Ooops! Broke a Light Bulb...

[fignewton]

<p>

Now, what gives the government power to outlaw incandescent bulbs, essentially forcing the populace to bring toxic material into their homes via CFLs?

</p>

<p>The government set an efficiency standard 25% higher than before; it didn’t outlaw bulbs directly. Conceivably, it is possible to make a regular light bulb efficient enough. As far as toxic materials, for alternatives you have 3-way incandescent bulbs, halogen lights or LED lights.</p>

[BCEagle91]

<p>One of the arguments for CFLs despite the mercury problem was that we were releasing large amounts of mercury into the air by burning coal (the dirtier coal) to power our electric bulbs and that the amounts released by broken bulbs were small by comparison. It may be small but it’s your home that they are contaminating.</p>

<p>This argument has lost some of its potency because we used to generate 50% of our electricity from coal but now we generate only 34% of our electricity from coal and perhaps a good chunk of that is the cleaner west coal. Market forces, in the form of cheaper natural gas, has reduced demand and use of coal for generating electricity.</p>

<p>I don’t really like incandescent or CFLs. The former for their power consumption, relatively short life, inefficiency and heat. I don’t like CFLs for a variety of reasons, the mercury issue being the main one. LEDs are a great solution except for cost. I like to pay up-front capital costs to lower operating costs and LEDs fit into that approach.</p>

[silverlady]

<p>I think that the law should say that if you sell CFL’s then you should have to take them back for disposal. My Walgreens use to take them back, but they stopped. CFL’s are a pain. I am glad to know that Home Depot will take them back, as I have one I have been holding on to for disposal.</p>

[latichever]

<p>Handle with care, but </p>

<p>[Ask</a> TreeHugger: Is Mercury from a Broken CFL Dangerous? : TreeHugger](<a href=“http://www.treehugger.com/culture/ask-treehugger-is-mercury-from-a-broken-cfl-dangerous.html]Ask”>The 7 Best LED Light Bulbs of 2023)</p>

<p>"A CFL containing 5 mg of mercury breaks in your child’s bedroom that has a volume of about 25 m3 (which corresponds to a medium sized bedroom). The entire 5 mg of mercury vaporizes immediately (an unlikely occurrence), resulting in an airborne mercury concentration in this room of 0.2 mg/m3. This concentration will decrease with time, as air in the room leaves and is replaced by air from outside or from a different room. As a result, concentrations of mercury in the room will likely approach zero after about an hour or so.</p>

<p>“Under these relatively conservative assumptions, this level and duration of mercury exposure is not likely to be dangerous, as it is lower than the US Occupational Safety and Health Administration (OSHA) standard of 0.05 mg/m3 of metallic mercury vapor averaged over eight hours. [To equate these values, we could estimate the average indoor airborne mercury concentration for 8 hours, beginning post-spill at an estimated starting value of 0.2 mg/m3 and decreasing from there. If one assumes the the air exchanges completely in one hour (a fairly standard assumption), then the 8-hour average concentration would be 0.025 mg/m3.]”</p>

<p>From Snopes:</p>

<p>“CFLs save consumers money in the long run, as these bulbs draw far less power (resulting in lower electric bills), and they last longer (so they don’t need to be replaced nearly as often). But they also work to save the environment by lessening greenhouse gases. If every American home replaced just one standard incandescent light bulb with a long-lasting CFL, the resultant energy savings would eliminate greenhouse gases equal to the emissions of 800,000 cars, according to the U.S. Energy Star program.”
Read more at [snopes.com:</a> CFL Mercury Light Bulbs](<a href=“Dangers of CFL Mercury Light Bulbs | Snopes.com”>Dangers of CFL Mercury Light Bulbs | Snopes.com)</p>

<p>If you’re concerned about CFLs, you should have a similar attitude about batteries. Both present hazards, and both should be disposed of through reasonable hazmat procedures. A quick Google should tell you where to take them. </p>

<p>We have been using them throughout our house. You get used to them. </p>

<p>Besides, I mostly sit in the dark gawking at my iPad or some other screen.</p>

[BCEagle91]

<br>

<p>If you’re concerned about CFLs, you should have a similar attitude about batteries.
Both present hazards, and both should be disposed of through reasonable hazmat
procedures. A quick Google should tell you where to take them.</p>

<br>

<p>We have battery recycle bins at the office. Cell phone recycle bins too. No CFL recycle bins though.</p>

<br>

<p>We have been using them throughout our house. You get used to them.</p>

<br>

<p>I prefer LEDs.</p>

<br>

<p>Besides, I mostly sit in the dark gawking at my iPad or some other screen. </p>

<br>

<p>Your iPad has an LED Backlight to maximize battery life. Not the older Cold Compact Fluorescent backlights.</p>

[ptontiger16]

<p>“The entire 5 mg of mercury vaporizes immediately (an unlikely occurrence)…” Of course this is unlikely! Mercury is the only metal that is liquid at room temperature (25 degrees centigrade). Though the mercury is vapor within the bulb, it should condense into liquid form when the bulb is broken. Liquid mercury is a whole lot more difficult to get rid of than vaporized mercury. Anything that you use to dispose of it will also be contaminated. </p>

<p>It’s a whole lot harder to break a battery to the point of leaking (i.e. it won’t start leaking if you drop it). As somebody above said, there are also more battery recycling sites than CFL recycling sites. Transport of CFLs also poses a problem. Imagine if you put a bag of them in your trunk and after some jostling around, something else falls on it. Even if only one breaks, your car is now contaminated - yes, plastic bags are known to have small holes in them. </p>

<p>The short of it is, the government should stop actively promoting CFLs and instead turn to a safer alternative. How would you feel if one breaks as you were changing it and your kid is around? Children don’t know to not play with the shiny liquid substance on the ground.</p>

[LasMa]

<p>

From Snopes:</p>

<p>"CFLs save consumers money in the long run, as these bulbs draw far less power (resulting in lower electric bills), and they last longer (so they don’t need to be replaced nearly as often).

</p>

<p>They’re not saving me any money. They’re super expensive compared to incandescents, and they don’t last nearly as long as the propoganda says they do. I also haven’t noticed any drop in my electric bill.</p>

[calmom]

<p>I’m kind of old, but…
when I was elementary school (in the 60’s), liquid mercury was put out on the table in science classes and the children were allowed (encouraged) to play with the mercury, even hold it in their hands.</p>

<p>Of course we had mercury thermometers, and i honestly couldn’t count the number of times a thermometer was dropped & broken in our house, with the mercury leaking out.</p>

<p>What’s the point of this old geezer anecdote?</p>

<p>

Why is it important to clean up a broken CFL properly?
CFLs and other fluorescent light bulbs contain a small amount of mercury sealed within the glass tubing. When a fluorescent bulb breaks in your home, some of this mercury is released as mercury vapor. To minimize exposure to mercury vapor, EPA recommends that residents follow the cleanup and disposal steps described on this page. </p>

<p>What if I can’t follow all the recommended steps? or I cleaned up a CFL but didn’t do it properly?</p>

<p>Don’t be alarmed; these steps are only precautions that reflect best practices for cleaning up a broken CFL. Keep in mind that CFLs contain a very small amount of mercury – less than 1/100th of the amount in a mercury thermometer.

</p>

<p>Source: [Cleaning</a> Up a Broken Compact Fluorescent Light Bulb (CFL) | Compact Fluorescent Light Bulbs (CFLs) | US EPA](<a href=“http://epa.gov/cfl/cflcleanup.html#important]Cleaning”>http://epa.gov/cfl/cflcleanup.html#important)</p>

<p>I did break a CFL bulb in my house and cleaned improperly… and obviously have lived to tell the story. I will have to break 99 more bulbs to even get to the point of equaling the exposure of one broken thermometer. (And that might be a conservative estimate – apparently the newer CFL bulbs contain even less mercury)</p>

<p>or, as this web site puts it, “A typical 6 oz. fish sandwich contains 48 micrograms of mercury (that’s 0.048 mg), according to the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services. If you knock over a lamp and a CFL breaks, it will typically results in a dose of 0.07 micrograms (that’s 0.0007 mg) of mercury, according to scenarios assessed by the Maine Department of Environmental Protection.”
See [The</a> Mercury Myth: How Much Mercury Do CFLs Actually Contain? | Txchnologist](<a href=“http://www.txchnologist.com/2011/the-mercury-myth-how-much-mercury-do-cfls-actually-contain]The”>http://www.txchnologist.com/2011/the-mercury-myth-how-much-mercury-do-cfls-actually-contain)</p>

[SteveMA]

<p>We have some halogen bulbs in a pendant light in our kitchen and I really like them. That light is on a dimmer so we can’t use the CFL’s. They give off very little heat which is why I switched to them. Incandescents are too warm for that fixture (right over our kitchen table). They don’t last as long at CFL’s though. I have 2 that have burned out and can’t find replacement bulbs.</p>

[Dad_of_3]

<p>

I’m kind of old, but…
when I was elementary school (in the 60’s), liquid mercury was put out on the table in science classes and the children were allowed (encouraged) to play with the mercury, even hold it in their hands.

</p>

<p>Your school too? In the late 60s in HS, we had mercury in our physics lab that we washed with water to get it shiny and stuck our fingers in it, and ultimately even stuck our tongues in it to feel the texture. I don’t think any of us consciously drank it though; sometimes we spilled it on the ground with caused it scatter on the floor in a million small droplets that we would spend the next hour gathering together by pouring water and herding the Hg together.</p>

[patsmom]

<p>I can remember playing with mercury as a kid. We used to pour it into a puddle and stick dimes into it. They came out all shiny and new-looking. We never had any idea that it was toxic. :(</p>

[ptontiger16]

<p>^ever had any health problems (ie cancer , etc)? I know a woman who had problems walking in her 50s because of exposure to a broken thermometer in her childhood - or so doctors speculate. She was wheelchair-ridden for five years or so before regaining feeling.</p>

[scout59]

<p>

We never had any idea that it was toxic.

</p>

<p>Liquid mercury is not toxic - even if you eat it. Mercury vapor is the toxic form.</p>

[gouf78]

<p>scout59–wrong info–liquid mercury is easily absorbed through the skin.
It’s toxic in all forms.</p>

[noimagination]

<p>

We’ve replaced most of our lighting with LED bulbs. At $10/pop for 40 Watt equivalent, it has been an expensive proposition but the benefits are low energy use and practically no heat given off which means decreased cooling costs.

But also increased heating costs in winter, right?</p>

<p>Though I’d hope your furnace is a more efficient heat source than incandescent light bulbs… :)</p>

[ptontiger16]

<p>@scout59, please explain how liquid mercury is not toxic. It IS readily absorbed through skin into the bloodstream and this absorption can prove lethal. You are right though, in that elemental mercury is not absorbed by the stomach and passes out of the body without doing much harm. But absorption through the skin puts it in the bloodstream where it corrodes the kidneys and brain. </p>

<p>Furthermore, most mercury is not in elemental form, but rather found in an inorganic compound. In this form, mercury easily diffuses through the skin and is readily absorbed by the stomach/small intestine (whose function is to absorb). From there, it enters the bloodstream and destroys the kidneys and brain.</p>

[BCEagle91]

<br>

<p>But also increased heating costs in winter, right?</p>

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<p>I doubt it. We replaced our HVAC in July.</p>

<p>Natural gas costs are 31% lower right now compared to a year ago. I’m hoping that this percentage holds through the heating season. I had a look at a website comparing heating costs for various power sources. Natural gas comes in at about 29% cheaper than electric heat. I would think that light bulbs produce heat less efficiently than electric heaters.</p>

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<p>Though I’d hope your furnace is a more efficient heat source than incandescent
light bulbs… </p>

<br>

<p>Cheap, natural gas is really changing the energy cost equation.</p>

<p>If only it were easily available as a transportation fuel.</p>

[dietz199]

<p>

On what premises does the government have the right to outlaw incandescent bulbs?

Because they are the government and they are here to help the uniformed masses see the light :rolleyes: . Anyone remember the MTBE debacle in CA.? The stuff that was supposed to be so marvelous for the environment until they found out it goes right through concrete and into the ground water. OF course CA gas was more expensive because we were the only one requiring MTBE…until we required it to no longer be used. Which, you guessed it…resulted in higher gas prices because now …well…um…yeah, no reason. Just remember the scariest words in the English Language "I’m from the Government and I’m here to help’</p>

<p>I’ll stop now or this will get political.</p>

[toledo]

<p>I was just told that my broken light bulb can go in the regular trash. I guess all the mercury evaporated.</p>

[BCEagle91]

<br>

<p>On what premises does the government have the right to outlaw incandescent bulbs?</p>

<br>

<p>I think that they’re just outlawing the commerce.</p>

<p>We have requirements in our state for low-water flush toilets. A friend went up to Canada and picked up a few conventional toilets when he built his house many years ago.</p>