OOS Students and the Public State Universities

College Search & Lists
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<p>Some may find the following article of interest.</p>

<p><a href=“http://www.insidehighered.com/news/2009/02/12/tuition[/url]”>http://www.insidehighered.com/news/2009/02/12/tuition&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

<p>Following are the Top 25 public National Universities (as ranked by USNWR) and how they compare on cost of tuition and fees for OOS and the degree to which those colleges presently enroll OOS students. </p>

<p>Rank , Tuition & Fees , % students OOS , School</p>

<p>1 , $14,634 , 27% , U Minnesota
2 , $16,274 , 4% , Texas A&M
3 , $21,386 , 29% , Georgia Tech
4 , $21,400 , 4% , U Florida
5 , $21,488 , 7% , Rutgers
6 , $21,818 , 32% , U Wisconsin
7 , $21,918 , 11% , Ohio State
8 , $22,294 , 17% , U North Carolina
9 , $22,342 , 11% , U Georgia
10 , $23,076 , 23% , U Maryland
11 , $23,219 , 13% , U Washington
12 , $23,290 , 17% , U Pittsburgh
13 , $23,401 , 30% , Clemson
14 , $24,940 , 24% , Penn State
15 , $25,334 , 7% , U Illinois
16 , $25,722 , 5% , U Texas
17 , $26,102 , 4% , UCLA
18 , $27,176 , 2% , UC Irvine
19 , $28,656 , 2% , UC Davis
20 , $28,932 , 3% , UCSD
21 , $29,181 , 4% , UC Santa Barbara
22 , $29,326 , 31% , W&M
23 , $29,540 , 10% , UC Berkeley
24 , $29,600 , 28% , U Virginia
25 , $32,401 , 32% , U Michigan</p>

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<p>While a good list for starters, the total COA is much more important. Housing costs at Cal (and other UCs) are rapacious, making the total COA about the same a UMich at $45k per year; UMich charges more to upper classmen. UVa is five thousand cheaper at $40k for a matriculating Frosh OOS.</p>

<p>Then, of course, schools like Wisconsin & Minnesota offer discounts to neighbor states.</p>

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<p>^ Hawkette probably sorted it like that so Michigan is at the bottom of the list…:p</p>

4

<p>I guess University of Minnesota- Twin Cities attracted many OOS?</p>

5

<p>The UC schools have very low numbers for out of state students. Can anyone tell me why?</p>

6

<p>UC’s are are too expensive for OOS and they offer minimal finaid. For the money, a good private offers a better value proposition, IMO.</p>

<p>

</p>

<p>Methinks Hawkette has a split personality. :D</p>

<p>On the one hand she constantly derides the Ivies, but on the other supports strongly admission factors such as test scores and employer hiring, which supports those very same (and RICH) schools.</p>

7

<p>Some schools are limited by state regulations as to how many nonresident students they can enroll.</p>

<p>What’s the source and year for these data? The 32% figure seems low for Michigan.</p>

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<p>^ UC policy is not to admit more than 10% OOS at any campus. Berkeley and UCLA get a lot of OOS and international applications; they others not so much. There’s apparently a plan now in place to gradually increase the OOS percentage at the top UCs to bring in more tuition revenue. </p>

<p>Compare that to Michigan. With roughly 1/3 of its student body OOS, and with OOS tuition roughly $22,000/year more than the in-state rate, Michigan brings in an additional $190 million/year over what it would get if all those students were in-state. That’s not peanuts.</p>

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</p>

<p>Right now a large fraction of Minnesota’s OOS students are from the tuition reciprocity states of Wisconsin, North Dakota, and South Dakota, with a few from the Canadian province of Manitoba which also enjoys tuition reciprocity. But Minnesota’s new low-cost OOS tuition structure just went into effect, Reportedly OOS and international applications are way up, bringing a 15% increase in total applications this year over last year’s level. I’d expect to see Minnesota’s OOS percentage rise significantly, though partly it will be tuition reciprocity students from neighboring states who are displaced in favor of higher-paying (and higher-scoring) OOS and international applicants from farther afield. That will both bump up tuition revenue and strengthen Minnesota’s entering class. Pretty smart move on the U’s part. Look at those cost figures—it’s one of the best bargains in higher education at the moment.</p>

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<p>^^hoedown: the 32% does sound low, especially now, but the numbers may be dated.</p>

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<p>

It is interesting though that the higher rated publics charge more.
Do you get what you pay for? USNWR ranking seems to agree.</p>

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<p>

</p>

<p>That is incorrect. There is no cap on OOS enrollment at UC. Indeed, while a couple of profs have argued for more OOS kids, and the current Prez said that there is no restriction. The simple fact is that with the exception of a few specialized programs, UCs are not viewed as a good value for OOS. For example, the OOS yield is 22% at Cal vs. 44% instate. In contrast, (if I recall correctly) UVA’s OOS yield is 33%, although much of that differential maybe due to geography. Also, unlike other publics, UVa is rather generous with OOS finaid, thus the net cost is lower, thus the net cost is lower.</p>

<p>Schools like USC are a much better deal at similar, or even cheaper price than UC, since USC has lotsa merit money.</p>

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<p>Interesting point, UCBChem. These elite public schools charge higher rates to stay competitive with HYPSM.</p>

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<p>

</p>

<p>You’re correct only insofar as there is no hard quota, but there is a soft “target” for OOS enrollment at the UCs which is enforced by applying stricter admissions standards for OOS and international applicants. Some UC officials have argued for a higher target to bring in more tuition revenue, improve geographic diversity (the official reason Michigan uses to justify its 35% OOS student body), and improve the stats of the entering class as the OOS applicant pool is on average statistically stronger than the overall in-state pool.</p>

<p>[UC</a> officials debate accepting more non-Californians to boost revenue - Los Angeles Times](<a href=“http://www.latimes.com/news/la-me-outofstate4-2009jan04,0,3267517.story]UC”>For UC, richer pickings are out of state)</p>

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<p>Berkeley already is boosting OOS admissions targets:

[01.22.2009</a> - The state of Berkeley’s budget](<a href=“http://www.berkeley.edu/news/berkeleyan/2009/01/22_budget.shtml]01.22.2009”>01.22.2009 - The state of Berkeley's budget)</p>

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<p>They charge out-of-state students what the market will bear. Schools with high ratings will attract more students willing to shell out more cash.</p>

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</p>

<p>There is no soft target either; Cal is the only campus near/at 10% OOS. Nor are the stats for unhooked, rich OOS kids at Cal different than the unhooked rich instate kids (according to UC Statfinder). But even if they were/are, admitting more raw numbers of OOS will just mean that the stats of OOS cohort will decline.</p>

<p>Moreover, in today’s economy, it will take some hard thinking to pass up an honors scholarship at the home state public to pay full freight at a UC.</p>

<p>“At UCLA, freshman Derick Tsaoi said he passed up a large scholarship offered by the University of Maryland in his home state.”</p>

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<p>Ucb,
In response to your post # 3 and in an effort to be sensitive to you and other U Michigan fans, I have re-sorted the results. U Michigan is now # 1…and by a large margin! Yeah!!! Are you happy now?</p>

<p>BTW, all data is taken directly from the online version of USNWR.</p>

<p>Rank , Tuition & Fees for OOS students , % students OOS , School</p>

<p>1 , $32,401 , 32% , U Michigan
2 , $29,600 , 28% , U Virginia
3 , $29,540 , 10% , UC Berkeley
4 , $29,326 , 31% , W&M
5 , $29,181 , 4% , UC Santa Barbara
6 , $28,932 , 3% , UCSD
7 , $28,656 , 2% , UC Davis
8 , $27,176 , 2% , UC Irvine
9 , $26,102 , 4% , UCLA
10 , $25,722 , 5% , U Texas
11 , $25,334 , 7% , U Illinois
12 , $24,940 , 24% , Penn State
13 , $23,401 , 30% , Clemson
14 , $23,290 , 17% , U Pittsburgh
15 , $23,219 , 13% , U Washington
16 , $23,076 , 23% , U Maryland
17 , $22,342 , 11% , U Georgia
18 , $22,294 , 17% , U North Carolina
19 , $21,918 , 11% , Ohio State
20 , $21,818 , 32% , U Wisconsin
21 , $21,488 , 7% , Rutgers
22 , $21,400 , 4% , U Florida
23 , $21,386 , 29% , Georgia Tech
24 , $16,274 , 4% , Texas A&M
25 , $14,634 , 27% , U Minnesota</p>

<p>Like others, I find it interesting that 4 of the 6 highest ranked publics are the 4 most expensive publics for OOS students.</p>

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<p>Thanks hawkette. Pompous as always. You find it interesting that the top four rated publics are the most expensive for OOS students? Wow, that’s a revelation. I would find it interesting if the four top rated public schools were NOT the most expensive for OOS students. Do you know why schools like Michigan charge so much for OOS students? Because they can! I know it must irritate you that even with 32% of the students at U-M coming from OOS, the school has no problem filling up a class with top students even at those prices. Do you honestly think that someone would attend a school like The Ohio State University for top dollar from OOS?</p>

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<p>Hawkette, I don’t get the point of your post. It seems quite random. How about we rank the top 50 universities of the USNWR according to cost of attendance? Afterall, it is only fair to compare all universities (private or public) of equal quality according to average total cost of attendance, right? Those students have to eat and sleep at the end of the day!</p>

<h1>1 $50,345, Boston College</h1>

<h1>2 $50,275, Georgetown University</h1>

<h1>3 $50,182, New York University</h1>

<h1>4 $49,358, Tufts University</h1>

<h1>5 $49,329, University of Chicago</h1>

<h1>6 $49,306, Columbia University</h1>

<h1>7 $49,278, Johns Hopkins University</h1>

<h1>8 $49,038, University of Southern California</h1>

<h1>9 $49,033, Vanderbilt University</h1>

<h1>10 $48,884, Washington University-St Louis</h1>

<h1>11 $48,720, Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute</h1>

<h1>12 $48,584, Carnegie Mellon University</h1>

<h1>13 $48,420, Northwestern University</h1>

<h1>14 $48,194, Cornell University</h1>

<h1>15 $48,148, University of Pennsylvania</h1>

<h1>16 $48,060, University of Rochester</h1>

<h1>17 $47,740, Brown University</h1>

<h1>18 $47,694, Dartmouth College</h1>

<h1>19 $47,648, Brandeis University</h1>

<h1>20 $47,525, Duke University</h1>

<h1>21 $47,320, Lehigh University</h1>

<h1>22 $47,250, Massachusetts Institute of Technology</h1>

<h1>23 $47,215, Harvard University</h1>

<h1>24 $47,212, Stanford University</h1>

<h1>25 $46,920, Wake Forest University</h1>

<h1>26 $46,908, Emory University</h1>

<h1>27 $46,675, University of Notre Dame</h1>

<h1>28 $46,000, Yale University</h1>

<h1>29 $45,695, Princeton University</h1>

<h1>30 $44,842, Case Western Reserve University</h1>

<h1>31 $44,583, California Institute of Technology</h1>

<h1>32 $44,034, University of California-Berkeley</h1>

<h1>33 $41,974, Yeshiva University</h1>

<h1>34 $41,666, University of California-Santa Barbara</h1>

<h1>35 $40,634, University of California-Davis</h1>

<h1>36 $40,591, University of Michigan-Ann Arbor</h1>

<h1>37 $39,752, University of California-San Diego</h1>

<h1>38 $39,746, Rice University</h1>

<h1>39 $38,522, University of California-Los Angeles</h1>

<h1>40 $37,442, University of California-Irvine</h1>

<h1>41 $37,420, University of Virginia</h1>

<h1>42 $34,298, University of Texas-Austin</h1>

<h1>43 $34,110, College of William & Mary</h1>

<h1>44 $34,098, University of Illinois-Urbana Champaign</h1>

<h1>45 $30,892, Pennsylvania State University-University Park</h1>

<h1>46 $30,621, Georgia Insitute of Technology</h1>

<h1>47 $30,468, University of Washington</h1>

<h1>48 $30,412, University of North Carolina-Chapel Hill</h1>

<h1>49 $28,828, University of Wisconsin-Madison</h1>

<h1>50 $24,861, University of Florida</h1>

<p>There doesn’t seem to be much of a correlation between quality and price. Harvard, MIT, Princeton, Stanford and Yale are not among the 20 most expensive universities.</p>

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<p>Nice listing Alexandre. U-Mich looks like a bargain to me compared to a lot of private schools.</p>