<p>Does anyone else get the feeling that they asked the US Women’s Basketball team to lay off a bit in the first half so the games are at least somewhat interesting to watch?</p>
<p>^ Coach K in fact said that he tried to slow down the dream team against Nigeria by benching Kobe Brynt, Lebron James, and later Camelo Anthony, and stopped running fast breaks in the 2nd half to no avail, still setting records in winning margin and total score (?).</p>
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<p>I just said I would probably not be able to say that someone is not giving 100%. However, you seem to equate even the smallest tactical strategy to deliberately throwing a match in the Olympics. People keep insinuating that the players in question had no choice but to cheat, when in fact in the game I saw, the rules had less to do with it than the fact that the supposed #2 team had LOST a match-had they won that game, they would not have had to face the #1 team so soon. If you have seen the match in question, you are insulting our intelligence to suggest that we can’t know for sure that they were deliberately throwing the match.</p>
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<p>All too often true. If the game is being reffed correctly, that kind of “diving” can get the offending player a red card. Of course, it’s not always possible to correctly call something like that, but it wasn’t hard AT ALL to tell that the badminton players were deliberately throwing their match.</p>
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<p>Google and find out why NBA instituted lottery for its draft.
The lottery still did not stop some teams from tanking at the end of a season for the better chance of a higher pick. Golden state warriors went 1-11 to end the season this year in order to get a top 7 pick, and succeeded.</p>
<p>And your point is?</p>
<p>Ledecky, age 15, won 800 free with an American record time of 8:14.63, half second away from a world record.</p>
<p>In the process, Ledecky lowered her PB set at US olympic trial a month ago by 9 seconds. And in the last year and half, she lowered her PB (from 8:58) by 44 seconds.</p>
<p>Let the speculation begin.</p>
<p>(And for people like smoke and fire, is this enough smoke for you? Surely it should be enough for John Leonard.)</p>
<p>xiggi,</p>
<p>You mean you actually thought I would think the players want to hurt themselves? Nrdsb4 got what I wanted to say. </p>
<p>There’s no video replay for officiating in soccer. You don’t watch soccer, do you? You are intelligent and you seem really well-read. You sounded like you are a fan until that video replay comment. ;)</p>
<p>Of course I know that the players cannot just abuse and do that easily without being called. I am a soccer fan and I do watch the game. <grin>. It was just a casual comment. You don’t have to intellectually over-analyze everything.</grin></p>
<p>I never compare that to throwing a game. I mentioned it because someone else was talking about soccer.</p>
<p>Nrdsb4 </p>
<p>Sorry, I wasn’t clear. What I meant is a truly competitive game probably never exist in such circumstance. You have nothing to play for to win (and all the incentive to lose) and there’s no pressure from losing. How can that be a real game? It’s like playing casino with fake money. The system needs to be changed!</p>
<p>It has nothing to do with whether the Chinese team could win as expect. They would be eliminated under the regular format (like tennis) and that’s the way it should be. </p>
<p>As for the ability to tell, I was referring to other games where players do pretend. In the game you watched, the players did not pretend. Even I serve better than them and it was too obvious. They are literally protesting and showing how BS the whole thing is. They were making a statement, not pretending. They are also not performers and entertaining the audience is not their job.</p>
<p>Like I said, a true game doesn’t seem to exist, as I reasoned above. People are kidding themselves if they are thinking players can truly play for real. Like playing casino with fake money, you are not really playing your best or the same way you’d if real money is involved even if you try.</p>
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<p>Sam, I happen to like your contributions here, I will provide you with additional insights to understand my commentary. </p>
<p>I commented about the desire by soccer leagues throughout the world to use technology to catch the abusers. This is different from having INSTANT replay as you might know from the NFL. Here’s what I wrote:</p>
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<p>How does it work? I will give you the example of what happens in the Jupiler League in Belgium. Since all games are televised, the tapes are reviewed AFTER the game by a special commission. Actions that were NOT caught AND thus punished by the referee can be reviewed and this commission has the right to impose sanctions (fines and suspension) to players. This is what I meant by the use of replays to ferret abusers. There are specific rules about the inner working of this commission, but that is the simplest way to explain it. </p>
<p>You can read about how it worked for a Polish player in Belgium. Note the line “On March 3, the Belgian Football Organisation will decide over an eventual suspension based on TV images.”</p>
<p>[Anderlecht</a> Online - Wasilewski to risk long suspension - RSCA Fansite](<a href=“http://www.anderlecht-online.be/article.php?lang=eng&id=14015]Anderlecht”>http://www.anderlecht-online.be/article.php?lang=eng&id=14015) </p>
<p>You can see the action here.
[Wasyl</a> hits Delorge - YouTube](<a href=“http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=■■■4uaJGVDs]Wasyl”>http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=■■■4uaJGVDs)</p>
<p>I’ll spare you the details but there was a controversy about this in that the referee claimed that he blew the whistle for a different infraction (to allow the commission to review the incident.) The player was suspended based on the TV images.</p>
<p>Fwiw, the Polish player was the victim of one the most brutal tackles one could ever see on a soccer field. [Koszmarna</a> Kontuzja Marcina Wasilewskiego - YouTube](<a href=“http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4LoO7b27SkI&feature=related]Koszmarna”>http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4LoO7b27SkI&feature=related)
It is miracle that the player walked again, let alone return and play in the recent Euro 2012. </p>
<p>PS I am happy to compare our notes and knowledge of soccer in PMs. Anytime! :)</p>
<p>^xiggi,</p>
<p>Wow, is there anything you don’t read?</p>
<p>Do note that xiggi’s deep knowledge of soccer led him to conclude half of Spain’s Euro 2012 team was washed up/overrated :P</p>
<p>Nrdsb4,</p>
<p>I played badminton for my high school team when I was in Hong Kong. I want to elaborate what I meant when I said they didn’t pretend. It’s true that they acted but only a little. Here’s why: at that level, the players can make the birdie go pretty much anywhere with pretty good precision (less than half of a foot margin) especially when the birdie was that high up in the air and they have all the time in the world to hit it (as in that game). Those players would almost never hit it to the net like that. When they serve, they make sure the bird would be barely over the net (probably no more than 2 inches over) because anything higher than that would give the opponent a chance for easy score. That’s the level of precision required at that level. That’s why in a competitive and professional badmintion game, unforced errors and hiting out of bound is a lot less frequent than tennis. Serving to the middle of the net like that in that game showed they didn’t really pretend. </p>
<p>I think I know why the players still threw the match despite the ultimatum from the ref. For China, they got nothing to lose. They would end up with the same number of team advancing either way. And there’s no better place and venue to make a bigger scene than in Olympics. What’s better way to protest and hopefully force a change that’s long overdue?</p>
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It seems to me that there’s a difference between trying to lose, and not trying too hard to win. The latter might be like trying to swim fast enough in the heat to get into the final, but not enough to wear yourself out–this is probably what Missy Franklin did, for example, when she had a medal race a few minutes after a heat.</p>
<p>NBC did talk about the US swimmer who was coming back after a doping ban. Also, there has been plenty of press about Justin Gatlin, and I would expect NBC to talk about it when he competes. We’ll see. Crystal Cox is not in this Olympics, as far as I know.</p>
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<p>I cannot agree with you here. When countries can buy players from abroad, there are few incentives to train their own. Furthermore, the locals will be shut out of the competition. This can only impede the development of the sport in the host country, not helping it.</p>
<p>Using foreign coaches to improve your game is an entirely different story, and should be encouraged.</p>
<p>Hunt,</p>
<p>Did you see post #167? Address this please.</p>
<p>Is there an experienced person like John Leonard who’s raising questions about Ledecky? If there is, it should be reported.</p>
<p>I just looked it up: those questions are being asked, and her Wiki page has already been raided with accusations:
[SWIMNEWS</a> ONLINE - Swimming News, Swim Meet Results, Swimming World Rankings, Swim Links, Calendar](<a href=“SwimNews.com - The D Word Greets Ledecky's 8:14 Victory”>SwimNews.com - The D Word Greets Ledecky's 8:14 Victory)</p>
<p>So does that mean there is no double standard? Or perhaps the double standard is in the degree of defensiveness people from different countries exhibit when questions are raised?</p>
<p>"“NBC did talk about the US swimmer who was coming back after a doping ban. Also, there has been plenty of press about Justin Gatlin, and I would expect NBC to talk about it when he competes. We’ll see.”"</p>
<p>Not merely reporting in the news, but rather, making insinuation in the press without solid evidence, impling guilt with suspicion based on past infractions of the national team. This is what Leonard did to Ye.</p>
<p>The indicents of Gatlin and Cox (not in this Olympics, but a currently banned US athlete), together with the long history of systemic cover-ups in doping, should have supplied enough suspicion for the likes of Leonard, to point fingers at the US Track and Field Team and make accusations on any medals and records. But do you really think someone in the Western community, would take the honor to become the whistle blower? This is the double-standards that we are talking about.</p>
<p>"“Crystal Cox is not in this Olympics, as far as I know.”"</p>
<p>The above is also expressing double-standards. When you talked about China, you referred to infractions 15-20 years ago as not being old enough. But you are now trying to brush away a currently banned US athletes.</p>
<p>chashaobao,</p>
<p>Exactly.</p>
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This is her first major even in the world. Where’s John Leonard? Where’s NBC swim analyst Rowdy Gaines that said Ye’s drop in time was enough for suspicion? This is FAR MORE impressive than what Ye did.</p>
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<p>Fair enough. I can agree with that. </p>
<p>In the other thread I did not continue our discussion for fear of hijacking it. Perhaps we can continue here?</p>
<p>When I looked at mens track, there are 10 running events including relays to 2 race walks, 1 steeplechase, and 2 hurdles. The ratio is 2:1. In mens swimming, there are 8 freestyle races including relays to 9 non freestyle events. In gymnastics, while each country is allowed two competitors per nation per event, weightlifting only allow 4 competitors for 7 events for women, and I believe 6 competitors for 8 events for men. If that is not enough, notice how long it take badminton and table tennis to be accepted to the games, vs BMX and mountain bike? While I would not call this cheating, a closer examination of the winners and losers shows a clear double standard.</p>
<p>Comments?</p>