http://www.cnn.com/2016/09/29/us/new-jersey-hoboken-train-crash/index.html
These types of crashes are an embarrassment, not to mention tragic. Infrastructure in this country is just abysmal and we will continue to see these types of incidents (along with bridge collapses. etc) in increasing frequency as we continue to neglect it.
I hope beyond hope that the death toll does not rise.
I agree that infrastructure is abysmal and has been for years now. As a country, our ability to move forward and remain competitive is going to be limited by our current infrastructure.
I’d like to see the presidential candidates focus on important issues like this instead of the clown circus the election has been.
I travelled into that station over the years many times, and given where that happened and the time it happened I would be surprised if the death toll isn’t more than 3. One thing that is scary is I have read reports quoting passengers that the train seemed to accelerate just before the crash. If the engineer passed out (which is being speculated about) if the train didn’t have some sort of deadmen feature on the controller, I would expect the train to go in at the same speed. NTSB is saying from the way the scene looked the train was doing 10-15mph, which may not seem like that fast, but 10-15 mph with a train with 10 cars and a diesel engine pushing it from the rear is going to derail the middle cars of the train, which took out the roof supports (the roof partially collapsed, the train platforms are covered by a plexiglass and metal ceiling held up by collumns that run along the platforms).
It is going to raise questions, like why there are no speed controls coming into the station ie if the train goes above X MPH, it dumps the brakes on the train, similar to what the subways have.
100% agree, @doschicos.
Both candidates have technically put out plans. Only one is realistic and who knows if Congress will even help the next president.
My dad and I are both trained plumbers (when he worked, he was a contractor and worked extensively on large infrastructure projects) and my best friend’s dad is a civil engineer and best friend spent most of his summers working on civil engineering projects around our state. Needless to say, infrastructure is something that we have talked about extensively between the four of us (and more) especially coming from a state like Michigan which seems to be crumbling faster than others with no real plan moving forward.
As a historian, I work in the New Deal era and it sickens me how far we’ve fallen in the last several decades.
Hoboken is a major transfer point for transit into NYC, and the structural damage to the station looks awful.
Sometimes, when our crumbling infrastructure leads to a deadly accident (as was the case with June 2009 Washington Metro crash), the mess is cleaned up quickly, and it’s easy for the public to forget about the underlying problems that contributed to the tragedy.
But in this case, the Hoboken train station may need to be closed for a good while, and commuting from New Jersey to NYC is going to be disrupted. And maybe that’s a good thing, because it will keep the underlying problems in the public eye.
Thanks for that context, @marian especially for those of us who don’t live in (and haven’t even visited) that area.
@musicprnt where do you see the 3 dead number? I’ve only heard 1.
This could have been so much worse, especially given the time of day.
Maybe Christie will stick around his home state a little more and take care of the business he was elected to do. 
The Hoboken Terminal was beautifully restored a few years ago. It cannot be an example of our crumbling infrastructure.
http://www.nj.com/hudson/index.ssf/2016/09/historic_hoboken_terminal_underwent_115_million_re.html#incart_big-photo
I see nothing in that article that suggests that anything was done to the train and tracks.
Fixing the terminal doesn’t mean we’ve fixed the trains…
Well, of course restoring the terminal itself wouldn’t contribute to the accident. Were the rails, tunnels, trains, and safety systems part of that restoration, @CCDD14?
@romanigypsyeyes :
That is what CNBC was reporting before, I haven’t been keeping up with the current headlines, so they may have revised it.
I do not work for NJ Transit so I cannot give you complete rundown. Tracks and platforms there were upgraded too. Some NJ Transit trains are modern 2 level trains. Not sure what is going on with locomotives. NJ tracks are not electrified so in that respect this is like 19th century.
When the trains enter Hoboken rail yard they either seriously slow down or stop completely before proceeding to the terminal because there is a maze of tracks and switches. Not sure if the have systems in place to stop the trains automatically. As opposed to subway trains these locomotives and trains are of many varieties. There are also trains that are run by Metro North, these look different.
With NJ transit trains, it depends on which line. The Pascack Valley line that the train was from runs diesels (they are not electrified) pushing conventional coaches, the shore line and the Morristown branch are electrified and they run the double decker trains (they use electric locomotives operating off overhead power to push the coaches). Actually, the NJ transit electrified branched were done so a long time ago, the shore is part of the old Pennsylvania system, and the Morristown Branch was first electrified in the 1920’s by Edison (ran DC, they ran these old coaches until 1984, when they converted over to AC, those old 'Green monsters" were like something out of the 19th century, wicker seats, no ac, heaters under the seats).
There was not PTS (postive train system) in place, a rail fan posting on a forum said it might not even have helped, that if the train didn’t stop there might not have even been time for that system to stop the train. It depends on what the speed limit is in the yard leading to the terminal, PTS only kicks in if the guy is going too fast for the section they are in, and 10-15 mph out in the yard might be okay (though usually as someone else pointed out, trains, especially in rush hour, tend to creep into the station).
I don’t think it was the track condition or infrastructure, my suspicion is either the guy had some sort of health event (heart attack, stroke, blacked out) or it was deliberate, I doubt very much that the throttle got stuck and/or the brakes failed, it sounds like the train just kept on going. They have recorders on the engines on those trains, so the NTSB will be able to determine if mechanical failure was involved. I hope it wasn’t the engineer was some wackjob that decided to try and commit suicide that way.
According to the CBS Evening News, the one person killed was waiting on the platform (i.e., she was not on the train). And the engineer has been released from the hospital and is cooperating with authorities.
We shouldn’t have a train system that can just “keep going.” Why aren’t there safety systems in place to prevent that?
Infrastructure and specifically, mass transit, has not been a priority of our governor, to say the least. In fact, he routinely vetoes and/or cuts funds for any kinds of transit improvement. He happens to be a chief advisor of the aforementioned candidate, but it’s his local decisions that matter in NJ.
Though, on the other hand, bridges (and closing them) are a subject close to his heart.
No “positive train control” on any NJ Transit trains. The railroads keep getting the deadline to install them extended. Color me shocked- not.
"Investigators will examine the engineer’s performance and the condition of the train, track and signals, among other things, she said. They also plan to look into whether positive train control — a system designed to prevent accidents by overriding the engineer and automatically slowing or stopping trains that are going too fast — could have helped.
None of NJ Transit’s trains is fully equipped with positive train control, which relies on radio and GPS signals to monitor trains’ position and speed.
The NTSB has been pressing for some version of the technology for at least 40 years, and the industry is under government orders to install it, but regulators have repeatedly extended the deadline at railroads’ request. The target date is now the end of 2018.
“While we are just beginning to learn the cause of this crash, it appears that once again an accident was not prevented because the trains our commuters were riding lacked positive train control,” said Rep. Sean Patrick Maloney, D-N.Y. “The longer we fail to prioritize investing in rail safety technology, the more innocent lives we put in jeopardy.”
http://www.timesunion.com/news/us/article/Commuter-train-hits-station-in-New-Jersey-9434518.php
Penny wise and pound foolish once again. Think of all the money that is now going to be spent on lawsuits, lawyers and settlements that could have been spent upgrading the system - and saving lives. [-(
That’s my train line, and I was on the train right before the one that crashed. Thanking my lucky stars today. A lot more money needs to be invested in infrastructure and technical/safety upgrades. It could have been much worse.
I’m glad you’re ok, mjr.