NYT gift link: Is Cutting Off Your Family Good Therapy?

Parent Cafe
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Gift link
Encouraged on social media, many Americans are estranging themselves from their families as a therapeutic step.
https://www.nytimes.com/2024/07/14/health/therapy-family-estrangement.html?unlocked_article_code=1.7U0.uQLT.AYbOqzCyhM7f&smid=url-share

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I don’t even know what to say. That article was incredibly disturbing.

I think I need a time out.

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I believe that severing any toxic relationship is good for your mental health. Whether that is a spouse or other family member. I don’t uphold that blood is thicker than water and that you must put family first. You must put your own well being first, and any relationship that is abusive needs to be stopped.

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Thanks for the gift link. An interesting read. The article mentions that cutting off family became more common in the aftermath of the pandemic. I think that the pandemic acted as a natural experiment that created temporary no-contact conditions for a lot of people, and some realized that their lives were better without certain relationships.

I also remember the fact that 1 out of every 20 parents is in the bottom 5% of niceness. (The statistics for children are the same.)

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“The movement right now is that we can break a cultural norm,” he said. “The structure is becoming undone around ‘family is everything.’ I think it’s a good thing.

I think he’s full of cr*p. The nuclear family is what makes people strong or at least it should be. Cutting out your family using a letter form that basically says “you were abusive to me so you are dead to me” is what is toxic. It leaves no room for rebuttal–were they really abusive or are you just so into saying “poor me” that you can’t see that maybe you also are part of the equation? As for being difficult to leave–how about those left behind?

There are definite reasons to go “no contact” but on social media it’s the first line of solving every problem with family. I’ll also add that it’s a primary way to brainwash people and keep people in cults.

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This seems to me to be a classic example of a “therapist” acting out his own issues regardless of the needs of the client. He appears to be extraordinarily lacking in empathy.

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[emphasis added]

What I found interesting about the article is that the parents mourning the lack of relationship with their children actually acknowledged their own pretty heinous actions/behavior throughout their children’s childhood (mental illness, addiction, etc).

One of the things I realized (before having children) but really came into sharp focus while raising children is that you don’t/can’t control someone else’s responses to your words and actions. It is one of the reasons I try to be very careful about what I say and do with my children.

Relationships take two yeses, they end with one no. Being related doesn’t remove that agency we all have.

I also thought about a quote from Anne Lamott, “You own everything that happened to you. Tell your stories. If people wanted you to write warmly about them, they should have behaved better.”

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Of course he is. He cut out his family at about 15 y/o. i’ve no clue as to the “why” (he doesn’t say). So now he’s got a website and videos and as a “therapist” has a one solution for all. I’m sure he’s great at convincing people that not facing problems and hiding in a corner is MUCH easier than actually challenging yourself to create a better family relationship. Half his clients go no contact and he appears to be proud of that record.

As to the Chinese girl who was the example–better she learned to set boundaries with her parents. She didn’t need to answer all the phone calls. She could learn a nice way to hang up the phone if dad was yelling and mom was crying. She certainly didn’t need to call them dysfunctional, toxic and go no contact. What she needed to learn was how to stand up to them (which is what every child has to learn–that’s one reason for a rebellious teen).

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My wife cut her sister out of her life two years ago. It hurt to do so, but it was the right thing to do given the circumstances. The holidays are different now, but we have our sanity.

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Often, she said, clients came to her convinced that they’d had a good childhood, but she saw right away that they had not; many had had absent or workaholic fathers, for instance. “That is trauma,” she said. “It is abandonment. It is neglect.”

Doesn’t it give you pause that the client said they had a good childhood and she decided to convince them of their abusive parents? A workaholic father (or mother) who is working to provide for their family is not “abandonment” nor “neglect”. Kid had a good childhood because there was food on the table, maybe got a better education. That’s not toxic. Is life perfect? No. Could things maybe be better? Of course. Maybe instead of therapy the kid needs to get off social media and go to work.

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I read this with dread and fascination.

I know several examples IRL. I think this article is glossing over or missing entirely the nuances and the wide spectrum between " you are annoying to deal with, and therefore I’ve decided you are toxic and I’m not going to deal with you anymore" (and who among us doesn’t deal with annoying family members?) vs. “You are dangerous to my mental health and therefore we are done”.

I’ve seen how people can grow and change and transform annoying relationships into something that’s positive. I’ve seen how therapy can help the patient develop strategies to deal with annoying people in a positive way. I have personally benefited from NOT cutting off the family members- but learning how to change my own responses and not getting lured into a toxic spiral.

What this article misses is that learning those skills doesn’t just transform the relationship that’s causing all the misery- but is huge for all the other relationships as well.

I’ve got people I work with (so really don’t have the option of going “no contact” if I want to keep my job) and translating the family techniques into the workplace is pretty easy once you get the hang of it. We’ve all got the “Misery Olympics” folks in our lives; they are ready to escalate a minor problem into a catastrophe, or push ALL your buttons when you are struggling with something. Learning to channel their maladaptive behaviors is a powerful skill-- which “no contact” doesn’t address.

Nobody here has a toxic boss who they manage beautifully by pretending they are dealing with the obnoxious and constantly critical relative?

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I can see both sides to this.

I have a sister that I am now completely estranged from - final step was no longer sending her a holiday card. I truly have no idea what is happening with her family. I believe my 92 yo father is still in contact with her, but we don’t talk about her or her family. I feel good about my decision. By the time I cut her off completely, we had had no contact in many years. It works both ways, she had not initiated any contact with me either.

On the other hand, I have a close friend, whom I have known since she was a child. Her mother died a few years ago. My friend keeps harping on her horrible childhood, how she was a latchkey child, coming home to an empty house and having to watch her younger brother. Her perspective has shifted, I am not sure why. I was there, her mother worked very hard to keep her clothed, fed, and with a roof over her head. Her parents loved her dearly and would have done anything for her. Hers was not a dysfunctional family at all.

I think cutting people out of your life should not be done lightly, but sometimes needs to be done.

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I, too, have a sibling that’s been cut off. They said and did some things that can’t be taken back to me, my husband, our late mother, my other siblings. We all came to the conclusion that our lives would be better without her toxicity. It wasn’t easy, and at times I wonder, but life is calmer and gatherings are pleasant again.

I can forgive, but I don’t have to forget.

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Well, you may be a better person than I am - I can’t forgive or forget. But, I don’t let it affect my life at all. It stays buried somewhere, and I don’t ever uncover it.

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This 100%.

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This is from a reddit post about the “Toxic Family Systems test” from Teahan.:

"I got a 97, but I’m having a very hard time with believing that. I know I went through a lot, but compared to other people’s experiences, mine don’t seem bad enough to warrant that high of a score. I answered honestly that the things in the questions happened pretty much all the time, but other than specific instances where it was really bad, it was mostly microagressions or verbal. Maybe I was just used to it and got “boiling frogged” by things constantly happening in such a casual way that I just didn’t feel hurt by it as much?

Is anyone else feeling the weird, soul crushing emotional weight of being aware of how f**ked you are while simultaneously gaslighting yourself into thinking you’re just being too sensitive? I hope not, because this is a very strange Rollercoaster to be on."

Apparently even putting in very conservative answers will probably yield a “toxic family” score. Of course there are many NOT surprised by “toxic family scores” but there are many more who now question their upbringing thinking they’ve been “gas lit” by their “narcissistic” parents.

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Yes, I have a friend whose daughter has cut him off for this reason. He did work ridiculous hours when she was young and wasn’t around. But he did that because he came from true poverty and was terrified of going back there. Should he have gotten help for his fears? Sure. But, I think we all need to have a little grace with our parents too. The daughter is currently getting a PhD at a tippy top school, she of course waited until her last undergrad bill was paid to cut off her parents.

There are lots of family members who should be cut off. Loads of them. But there are also family members who just aren’t perfect and kids who act like brats.

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'Cause you wouldn’t want to lose a free paycheck.

BUT–have her parents cut the daughter off in return? Are they still there to support her if she changes her mind (or comes to her senses)? Do they blame her as an “ungrateful child” or maybe thinking she’s gotten stuck in unhealthy thinking?

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No, the parents are heartbroken. As far as I know they would love any kind of contact with her.

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Remember this. This is a cult mentality. “Come join us. You have no responsibility to anyone but yourself.” If you feel you’ve been wronged then you have. You do not need to listen to anyone but yourself and how you feel at this point in your life. You have no need to feel remorse for your actions because they are only reactions to others. If you feel bad then it’s caused by others outside yourself because the self cannot harm the self. Your parents should have been there unconditionally for you and supported you jumping off that bridge.

You have no responsibility to those that have made this life possible for you.