Parents Caring for Parents Support Thread (Part 2)

It turns out that my MIL did not get pain meds prior to her PT on the day she was so awful this week. To make it worse, the response was to give her seroquel when she was so difficult. Apparently, she spit the pill right out into the doctor’s face. To which I say, good. Seriously, they were told that tramadol was a must before PT but they neglected to properly medicate her. Her response was predictable - it was documented that she would completely break down without it - and the solution was an antipsychotic? Yes, I realize it’s commonly given to old folks, but it’s not appropriate in this situation. Give the lady pain meds to keep the pain away, folks. It’s just that easy.

It sounds like my SIL’s H is trying to make sure that they don’t neglect pain meds again. H and I would really like to be there, but we’re glad he’s advocating for MIL. Things have been smoother the past two days.

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Last week at her quilting group, Mom had some sort of spell where she started listing to one side, and (according to her friends, who called Local) mumbling incoherently. By the time he arrived, she seemed fine. One of her friends is a retired nurse, so not easily alarmed, but it scared them all. I think, honestly, she may have just fallen asleep.

This morning, Local got a call from the AL saying Mom fell. Out of bed, apparently. They walked her down to breakfast and she seems unharmed although the aide reported she was “staggering all over”. Local said he would go over after lunch and see how she is. (And my brain is yelling NOW! go NOW!) Times like these I wish we had convinced her to be someplace with more comprehensive care, more medical staff. She’s in the personal care wing, where the aides are just there to hand out water, record meds, serve meals and such. The lead is an LPN. So nobody there, today, will do more than record the fall.

She has a bad habit of lying in bed right on the edge (because won’t bother to get herself to the middle) so I hope she just rolled off (as I have warned her she would). I feel bad for Local, she has been a handful lately.

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We had to make MIL get a hospital bed after she fell out of bed. It’s low to the ground.

If you can talk local into it, they should take her for X-rays. My mom, dad & MIL all were found to have old breaks well after they had healed. In hindsight, we realized that they were negatively affected by the pain that they just assumed was part of getting old.

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Not to alarm anyone but the episode could be indicative of a stroke.

Both of the things described are early warning signs of strokes. Maybe it’s not, but maybe it is. Definitely wouldn’t know over the internet

Treated early is important

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I was thinking the same thing - maybe a mini-stroke (TIA).

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Two weeks ago, my 70yo sister went to the doc and mentioned, at the urging of her dd, that she sometimes lists. They did an MRI and turns out that she’d had two mini-strokes in the past 18 months. (we know this because, coincidentally, she took part in research that did an MRI on her in November 2023). Mind you, this is a woman who was working almost full time until January, drivng, etc. Other than the occasional listing, she seemed fine.

I would insist on an MRI.

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Local just called — she stranded herself in her bathroom and had to call for help. They called an ambulance and she is off to the ER, 20 minutes away. If anything is found,she’ll be sent to the big hospital 2 hr away so I am packing now. (She is alert and oriented, made us promise to not let anything interfere w my son’s wedding in 2 weeks)

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I need to vent, so sorry for the ramble. Mom(94) hasn’t been feeling great the past 6-8 weeks. We have been to her PCP, cardiologist, and nephrologist, in that order. Her kidney labs were elevated from 2 months before, but still within her stage 4 CKD. She has been horrible low in Vitamin D and been prescribed a high dose to take once a week, but never started as she was afraid she would be allergic to it. She is always worried about being allergic to medication as supposedly she is allergic to many. :woman_shrugging:

PCP suggest she start on a lower daily dose and see how that goes, and maybe Prozac as her lack of energy might be depression. She did start taking the vitamin D, but not the Prozac. Still feeling unsteady when she is walking with some shortness of breath, so we head to the cardiologist.

Cardiologist says she had slight a-fib on her nuclear stress test, so lets do a 30 day heart monitor as she hasn’t had one in many years. He also puts her on a blood thinner, which surprisingly, she was willing to take. Heart monitor includes a large cell phone that the monitor on her chest transmit to. Periodically the phone says the device is not making good skin contact. I have change the tape that hold the monitor in place and we were good for a couple of days.

Mom is fixated on having to wear this if it isn’t working. She calls me every time it turns red, which tells her no skin contact, although usually it will eventually turn green again. Mom is little and weight next to nothing, with horrible posture. My non medical though is when she hunches over, it crinkles the tape. Last night I told her if it was still red later in the evening, or this morning, to call the 800 number, which supplies support 24 hours a day. While I could call, I am sure they will need her by the device, and she is very capable of making the call. Take to her around noon and it is still showing red, but she doesn’t know if she will call. Now she has been on the phone all morning with her friends, but she won’t make this call; it is easier to just complain to me. :enraged_face: I have my GD, and if it isn’t an emergency, I really don’t want to go over there just to make a phone call for her. Again, she complains about wearing the device if it isn’t going to work, yet she won’t call herself. My thought is whatever monitoring they get will be good enough. The monitor has 2 different locations it can be placed, but due to her body, the location between her breast will not sit flush; the monitor is larger than her space!

After caring for my husband for the 5 months before he died and now my mother, I think I have finally hit my max. I don’t know how those of you that do this full time, for years, do this. I also know my mother is one of the most negative people around, and her sister and I hear daily what is wrong at her IL, but until I blow, she will continue. Luckily her sister and I commiserate, but the brunt of mom’s care is on me. Selfishly, I want some me time, before I am too old or frail myself to enjoy it.

OK, that felt better, thanks for listening!

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Vent away anytime! It’s a lot!!!

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I am so sorry! It sounds so rough.

If it’s any consolation, my mom is similar

My sibling finally took a vacation, while she was going to be gone, mom had a couple of appointments.

I’m 400 miles away, I tell mom to call a person she has used before to take her to her appointment. Mom has her phone number, she has asked her before. This is what this woman does as her job.

No! Mom calls sibling to call and to call and reschedule her appointment for a time that the person is available.

I was so irritated. Mom is perfectly capable of using the phone. It’s so frustrating.

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Can I also vent even if it’s not about a parent?

My aunt, who is in her late 80s, is in hospice as of yesterday about a half hour from where I live. A cousin, another of her nieces who lives about 15 minutes from us, and I met at the hospice home. Neither of her kids was there and didn’t have plans to get there until tomorrow afternoon. One lives about an hour away and another lives about two hours away. The daughter lives with her mom. Now in the past week both of her kids totaled their cars, and the daughter and mom’s house is slightly affected by the flooding in Central Texas so it’s been a lot. But if floodwaters are going to leave me stranded somewhere, I’d rather be stranded with my dying mother.

I hate to think of this woman dying alone. I don’t understand why they put her in hospice two hours away from home and themselves. My cousin prayed the rosary with her, and I rubbed lotion on her feet and arms and moistened her mouth.

Our families are so different. My siblings are texting me all kinds of questions, including why aren’t they there, and I’m all :woman_shrugging: People are funny.

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You are wonderful for being with her. I can’t imagine moving my mom into hospice and not being there with her (at least one child). You and your cousin are doing something very important for your aunt. :heart:

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“I have finally hit my max…”

Big deep breaths. Take walks whenever possible, and blow with us!

(And tell her if she is not willing to call the 800 number, there’s no reason for her to tell YOU it is a problem!)

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After being there when both my parents died, it’s amazing how easy and natural this is becoming. Unfortunately, in a way. :cry:

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I understand. I was with my mom, my brother and my FIL. I consider it an honor to accompany my loved ones during their transition.

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Thinking of you, @greenbutton.

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My MIL is 93 and is reasonably independent but a lot less independent than she thinks she is. She is fortunate in life to have inherited some money from her parents and to have married a serial entrepreneur so she owns two properties that people love to visit (one in Ontario and one in Florida) and also rents a small apartment in the city. She gets an influx of visitors to the two properties who do things that she needs while they are there – take her for walks as there is a potential for her falling, shopping, making sure she is hydrated, meal prep, … . When people are not around, she needs hired help with all of these as no one lives near her two main properties (she also rents a small apartment in the city). But this creates a problem as she always wants to tell the help to stay home (and not pay them) when she is having visitors. Of course, these people will find other employment if they don’t have consistent, predictable hours.

In addition, she always wants to do various projects at her houses and relies on ShawWife to do them. When we spent 5 weeks with her at her Florida house last winter, ShawWife was helpful with those things, but needed to work. This created a conflict as MIL said ShawWife was always doing her work on on the phone with her friends and wasn’t helpful when in fact ShawWife spent at least 50% of her time helping MIL who was constantly interrupting her while she was working. MIL believe that she was completely independent and she was letting us stay there because we liked Florida and not because we were helping her big-time. I think this is because admitting she was getting all of this help meant that she had to admit she was not independent and that thought was scary for her. Big conflict ensued. MIL was ungrateful and ungracious. In the past, when MIL had a problem (often self-inflicted like when she decided she did not like the rehab center where she was staying for her knee replacement surgery and just checked herself out and went home and ShawWife flew up to find physiotherapists, etc. who would come to the house). ShawWife vowed not to do this again. Recently, MIL fell at her farm with no injury, slowly pulled herself up to a couch and fell asleep and when ShawWife did her daily 4 PM call, MIL thought it was morning. MIL was scared and asked if ShawWife was coming up to help (assuming an answer of yes) and ShawWife said no.

Recently MIL has had a flood of visitors and wants to stop paying for help (but no one will be available if you drop them whenever visitors come). She has been telling ShawWife about friends of hers whose kids basically are there to provide full-time care or at the very least coordinate all kinds of care/activities (driver to take person to museum, etc.). The implicit message: You should be doing this for me. Two of her kids live near her. One works full-time (Dean of a professional school) and the other refuses to get drawn in to this (maybe past experience with lack of boundaries and lack of gratitude?). We and another sib live about 600 miles away. Both work full-time. And ShawWife feels a lot less generous at this point than she did. We are not going to stay with her in Florida this year, for example.

An influential professor I knew used to say, “Let the problem teach them” because he knew people usually cannot foresee and prepare for an impending problem – they have to experience it first before taking action. I think that is what is going to have to happen here, but the consequences could be calamitous.

Have any of you dealt with parents who won’t hire or keep on the help that they need? Parents who can’t admit (and therefore can’t be grateful for) the help that they are getting from their kids?

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It’s hard when folks who aging and become less able and more dependent refuse to recognize and appreciate the help they’re given. It’s worse when they become demanding and more challenging to be around. I’m sorry your MIL has made it difficult for your wife and others and hope that she doesn’t cause herself to be in a very dangerous situation where no one WANTS to be able to help her because of past history. It’s tough when the person who needs and is getting help believes she is the magnanimous hostess and doesn’t realize that others are helping her! You are right that if she stops having her regular paid helpers on a consistent basis, they will find other, more consistent clients who will pay them regularly and leave her having to find new helpers. Sorry for all who are navigating these tricky situations.

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Yes. Husband & I dealt with this a lot w/his mom for the last 10 yr of her life. We loved her very much, but she was quite self-absorbed and felt deep into the depths of her soul that it is THE #1 job of a parent’s adult children to take care of all of the elderly parent’s needs above the needs of the adult child’s own immediate family.

I am a giver. So if you give something small of yourself to me, I’m happy to give that back to you many times over. Except my MIL took advantage of that. I grew very resentful, so in order to keep my sanity, I took a step back and essentially told my H, “Your mother, your problem.”

For the last 5 yr of her life, MIL was legally blind and could no longer drive. We’d at that point moved a 90 min drive from her house and she demanded that my H go visit her and help her with errands several times a week.

For over a year, he went there 2x/wk, sometimes 3. She never offered to chip in for gas money for all of the miles he put on our vehicles on these trips. She expected/demanded to be taken out to eat in a restaurant each time and demanded that my H pay. However, at the same time, my H wouldn’t set boundaries with her on this, so he was part of the problem, too.

She refused to adjust to getting things done in a more efficient way. For example:

  • Weekly grocery shopping - How about placing an online order for pick up? Nope, she “didn’t feel comfortable” doing that. Wanted to go up and down each aisle like she always did. But she needed to use a scooter and couldn’t see very well. It took her an hour and a half every time.
  • Grocery shopping - how about giving H a list and he goes and buys the stuff for her and she reimburses him? Nope, she “didn’t feel comfortable,” wanted to do the shopping like she’d always done.
  • Prescription drug refills - she had her meds at 3 different pharmacies. And she refused to do mail order/home delivery for her maintenance medications. Nope, she “didn’t feel comfortable” doing that, wanted to be able to see the pharmacist in person each time. AND on top of that, the timing of all of those meds were such that she was going to a pharmacy every week of the month. And don’t get me started on her insulin…she’d get that from the Walmart pharmacy because it was cheapest there, but she’d only buy 1 week’s supply at a time “because I can’t afford it.” But it’s the same price per month whether you buy a month’s supply or 1 week at a time. Flat out refused to change.
  • Buying cat food & litter for her 2 cats - How about doing a regular monthly delivery from a store like Chewy? Nope, she “didn’t feel comfortable.” H finally put his foot down with that and said he wasn’t helping her with that anymore. Then suddenly, what do you know? She managed to “feel comfortable” with an online order, but H had to be the one to set it all up because her whole entire life, she was practically allergic to technology.

It made our home life for our immediate family, honestly, extremely stressful, like, all of the time. My kids & I greatly resented it while it was happening. H would try to talk some sense into her, but she just wouldn’t have it. She actually did say to my H out loud several times that children should always put their parents above their spouses & their own children. She DID. NOT. CARE when my H would tell her that all of her demands were really hard on him and too difficult time-wise.

Things finally came to a head when H’s sister (my SIL) went to visit MIL for a long weekend around MIL’s birthday one year. SIL offered to MIL that she’d be the one that week to drive MIL around to all of her myriad of errands (some of which included spur of the moment things like “Oh since we’re out, could we go to Crate And Barrel, Pottery Barn, Target, and the Hallmark store, too?”). Over the course of 3 days, it was, like, almost 8 hr/day of Driving Miss Daisy all over creation.

MIL, with SIL AND with my H, refused to tell anybody ahead of time what she needed to do, where she needed to go, etc. She’d spring it on you last minute. So H would think he was just going to hang out with his mom and chat for an hour or 2 and then be able to go home, but MIL wanted 4 hr of driving everywhere or she’d have 4 hr of “honey do” chores for him to do.

Anyway, my SIL told her mom that enough was enough, she (MIL) was being totally unreasonable and this all has to stop.

Did it stop? Not really. It slowed down temporarily.

Did MIL take H up on his multiple offers to help her find an assisted living facility to move into? No. Refused.

Instead, MIL played some sort of victim game with people at her church and got another retired lady to basically be her buddy & chauffeur (unpaid) all day, every day. 7 days a week. Church Friend would pick her up in the morning and they’d spend literally all day running around and doing things.

I think with your MIL, it’s wise for your wife to consider stepping back from doing as much as she has been. Sometimes with certain seniors, you just have to be very blunt, very clear (in a caring, kind way, of course) in communicating to them what you will and will not do.

I would bet you $$ that the 1 local sibling of your wife’s who refuses to get sucked into it has probably been burned by your MIL before and has decided, “Stick a fork in me because I’m done.”

The sense of entitlement with certain aging parents can be quite strong. And an adult child is not a bad person for needing to put their own household’s needs first, before the out-of-touch entitled elderly parent.

Why? Because, as every average person knows out there, what’s your elderly parent going to do if YOU need urgent help at a moment’s notice? You’re certainly not going to be able to rely on the infirmed elderly parent, are they? No. You’ve got to rely on yourself to figure it out.

What contributes to the situation, in my opinion, also, is that elderly parents’ social circle is smaller. They’re much more likely to be out of touch with how the world operates today. They still want to be able to pay for their groceries with a check in person. They don’t necessarily like buying all this stuff online, they want to go to a store in person, touch & feel the merchandise, browse, and THEN make a decision.

I feel for what you & your wife are going through. It’s really hard.

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For my dad we never had help and split duty between me and my sister. For the most part my dad was always happy to have us around. We had our moments but our anger has never lasted long in our family and nobody holds grudges. He was always a giving person and his neighbors were extremely helpful when he needed anything. It was hard though as caregivers–we basically lived away from our families often to care for him.

My aunt who lived in another state in independent living had aids who took care of errands for her for many years. We retained them when she needed a lot more care not because they were the “best” or “most knowledgeable” but because they had become her friends–she trusted them and you could tell they would do their best for her.

My friend currently has her dad living with her and while she’s happy to take on the task it is challenging for her. He sometimes criticizes her efforts which she takes as a personal insult. I keep reminding her that his world is incredibly small from what it was and he doesn’t get to talk about his latest ski trip–it’s more about the handle in the bathroom or how hard his chair is. Those aren’t criticisms–that’s his current life. He does have his faculties which is huge.

She does try to get aides on a regular basis for extra help but the biggest hurdle is finding someone reliable. And not just reliable but willing to do what needs doing. The last one was supposed to cover 630-830pm to cover meal and bed routine. Didn’t show up until 7:15pm–when friend called the home health agency at 7:10pm asking where she was (her dad had called her to say nobody came) they said “she’s not there? She’s already clocked in.” Another one bites the dust.