<p>I hope my mention of “resume builders” doesn’t offend anyone. Last year I brought up the subject on another thread and all these angry parents replied that their kid was president of every club and genuinely loved every one, etc etc. That is certainly true in some cases. But I can guaranty that the other kids can tell the difference between those with genuine passion and the resume builders.</p>
<p>There were two guys in last year’s senior class who looked identical on paper…each had outstanding ECs. One was beloved because he had a genuine passion for everthing he was involved in. The other’s name was always met with a chuckle, because he was perceived as operating with a “checklist” of things he had to do in high school.</p>
<p>Thanks for letting me vent. So frustrating! H and I have decided to have S evaluated, thinking he has some kind of executive functioning disorder. Although S is in private school he knows the local school superintendent and is going to send him an email asking him how we get S evaluated for learning disabilites. My understanding is the local school must pay for this, but we will if we have to. A few months ago I contacted our pediatrician about this issue and he felt S is just an immature lazy kid. I am not sure what it is, but I just don’t get the part about having homework ready to hand in and then not doing it because you only have 2 out of 3 done, or you left it in the locker and figure the teacher won’t accept it now (without even asking the teacher), etc. We have tried all kinds of organizational things with him which help, til we back off, then it all falls apart again. </p>
<p>S has 3 of the best teachers in the school this year (all of whom he has had before) who like him and try to get him to do what needs to be done, but I think it gets tiring when S doesn’t volunteer anything and they have to prod him all the time.</p>
<p>I don’t want to hang the money issue over his head, but it seems risky to me to send a kid off to college who can’t/won’t perform in HS. i know, maybe he will find himself in college, but I will not be happy if he doesn’t and I have spent 40-50K to find out.</p>
<p>There are a couple of boys in S’s boy scout troop who are only there because their parents force them to come. Both have finished their Eagle Project but the scoutmaster won’t sign off due to lack of participation, so they still grudgingly come to meetings. S, OTOH loves scouts. Of course colleges will not know that S participated willingly while the others were forced. what are you going to do.</p>
<p>Having been the parent of a DS just like mamom’s child, all I can say is I doubt disability and think instead “17 year-old male”. Does not like silly projects. Has little patience for mind-numbing activities. </p>
<p>He will grow up and out of this cycle. He will engage, when the material requires it, and when he views his participation as of value. It will happen, but not in HS. DS1 landed at a safety school, has a 4.0, does lots of personal projects with professors, still thinks some work is mindkill but can select not to bother with it… it does work out. Some 17 year old males are not cut out for the busywork of HS. They may be the next efficiency experts, self-employed persons… but they will get there. No disability tests required.</p>
<p>mamom… are our S’s twins… You are not the only one going through this… If I had a dollar for every time I said," Why can’t you just turn in your homework ?? Is it really that difficult?" I would be rich… URGH!!! I get furious after getting report cards that say, Has a B+ but would have had an A if he turned in homework. Just had a conversation with his English teacher and he says,“As much as I love your S and that he is a great student, he is missing assignments.” I have nagged, taken away stuff, yelled, screamed, nothing seems to help. I did have him tested and he was diagnosed with a learning disability… but he refuses any accommodations. </p>
<p>My DS is also a boy scout, Eagle, junior scoutmaster, OA Chapter Chief, and absolutely LOVES scouting. He went to Philmont last summer and is going to Canadian odyssey this summer. It consumes his life… but in a great way… He is a great kid… a son any mother would be proud to have… but gosh darn, why doesn’t he turn in his HOMEWORK!!!</p>
<p>Lord, how I hate those kind of kids. Sometimes I read the “chance me” threads and gape at how many kids are the president/founder of so many clubs. I call BS. I hope the adcoms can sniff these kinds of resume builders out as well.</p>
<p>Anothermom - I married one of those boys! Hardly went to class, barely managed to graduate and did car shop in BOCES (tech school). He never went to college, but to Denver Diesel & Automotive, and has found moderate (monetary) success in his life, high happiness success. He could never sit at a desk and work, and to this day finds reading an entire book an ordeal. But give him a real life mechanical problem to solve and he’s in his element. When we get on our D’s case about school, she holds his history up to him. That he could never have passed the classes she’s in, but what we want for our kids is for them to do better than we did. </p>
<p>The resume builders…it would drive me nuts in the beginning of high school because she just wouldn’t join any clubs - in junior high they held a parents meeting and they stressed how our kids HAD to be in clubs and hold office in order to get into college. Hard when your kid is not a joiner or has trouble breaking into cliques. But she found her way after a while. I can only imagine that the adcom’s can see through some of the resumes! We felt that D’s was slight, only work, babysitting, cheerleading & dance, but it’s real. That’s what she does.</p>
<p>Wow! I can relate to those of you with kids who have problems with executive function. S1, who is now a junior in college, just about drove me crazy with doing the work and not turning it in. Test scores would be good, but he’d get a B+ because he didn’t turn in all of the assignments. He was easily distracted and it seemed to take him forever to get his homework done. When he was in middle school, I took him to a psychologist for a full evaluation. No real surprises – he’s highly intelligent but has problems with executive function. We really worked with him on keeping distractions to a minimum, coming up with a system for remembering what needed to be done and getting it done, and remembering to turn things in. He made some progress. He really is doing fine in college, but I know that he’s still distracted and it takes him a long time to complete things. His GPA is very good, but I know it would be even better without the executive function baggage. He still has a hard time taking the initiative and following through on things like applying for summer internships and research programs, but is doing better. It was frustrating for me because I’m so type A and just couldn’t imagine not turning things in. I’ve learned to relax a bit. I’ve tried to give him skills that will help him…but it’s his job to put the skills to use.</p>
<p>The theme of “why can’t he turn in the homework” prompted me to log into the parent portal of our school’s grade reporting site. Our son hates that I can “stalk” him this way but I love it. It’s amazing how a few assignments not turned in make a difference, even when everything else is an A. Just two 0/10 grades in Math drops an A to an A-, etc. </p>
<p>Right now, the only incentive is the final class rank. A big deal here in our community where the top 10 are feted at a luncheon and at graduation. I guess it depends on how important that is to him, not to his parents. </p>
<p>Is it any coincidence that the great majority of the kids in the thread who can’t seem to turn in their homework are boys?</p>
<p>MaMom, I assume this type of behavior has been going on through-out his academic career?</p>
<p>My son was the same way. We finally had enough after his 1st 5 wk progress report came home in 9th grade and he had a 68 in Earth Science and a 72 in Math A because he didn’t turn in his labs and homework. After spending all of middle school asking him why he didn’t turn his homework in I knew I couldn’t deal with it for 4 yrs, so we pulled him and put him into a private school where they got detention with the teacher that day. Luckily for us that took care of it. We didn’t know what we were going to do if it hadn’t worked except DH & I agreed to let the school deal with it. I’m sure we would have done the testing thing but it was more important for us to have a home life not filled with tension and yelling for 4 yrs. If he had to spend every day in detention so be it. </p>
<p>If your son doesn’t have some kind of LD perhaps he should take a gap year or work for a year. </p>
<p>As for EC’s - we only told our son he had to be active in something. One sport or a club would be fine. But he has been very active and it has all been his choice. He even works part time and has an internship. Every time he told us he wanted to do something I always asked him if was sure he could handle it. My biggest thing was him getting being able to get enough sleep.</p>
<p>We have a kiddo who has big executive funcitn issues–has a high IQ and just seems to be a roller coaster on stuff…and sometimes kiddo hopes if the non-preferred task will go away if ignored long enough!</p>
<p>I have spoken to about half a doz moms in the last 4 days–all with BOYS that have this issue…
Makes me wonder about the traditional schooling and what is it missing that these boys are getting??</p>
<p>fogfog-my D is the most disorganized girl I know. She absolutely can not seem to use a calendar/daily planner. Always forgets appointments/due dates. today she was supposed to go in early to tutor for chorus. She told me about it a few days ago, but since I didn’t remind her…she didn’t remember. I seriously don’t know how she is going to survive next year. Makes me crazy all the time with her papers all over the place and her lax attitude towards deadlines! OY!!! So, it isn’t just boys :)</p>
<p>fogfog - Could not agree with you more. I don’t think today’s public schools typically with large classes, underpaid teachers and squeezed budgets can accommodate the needs of most male students. Is it right to expect a class of 15 5 year boys and 15 5 year old girls to sit at desks all day? These kids need recess, PE, art, music - all the ‘extras’ that get cut. Boys and girls learn differently and need to to be taught differently. Experienced well-paid teachers generally can handle this better than new teachers. </p>
<p>Our son would probably have done very poorly in public school. He had ants in his pants and was bored easily. His private school knew how to deal effectively with him and helped him blossom. All kids should benefit from this type of great education - small classes, resources, music, art, PE, recess and well-paid, trained teachers.</p>
<p>I don’t want to be a Debbie Downer, but this is the downfall of many extremely bright college students. High school = structure. College = total lack of structure. </p>
<p>Is your D the type who always remembers at the last minute and pulls it off herself (even though it makes you nervous), or would things go totally un-done and not remembered if you didn’t say anything? </p>
<p>Here’s how my son turned an A into a C- in his favorite college class last year. Loved the class. Understood the material. Great class participation. Did well on tests. BUT, they were supposed to do an on-line quiz every week. He got 100s on the two he remembered to do because they were very easy. BUT he forgot to do the rest of them…what the teacher probably intended to be a grade booster ditched his grade because he had a whole semester of 0s on quiz grades. No Mom there to say, “Did you remember to do your on-line quiz this week?” No teacher who said, “I noticed you haven’t been doing your on-line quizes.” He was on his own and he forgot.</p>
<p>Bad turned to worse. Really bad. At least that semester I was aware of the issues, so I had him drop two classes that he was failing (or close to). He ended the semester with a 3.0, but that was with only 10 hours. Even then, he got a B- on a class that should have been an A+. Same thing - it was a lit class and the teacher required them to make comments on the reading on this blog site. He forgot to do it most of the time. He could have talked your ear off about the reading - maybe even recited long passages to you from memory. But he didn’t do the blogs so he had a bunch of 0s. </p>
<p>There is *so much more *to success in college than mastery of the material. I keep thinking that the brilliant guy who could have cured cancer is probably working at a Best Buy somewhere because he has executive function disorder and couldn’t finish college.</p>
<p>Parents, just trust your gut. I had serious doubts about whether my son could make it away at school. But I felt like I couldn’t tell him, “You can’t do it.” My doubts proved true. If you are a postive, supportive parent but still have nagging doubts about some issue, your instincts are probably correct.</p>
<p>she is USUALLY more of a pull it off at the last minute type…but sometimes completely spaces on stuff. You are not being a Debbie Downer. this is a serious concern of mine and one reason I hope that by going to a small LAC she won’t fall through the cracks!</p>
<p>Gosh, you could be quoting one of my posts from the fall of 2008! I genuinely believed all the “personal attention” hype the school dished out. But I found out that a student can be ignored in a class of 15 just the same as he can be ignored in a class of 150.</p>
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<p>The teacher in question was a clinical psycholigist, his academic advisor and knew he had Asperger’s and still never said a word to remind him about the quizzes. It certainly wasn’t her responsibility to do that…I just thought that at a small LAC, the teachers would take a bit of an interest. I thought wrong. In two semesters he didn’t encounter a single prof who cared a bit about him at his Colleges That Change Lives school.</p>
<p>Sorry for the bitter rant. I hope that your daughter has a much better experience. Just take a healthy dose of realism with your optimism.</p>