Read this thread and look at the spreadsheet of offers: http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/united-kingdom/2180633-discrepancy-in-lse-admission-statistics.html#latest
Your 10% is not apples to apples, it either refers to the 10% of international students from North America (which is low and shows how little regard they have for America high school preparation) or 10% of all students including graduates (the vast majority of Americans in top UK colleges are grad students).
And no, Calc BC is assumed and required. No one cares about AP Stats, always pick Calc over Stats because it is far more rigorous. You should do Calc 1 and 2 at community college if you don’t want to prep for the BC test on your own. Other U.K. universities may be more flexible (our neighbors’ D got into St Andrews with only Calc AB).
I don’t think you fully appreciate how challenging the academic only admission process is for the top U.K. schools, with no way to gain advantages from any “hooks” like in the US. They are looking for the best student from your school in the last decade or the top student in your state for your subject and your reference should describe you like that.
You can see what is covered by A Level Maths here: https://alevelmaths.co.uk/papers/
Basically, mathematics is taught differently in the UK, with things like trig, algebra, calculus, stats, etc, all in the same course rather than as separate subjects. That’s why the US ‘equivalent’ of A level maths is said to be Calc BC, or at least as close as you can get. (There used to be a separate statistics A level, although not many did it afaik).
While in theory maths A level is not required for PPE in practice the vast majority of successful applicants will have it, and anecdotal evidence is that those who do get in without really struggle in their first year econ classes.
Your 3 in a history AP will be a red flag.
@Twoin18’s advice is excellent.
Can we step back a moment, and ask what drew you to this course in the first place, OP? That might help in sggesting a way forward for you/alternative options.
Another degree I was looking at studying is law. And I know it sounds like I’m just trying to find a way into oxford but I’m not, I really am interested in law. There’s a club in the US called BPA where you compete with 1000’s of other schools and I’m ranked #4 in the country for it. I know that they don’t care as much about extra curriculars there as they do in they in the US, but do you think that would help show that I am one of the best students in the country for law? How the competition works is you just take a test that asks legal questions like case studies, vocab, etc so it’s kind of similar to studying it.
Studying law in the UK does not prepare nor allow you to practice law in the US, and you do not have a work visa to practice law in the UK. Suggest you start with your local university for some general education offerings, learn more, and move on from there.
I plan on working in investment banking in the US and they hire all kinds of degrees from art to finance and law (law is actually quite common). But with that aside, do you think law would give me a higher chance since it likely won’t require calc bc? Or do they still want that for law?
No, no math requirement for law. APs is subjects like history are what you would want for law, though, so that 3 in WH is still going to hurt you, I’m afraid.
Investment banking generally needs some kind of quant skills. People with US degrees will be able to show that via math classes in college; if you do a UK undergrad law degree you don’t have that background.
I know some investment bankers so I’ll talk to them about employment opportunities, because you do bring up a good point. But that aside, what is required for getting into law?
Depends where you apply. But for Oxford you’re going to need at least 3 APs with scores of 5, any subjects accepted. Things like history are useful but not essential. I don’t think US HS classes, even at AP, will have the same kind of essay writing developmnent as A levels, so ou will need to show your wriring skills somehow. And you’ll need to register and take the LNAT: http://www.ox.ac.uk/admissions/undergraduate/applying-to-oxford/tests/lnat.
Okay thank you, I’ll check that out. Do you know of any specific AP’s or subject tests that I should take for it at oxford? I know they don’t tell you at oxford specifically, but are there any that you’d recommend?
@Twoin18:
“Other U.K. universities may be more flexible (our neighbors’ D got into St Andrews with only Calc AB).”
For which subject? St. A’s has plenty of non-quantitative subjects.
“They are looking for the best student from your school in the last decade or the top student in your state for your subject and your reference should describe you like that.”
Well, that would be true (for undergrad) for Oxbridge and LSE (maybe not too far from that standard for ICL and UCL). But other UK unis would not expect that.
That comment from @Twoin18 was for PPE at Oxford specifically, @PurpleTitan.
OP: HIstory (any), Eng Lit, languages, US Gov, are all very good choices - if you’re confident you can get 5s in them.
IB doesn’t need to require much in the way of quant skills. Enough for accounting classes (so . . . algebra). Still, if you want to work in IB in the US, why would you want to go to the UK for undergrad?
I’m not eligible for any sort of financial aid and the price for elite UK universities is less than for elite US. For example Harvard would be 70k a year for me but oxford is like 40-50k for three years.
1 Like
If I get 5 in macro and micro Econ, 5 in gov, and 720+ on a literature world history subject test, would that put me in good standing? I’m taking ap comp now although I’m not as confident about a 5 in there so I’d substitute it for those subject tests although I know they aren’t worth as much as a 5. Which is where my #4 in the nation for law in BPA would hopefully help.
So if the aim is to save money (and assuming you’re not in-state for a public target school), go somewhere cheap/free for undergrad, do well, and get in to a target school’s master’s program. Or land one of those few big scholarships offered by the handful of target schools that offer them (basically Duke; maybe some others).
Even from an elite uni in the UK, breaking in to IB in the US would be tough as, well, you wouldn’t be in the US. That makes getting involved in any US recruiting difficult.
For London, the top feeders in to the City are Oxbridge, LSE, Warwick, and UCL. Obviously being British or European would help there, though.
The schools I’m considering are Oxford and LSE (although maybe not now), UCL Econ, Warwick finance or econ, McGill commerce, U of M Ross (in state) and for a safety school Michigan state Eli broad business school. On a separate note, do I only write one personal statement? If so that would mean I can’t apply to both oxford law and UCL Econ for example because the personal statement won’t fit both.
That’s correct, one PS fits all, so applying for the same or a very similar subject at different unis is the best choice.
You’ll need Calc BC for finance or econ courses anywhere in the UK tbh.
Yes only one personal statement which is sent to all your choices. Your application is read by professors in the department who will be teaching you. They are looking for students who are committed and passionate about the subject they will be studying. Your PS needs to show this commitment and passion towards Econ/Finance/Law in an academic sense, with relevant ECs referenced. Lots of info out there on how to write a good PS.
I think the lack of AP Calc will be problematic at any of the UK Econ/finance programs. Have you looked to see what UCL and Warwick require from A Levels? AP Micro/Macro are seen as not that great. I think Oxford uni website has a list somewhere of equivalency APs for A Levels…
UK universities have very little / no handholding of students. You are expected to do a lot yourself as an adult. Are you sure that is what you want and is it what will best help you thrive?
There are excellent schools that would prepare you for IB that might offer merit in the US: Kelley - Indiana, SMU - Cox, for example. My daughter is at a big southern flagship on merit and knows people going to Goldman Sachs, front office. Plus there is a large regional IB market, such as in Houston, which SMU Cox would feed into.
And then there is the whole Q of do you need to do an MBA after a couple of years etc etc, which costs more $$. You could go to one of these cheaper places, do well, work hard, get your top tier MBA and enter bulge bracket IB.
I just looked up Warwick Finance A Level requirement - 3 As which must include Maths or Further Maths. That is likely to mean 3 x 5 at AP incl AP Calc BC.