Overworking in Undergrad for nothing?

Graduate School
1

<p>Hello,</p>

<p>I am currently an undergraduate at UVa double majoring in Electrical and Computer Engineering. I just finished my first year.</p>

<p>I am planning on attending graduate school and I am setting my aim high. I want to be at Stanford or MIT, something really top tier. I will finish my double major almost completely after my third year, I already have research set up for next fall that I will continue throughout college, and I plan to take graduate level classes my fourth year. I also plan to have above a 3.8 GPA, hopefully closer to 3.9. </p>

<p>I can do all of this and put in the work, but I am concerned it wont pay off. No matter what, stuff like this will be a lottery. What if I don’t get in? Where is the payoff? I think I could still work pretty hard, get a 3.6 GPA with lots of research, maybe no grad classes, and still get into a great state school grad program like Illinois, and have a little more fun in undergrad. Is there any payoff in still working super hard if I don’t get into a top tier school that I wouldnt get if I worked a little less hard and ended up in the same place?</p>

<p>Thank you</p>

2

<p>Things will pay off in one way or another. </p>

<p>My suggestion is to have a balance life. You can argue a thousand way, but at the end, it really depends on your goal. Is getting an offer from Stanford/MIT your final goal? If so, then work as hard as you can :)</p>

<p>If having a good and exciting career plus decent social life sounds like a good future to you, then try to enjoy college while maintaining above average GPA, extracurricular activity, etc.</p>

3

<p>anything 3.6+ is fine as long as your in-major is 3.7+
your research matters more. the best predictor for where you end up is whether you really enjoy the research. you may find that you don’t, or that you like a whole other branch of research (which is something to write about in your application).</p>

4

<p>The point isn’t to get the degree and get into grad school for the sake of doing so. Many people believe this is the sole reason for doing so, but that leads to frustration and depression because your work yourself non-stop for something that you feel is not worth it. Find something you like to do in your major and devote your time to it. What you learn should be applied however you want to so you can feel pride in what you’ve learned–grades can’t accomplish this.</p>

<p>So, double major if you want to. Get good grades if you want to. Most importantly, however, do some work outside of class using your knowledge so you can be proud of what you’ve learned and prove to yourself that it is worth the pain. I’m making my own guitar amp and sounds effects because I love music and signal processing.</p>

5

<p>Stanford and MIT are not the best at everything. I know a few fields in EE/CS where UIUC, or any other top 10 schools for that matter, can be considered better than those two. On the other hand, if you’re only aiming for masters then I agree that you should probably go for the name. The good news is getting into masters at Stanford is easier than getting into PhD at any of the top 10 schools. If getting into masters is your goal then I think grade-wise you could be a little more relaxed.</p>

6

<p>but why would one get a master at Stanford? Don’t you not get any funding for the master?</p>

7

<p>There are many reasons to get a masters at Stanford.</p>

8

<p>Don’t get me wrong, I absolutely love everything about the fields of Electrical and Computer Engineering, I love to learn, I love to challenge myself, and I think I will enjoy doing research. That is why I want to go to grad school I am not just going for the names. However from what I have experienced, the amount of work it takes to get a 3.6 vs. a 3.8+ is a huge difference! I just want to know if that huge difference of workload is worth it (along with working more in research and taking grad classes)</p>

<p>Also I plan on my major gpa being at least 3.9</p>

9

<p>@explorer-c
Can you possibly tell me what other top 10 engineer schools’ electrical engineer and computer science areas are better than MIT and Stanford? I just want to know whether you have any pertinent information to back up your claim rather than just simple assumption.</p>

<p>Getting into MIT and stanford master program alone is harder than rest of top10 engineer grad program except Cal tech and possibly Berkeley since those two can be very selective. Most top 10 engineer schools allow students who are pursuing master to go into PhD program if he/she passes PhD prelim exam while pursuing master.</p>

10

<p>@CSmajor5
A couple of examples: If you want to do research in computer vision, CMU is the place to be. If you look around for computer vision professors at the top 10 universities, you’ll see that many of them got their PhD from CMU. For HCI, Greg Abowd and James Foley of Georgia Tech are among most influential researchers in the field. Greg Abowd’s students have went on to become faculty at Berkeley, CMU, UW, etc. So you see, I wasn’t just making a simple assumption when I said what i said.</p>

<p>Regarding getting into masters at Stanford is easier than getting into PhD at top 10 schools, I have several personal stories from friends that confirm this.</p>

11

<p>@uvacavalier13
Well I don’t see how double major in electrical and computer engineer can greatly increase your chance of getting into top grad school. master or PhD degree requires you to choose one (possibly two) particular field you wish to gain extensive knowledge. You should pick your field of interest within your main major and pick second major that can strengthen your knowledge of your main major you wish to pursue your master or PhD degree.</p>

<p>For example, you are interest in research to increase the speed and performance of MOSFET and bipolar junction transistor. Having double major degrees in chemistry/physic/material science and electrical engineer can help you greatly since you will have more understanding in material that interact with current. </p>

<p>Computer engineer and computer science are another great double majors to help intertwine one’s knowledge in software and hardware.</p>

<p>I don’t know whether you picked double major just to gain higher chance for top school admission or to gain higher knowledge of your field of interest. What’s your field of interest within your major and how does your second major help you?</p>

12

<p>Seriously, have some fun. You need to have some outlet in your life to give your brain a chance to rest and work in different areas. From the way you’re writing in your original post, you’re on track to a burn out or mental exhaustion by your senior year. Try to enjoy your sophomore year and see how life balances itself out. It is really the last 60 credits that matter the most for graduate school because by then you’re more experienced with the major and mature to take your work more seriously.</p>

13

<p>Ok so the reason for the double major is that I was planning on doing computer engineering and if I want to double major with electrical at uva it is literally 2 extra classes. Another reason is because as of right now, I don’t have a specific field of interest yet. I am just awed by everything in the two fields. I like the physical aspect and the software aspect, and computer engineering would give me a great software background. I want to take some physics classes for fun, I took an intro materials science class which I wasn’t a huge fan of, and I also want to take some electives like Solid State Devices, VLSI, Analog circuits, etc. I am also doing a specialized program here that gives me Systems Engineering background and connects the majors together. Once I find my interest, I figure I can just do research in that field to learn more about it. </p>

<p>I suppose I could triple major, but then I would have to drop Systems thing, which will also practically give me an internship with a company like Lockheed Martin or a summer research experience at a university. </p>

<p>The problem is that I do not know what specifically interests me. All I have had so far is Digital Logic which I loved, Intro Programming which I loved, and intro Materials Science which was ok, but we only spent two chapters on electrical and magnetic properties and the mechanical stuff wasn’t too exciting for me.</p>

14

<p>That’s okay if you don’t know yet. Nobody figures anything out until after their sophomore year. That’s why you should take the time to explore different things to see what you’re really interested in.</p>

<p>Don’t worry about double or triple majoring. Nobody cares that much.</p>

15

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<p>I have to back up explorer-c on this one: and not only for Stanford, but for MIT as well. You can verify this yourself by looking at the GPA’s and GRE’s of admitted students of engineering master’s and PhD students available in older versions of USNews Graduate rankings (and perhaps in the current one, but as I haven’t bought it, I don’t know.) Frankly speaking, it’s easier to be admitted to Stanford and MIT for master’s than for undergrad. PhD, on the other hand, is a completely different story. </p>

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</p>

<p>Such a pathway is rarely available at MIT or Stanford precisely because the master’s program is significantly easier to be admitted to. </p>

<p>For example,Stanford requires MSEE students to have at least a 3.5 GPA and obtain support from a faculty member before they are even allowed to attempt the PhD prelim - of which there is no guarantee of passing. Many students (both aspiring MSEE students and PhD students) will fail the prelim. </p>

<p>[Continuing</a> beyond the MSEE at Stanford - Stanford Electrical Engineering Department Graduate Handbook](<a href=“http://ee.stanford.edu/gradhandbook/Continuing_beyond_the_MSEE_at_Stanford#Students_Admitted_to_the_MS-Only_Program:]Continuing”>http://ee.stanford.edu/gradhandbook/Continuing_beyond_the_MSEE_at_Stanford#Students_Admitted_to_the_MS-Only_Program:)</p>

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</p>

<p>While I don’t want to speak for him, Explorer-c was referring to specific subfields within EE/CS. Surely we can all agree that there must be some subfields in which some schools are better than Stanford and MIT. Stanford and MIT do not dually run the table. </p>

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</p>

<p>The most obvious reason is what was discussed above: many Stanford master’s students simply weren’t admitted to the PhD program (or didn’t even apply because they suspected that they wouldn’t have been admitted). </p>

<p>Another popular reason is that many Stanford MS students are pursuing their degree part-time through employer partnership programs such as the Stanford Center for Professional Development in which their employer (usually) pays. Hence, they don’t need funding from Stanford. However, at this time, you cannot pursue a PhD through SCPD. </p>

<p>[Degrees</a> & Certificates - Masters Degrees | Stanford University Online](<a href=“http://scpd.stanford.edu/certificates/mastersDegrees.jsp]Degrees”>http://scpd.stanford.edu/certificates/mastersDegrees.jsp)</p>

<p>Similarly, MIT used to run (and may still run to this day) a part-time master’s in engineering program in conjunction with certain local employers such as General Electric, which has a large operation in nearby Lynn, MA. Students in that program don’t need funding because they’re supported by GE.</p>

16

<p>I think you have a sort of skewed perception of the competitiveness of UIUC versus Stanford and MIT. MIT and Stanford are ranked 1 and 2, but UIUC is just under them at #4 for electrical engineering (Stanford is tied with Berkeley), and the requirements to get admitted to a program at UIUC are probably just as stringent as MIT and Stanford. As far as admissions and rigor goes the lines between public and private unviersities at the graduate level are artificial.</p>

<p>Graduate admissions are not a lottery. Schools pick the best students based on prior accomplishments and fit. The better your prior accomplishments, the better chance you have going into a program. You don’t have to kill yourself to get decent grades and do the things that you need to do to get into a great program, but your primary focus should be your future education - have fun in college (and it is certainly possible yo have lots of fun and still prepare for top grad schools) but focus on your studies as your number one priority.</p>

17

<p>Thank you for all of the help guys,</p>

<p>at this point I am planning on getting a PhD but that could change</p>