closing table. But do what you have to do to get her directly to ALF …”</p>
<p>jym, I wish it were that easy. The nursing assessments that were done will have to be redone because they are good for only 30 days. You have to wait days to get an appt for the nurse to come over to update the assessment . And they all talk about how the room(s) have to be repainted and possibly recarpeted.</p>
<p>Yes I know how it works. Been there, done that. Work with the medical staff to have her stay in the hospital for 3 days. Then off to rehab </p>
<p>I agree with Cardinal Fang that time is money. The sooner you reach an agreement with the buyer, the sooner you can stop paying the caregiver and get your Mom into the AL. </p>
<p>It may be time to offer the buyer some concessions. The buyer may agree to do some of the repairs himself/herself after they own the house, in exchange for a lower sale price. </p>
<p>I remember the Nannygate scandal in 1993 with Zoë Baird. A lawyer I had professional dealings with at the time told me that it was commonplace for professional women in our area to pay for child care under the table. However, it isn’t equitable for caregivers not to receive the benefits they are legally entitled to-- they will need their Social Security money, too, someday. Even if one isn’t caught, it still isn’t fair to the employee. </p>
<p>NY is a very bureaucratic state for real estate transactions, so I think it’s possible that it may take longer to closing than in other states. But I agree that it’s worth meeting the price needs of a buyer and going into contract. The sooner the contract, the sooner the closing. And however many days it takes, that’s $200/day+employer portions of social security etc. less to pay for the Polish ladies.</p>
<p>Yup. I also said it earlier. Time is money. Move it along. Hopefully the oil tank will pass the tank test and if it does, but they want the tank moved inside, have them do it after closing and come off on your price. You do NOT want any accidental oil spill when they fill or remove the tank. That triggers an EPA issue and everything stops til that is addressed and the spill tag removed from the property. No lender will close on a property with an open EPA spill tag. Again been there done that. The sooner the house is sold the sooner the contents can be emptied even if you have to rent a storage unit for a while. You do NOT have the luxury of time as long as your mom is alive and neededing the funds for alternative living arrangements. </p>
<p>By the way when my dad was hospitalized we kept the caregiver on at a slightly reduced rate to keep her available. If you have to let her go and still need one, there are others. But this is a short term problem. Goal is to get mom in ALF ASAP or in rehab after hospitalization. </p>
<p>You asked your sister to take out a home equity loan? For mom? I hope the paperwork you sent in was for your mom’s property, not yours.</p>
<p>If you sell now and close in Oct/Nov, the aide $ drain is done. In the way the cosmic order works, so what if you lose 10k on concessions? (I know it hurts, but you tried. That counts. )</p>
<p>I suspect the RE gal thinks you, you Mom, and your family have all the time in the world to move her to AL. That you don’t mind setting out another 24k on an aide, plus taxes and maintenance, utilities, food, etc, as long as you get the extra 20k on the sale price. ?? </p>
<p>Think how frail and ornery your mother is.</p>
<p>If the ground around the tank is fine, I think one NY option is they fill the old tank with concrete, rather than dig it up. ? Then they just install new inside?</p>
<p>Wait, I just saw that you said if all tests pass you will urge mom to accept the lower offer?!i thought you said you would tell mom you would help with the housing issue under the condition that she authorized you to handle it. </p>
<p>Ok, so back to math:
$200/day for a caregiver (plus groceries, utilities, etc) = about $6000/month (plus any employer taxes
Did I misunderstand or is the #1 place $5500/mo
CHEAPER than the caregiver let alone the other expenses??
Move her to ALF NOW
And, to be really incredibly blunt & brutal (forgive me in advance) if you think there is any dementia, DO NOT do a pacemaker. My dear friend’s Dad had a pacemaker installed and when Alzheimer’s hit a short time later it was a tremendous struggle to have the pacemaker shut off when his body & mind were really shutting down. It became incredibly difficult for all of them, and expensive for the memory care too!
It may be that you mother is 100% fine mentally and that is fine, but I have to bring it up just in case.</p>
<p>I have developed a strong feeling that once the mind goes the only medical care should be comfort care, things that keep the person comfortable and happy, not life prolonging, not body stressing, not risky, not painful, not involving rehab. But that may just be me!</p>
<p>My nearly 90 year old mother lives with me, if she needed a pacemaker I would do it, she is 100% there mentally, but if there is a doubt, then check into how things work if Mom goes down hill mentally</p>
<p>Somemom, thank you for the calculations and simply pointing out the monthly cost of the caregiver.I was/am aware of the cost but afraid to give up the caregiver before that magic “10 days” I keep referring to. But, I will pass this info on to the realtor, and point out to my mother, that if she were forced to accept less thank she wanted, because a closing will be SOONER, she will in fact (or if it “probably”) be saving money.</p>
<p>Sometimes I wonder if I am “artistic” or just dumb.</p>
<p>Oh no, don’t say forgive me and "brutal and blunt! You pointed out vital information! My mother’s thinking skills are extraordinary for her age . My husband and I are extremely aware at how skilled she is at delivering a tart “come back” and are very careful about what we say to her.</p>
<p>But I am ALWAYS making mistakes and get so down on myself for my stupidity! For instance, at her birthday lunch last week, she asked me," Do you think that at The Plaza at Clover Lake, if I gave them a little extra money, they would prepare a special meal for me, because I really don’t like their food." I SHOULD have said, Sure, Mom! Go right ahead and suggest it! Instead (because her remark triggered my anger and I lost my good sense, I said, Mom, with 140 residents to feed at each meal, do you really think the chef is going to prepare you a special meal?" She exploded why do you always take the other person’s side and disagree with me about every situation? I couldn’t reply, but the obvious answer is Because you are always WRONG!</p>
<p>jym626 “Wait, I just saw that you said if all tests pass you will urge mom to accept the lower offer?!i thought you said you would tell mom you would help with the housing issue under the condition that she authorized you to handle it.”</p>
<p>Did I say that? I must have meant “mostly handle it.” The realtor is calling only me about almost everything, not letting my mother know things that might stress her and it is needless that she knows stuff like the inspection results.</p>
<p>But on the price, no, she would have to approve the price. But when I point out to her (thank you Somemom) that she is losing money by keeping Barbara–and remember, yesterday she gave me a very broad hint that she wants to fire Barbara, I will refuse to get involved with that, and she cannot manage it herself, all these things combined will influence her to accept a lower price, and it is not really that much lower. Speaking here, I am listening to Looking Forward, thank you.</p>
<p>I am working fast. I have already arranged with the plumber to do the fixes. Tomorrow I have to go to Home Depot and get the SIX smoke detectors the inspector said were needed and two Carbon Monoxide detector and I have arranged with the handyman to install them.</p>
<p>Frustratingly, the realtor and I are waiting for the bidder to say “yes” to something simple before we can go ahead with the oil tank oil inspection and septic inspection. She told me she will call today to hurry them along.</p>
<p>Tomorrow I will call all the ALs about availability and if there is none, get Adele on each waiting list, and call the county to supply me with lists of “lower tier” ALs and inquire about them, too. But I am still paralyzed about the “10 days before closing” fear. With luck, those ten days won’t be far away.</p>
<p>I am “off” today, having lunch with a friend I met through China adoption. We met pre-adoption and did all our application work together 20 years ago!</p>
<p>Boy. I get difficult mothers. Remember the customer service rep idea. Remember your goals. </p>
<p>Dharma, I know you tend to lay out a lot of details and suspect you fully explained your situation to the RE lady. But I don’t think she sees this the way we do, nor does she need to. </p>
<p>People who wait until the money is in the cross-hairs can be making a different sort of commitment- eg, they want that FL condo, but wait til they can feel the money in their hands. They don’t “need” that 2nd home today. Or someone with a far, far more stable relationship with an elderly relative who isn’t chewing up 6+k/mo, someone who is far more physically stable and able today. </p>
<p>Remember the sales principle of “getting to yes.” She likes light for her art. They will make her a bday dinner. Etc.</p>