<p>Our hs does not recommend lots of testing, nor testing too “early”…</p>
<p>Is there much research to prove that early and regular testing brings up a score…??
or do the kids who take them early and often become what many complain of…“professional test takers”??</p>
<p>While I want to have our student benefit by what we have learned with our sr kiddo
(2011) I worry about adding more pressure and testing that might be unnecessary…</p>
<p>At regional seminars–HYP/MIT etc…I have heard the admissions reps say they do not want to see lots of tests…and at some point–all scores must be sent, ACT or SAT1s…if its for the uber selective schools…</p>
<p>What is the cut off for testing prior to applications in terms of early test dates and too many scores???</p>
<p>I have one student who has taken the SAT eight times, and she plans on doing it again in a week. She has not reached the score she desires. She would love for it to be 100 or more points higher to reach the type of numbers that an older sister had. My youngest just wanted to take it, because he wanted to see what he could do on it. There is no pressure on him, so he should be very relaxed when he takes it.</p>
<p>Mom^
Is this a hs freshman? who took it eight times already?
Thats very ambitious.</p>
<p>I guess I will search the collegeboard site to see when they start “seeing” scores…meaning is it only scores from soph- onward, etc…2 yrs out? that get sent to ALL scores schools that don’t allow score choice?</p>
<p>Also does anyone know if there are limits to if a test may be used for admission–meaning if a subject test etc is taken 3 yrs out from applications–it isnt recent enough a testing to be valid, right?</p>
<p>PSAT and ACT Explore don’t show up on the test record, so they’re a safe way to practice. D1 (2011) took it from 8th grade through 11th because that’s what the school did as a way to tell the students that the SAT/ACT are important for college admissions. She did the ACT in 8th grade to qualify for a CTY program; that score no longer shows up. The early PSATs gave us a read on if she’d be a contender for NMSF. For a kid who does well academically, that’s probably the best reason to take the PSAT earlier than 11th grade.</p>
<p>D2, our 2014, took the ACT Explore last year because the school had all students take it. She does horribly on standardized tests. She won’t benefit from early testing as practice, so I don’t see her starting any real testing (aside from jr. year PSAT as practice) until late in her junior year.</p>
<p>FogFog: My student who is taking the SAT a ninth time is a senior. She started her freshman year doing this. … As for seeing scores, my freshman can see his SAT (that he took through the Johns Hopkins Program) online.</p>
<p>^
Right- our sr can see the talent search SAt from 7th grade online…</p>
<p>I just wondered if scores from 9th grade show up for Srs…kwim? Meaning must they all be fully disclosed. </p>
<p>Dont know what we will do with out Freshman.
Our Sr took SAT1 once, and ACT twice. And SAT2s in Math 2, physics and chem…and APs…
so not lots of extra testing needed …
may be a different story for our freshman–a bit too early to tell as we have seen maturity each year and thats encouraging ;o)</p>
<p>We’ve used the Explore and then ACT as achievement tests for our 2014 son. We’ve used the scores to advocate for more challenging course work - online high school courses in place of some middle school courses and skipping some others. He doesn’t mind the testing and likes to try to beat his scores (and those of his older brother and sister). He had a 32 composite in June and so far he has the highest math score of them all.</p>
<p>DD attended a college fair on 10/6/10 & pretty much looked at top LACs & universities only–I know, I know, most are reaches for everyone. I pretty much stepped back (read, sat in a corner with my laptop) as DD visited each booth. She had lengthy conversations with several Admins who new she is a frosh.</p>
<p>Here comes the brag report-- DD received 2 hand-written postcards from 2 top LACs, and a personal letter from a well known university telling D how impressed they each were with D even though she’s a frosh in high school. She’s to keep in contact with two of them. WHOOP, WHOOP! Now dd just needs to keep her grades on point and continue with her ECs & test well.</p>
<p>One of the Admins told D about a summer program, when to apply, and if in need of tuition assistance to contact them. I’m doing the moonwalk, but I know it’s WAY TOO EARLY, lol: grades, essays, test scores, & ECs is what matters in the end 4 years from now.</p>
<p>Good to aim for the top and good thing she is interested. It is hard to maintain that momentum for three years.</p>
<p>My older D is a senior now. She remembers friends and acquaintances bragging freshman and sophomore year about where they were going to go: “I’m going to Yale.” “I’m going to Vanderbilt.” “I’m going to William and Mary.” Other people in her class were naive enough to be impressed by these declarations. Of course now, when it’s application time, none of those people are applying anywhere amazing and most will stay within three hours of home.</p>
<p>And sometimes it’s just too muich. The Yale aspirant was checking her grades online twice a day for most of freshman year. It was stressing her out to the max. </p>
<p>There are some things that, while technically within your control, are barely in your control and can drive you crazy. Example: This girl was in a G/T freshman English class. It had the same weighting as the pre-AP, but the teacher of the G/T class decided that she should teach her students that they were not God’s gift to the world…so she gave most of them failing grades on their early writing assignments. The other teacher was giving the normal range of grades for what was probably the same quality (or inferior) work. The teacher of the G/T class may have achieved her desired result of shocking the students into becoming better writers, but the students in that class had lower grades than the students in the other. Where class rank is determined by hundredths of GPA points, obsessing over grades can be far too stressful for some students.</p>
<p>^ They will find this is a cold hard reality. </p>
<p>A pre-AP Chem (equivalent to honors Chem) teacher my 2011 son had told the students the first day, and parents on back to school night, you/your students are the best and brightest. They are used to getting A’s. I’m here to tell you I’m the A-buster. Super…you are here simply to kill a GPA regardless of a students ability, effort, etc. You are starting out with the mentality of killing their grades. She was very tough, you had to play the game her way, she couldn’t stand the kids in my son’s EC and had a personal issue with the coach which she took out on the kids. My son did end up with an A, and she stopped him in the hall early this year asking to write a LOR for him. Go figure?</p>
<p>They will also find classes that are academically not equal that are weighted the same. They will have to decide between rigor of study and the possibility of a lower grade. My older son chose Functions/Geometry last year instead of Functions/Trig. He did get a B+ and was thrilled. He is sailing through Calc this year. The students who took the easier class may have gotten a higher grade that was weighted the same, but are ill prepared for Calc. He’s going into engineering so it was the right choice for him.</p>
<p>Right now, many of our freshman are in honors and can’t imagine changing that line of study. We know that at some point they will have to choose where they put their energies. Not all students, very few in fact, are cut out to take APs in every subject. To do so, and sacrifice your grades in all classes isn’t good either.</p>
<p>It helped our 2014 student to attend some college visits with his older brother (2011) last year and get an idea of what is important in admissions. He can keep that in mind when choosing classes etc, balancing with his own interests. If you have a science/math student look for schools that host a STEM open house. It can be really exciting for them and give a good perspective, as well as motivation. Our largest state engineering school hosts theirs in the spring and is well worth the trip.</p>
<p>Another true story from our HS. Freshmen bio students always have to build a model of a cell…most models involve a sterlite container and hair gel. Identical twins turned in identical cell projects to different teachers. One got a 100; the other got a 70 (the lowest passing grade.) The parents took it up to the principal but the grades stood.</p>
<p>Yes, the top 20 students in the class are all very bright and very hard working. However, I think that it does take an element of luck to emerge as #1 instead of #20…luck to avoid the teachers who are intentional GPA busters; luck to avoid the super easy math teacher who gives you an easy A but then leaves you unprepared for the next level of math; luck to be healthy and not miss too much class due to illness. Etc.</p>
<p>And sometimes, I don’t know if I want to encourage the kid to keep that momentum at all. Do I really want her to be just another rat in the race? Watching senior od1’s class has almost sickened me with the back-biting and the competativeness between those at the top of the class (or vying for the top spots in music, drama, etc.). Sure, somebody has to go to the Ivies or the top LACs, but od2, my freshman and the one with Ivy dreams, is one of the least competative people I know. (And her sister, the one without as many academic gifts, is one of the most.)</p>
<p>Then you get the teachers that make it so insanely hard that even the best of students with ethics you would never question cheat. It killed me when I found out how many in the Jr year. I backed off my son and told him his best, honest B was better than an A he received cheating. He looked at me and said ‘the kids cheating are getting C’s’. I put no pressure on him. They were the first B’s he’d every gotten (on a report card). I didn’t want him to feel so much pressure that he ever made a knee-jerk bad decision he would later regret. The end result were Bs for the year in those classes, but 4’s on the AP exams because he was actually doing the work himself. He found great satisfaction in that! Students that had cheated may have gotten A’s, but many got 1’s on the AP exams. So, their rank may be higher, but that’s life.</p>
<p>We are so glad that he’s not sitting on the tippy top where everything is about competition and watching someone else. He’s sitting well above 10% which is good for admissions, and he can just worry about himself. Far more comfortable than racing for the top 1-10 spots! Our 2014 son has learned a lot from his brother.</p>
<p>missypie, You are so right about random luck of teachers, preparedness, illness, etc. While I want S3 to do well, I hope for his sake he’s not at the tippy top either. There is way too much drama and stress!</p>
<p>But I think it can work with some people. I was very highly ranked in my own high school way back when and I am extremely non-competitive…I wasn’t really competing against the other students. I guess I was competing with myself, or challenging myself, or whatever. Let’s say I had some ridiculous history test coming up where there were 100 dates to be memorized…that’s nothing that is hard to comprehend, it just takes time…so I always was the person who took the time to get every single point I possibly could. It didn’t matter to me if everyone else in the class got 100; I just knew I would be disappointed in myself if *I *didn’t get a 100. I’m not bragging here…I’m just saying that there is a personality type that can do very well without back-stabbing or going crazy.</p>
<p>missypie - I totally agree. There absolutely are students cut out to take a maximum load of APs and push themselves on a personal level…very few, but there are some. Two of my best girlfriends each have one of their students who are like this. The trick is for the parents to know their own students and help them make the right choices. More often, as they progress it will become evident where their strengths lie and that is where their focus should be placed.</p>