<p>PinotNoir I will forward ours to you! I would consider yourself lucky. It must be some computer glitch-</p>
<p>I have a radical position regarding standardized testing:</p>
<p>For some kids (maybe even most kids) it might be better to wait until later to take the SAT or ACT. Much later … like spring of junior year or even fall of senior year.</p>
<p>Here’s my reasoning:
(1) College Board data shows that that most kids gain up to a couple of hundred SAT points between sophomore and senior year. Most of this gain isn’t from studying – it’s just “natural” increase from having taken classes that covered more of the material on the test, plus increasing maturity and test-taking sophistication. </p>
<p>(2) It can cause a lot of discord between parents and teens if parents push their kids to study for standardized tests and start the college search process before the kids are ready.</p>
<p>(3) Most kids (~97%) will not qualify for National Merit recognition. If you know your kid isn’t a good test-taker, e.g., if your kid is not in the top 10~20%ile on standardized tests (including the state-mandated tests that most schools administer yearly), then they probably don’t even need to bother with the PSAT.</p>
<p>(4) If your kid is targeting state schools, less-selective privates, or test-optional colleges, they may not even need to submit SAT or ACT or SAT subject scores. Check with some colleges-of-interest to see whether you can entirely avoid the hassle and expense of these tests.</p>
<p>(5) Yes, you might want a ball-park estimate of scores in order to figure out what level of colleges to target. However, you DON’T need to take an official College Board test to figure this out. There are free test sections available online, or else you can buy (or get from the library) a copy of the CB prep book with many sample tests. If your kid is willing, you can sit her down to do a sample test under real-test-like conditions. You can do this for FREE and avoid the hassle and stress of getting your kid to a test center at 8am on a Saturday. </p>
<p>(5a) If you cannot get your kid to sit down for a sample test under real-test-like conditions, maybe that is telling you something about your child’s preferences and aptitudes. Maybe they won’t be all that willing to sit down and prep for a tip-top “real” test score, either. Maybe this is your kid’s way of telling you that you should be less-selective schools or test-optional colleges.</p>
<p>(6) Colleges all say they consider only your best scores, but is that really true? If so, then why do many of the most selective colleges insist that you send all scores? Think about it: if they see two applicants identical scores, but one got their high score in a single sitting and the other crept upward over many sittings, which would look more attractive? Thus it may be better to wait until you’re ready to do your best on the test(s). </p>
<p>All of these reasons lead me to conclude that for some kids (most kids?) it might be better to wait, and take SAT or ACT later. Keep in mind that most colleges will accept standardized tests taken through December of senior year or even later. </p>
<p>(Yes, EA/ED applicants may face an earlier deadline. But is EA/ED really a good idea for your kid? EA/ED is most suitable for a kid who is firmly decided on what they want. A kid like this probably also has an earlier-maturing go-getter type of personality, and they might also be ready to take the SAT or ACT earlier. If your kid isn’t like that, then maybe they shouldn’t apply EA/ED … and should also hold back on the standardized tests.)</p>
<p>That’s an interesting and worthwhile perspective mihcal and one that fits with what our GCs advise. Definitely food for thought. As I said earlier, my big worry is overloading dd with too many tests and activities at once next spring. This was a huge stressor for my oldest and this is a girl who doesn’t stress about much. My middle dd studied outside the U.S. for 2nd semester junior year and took the SAT when she returned in June. She did not do as well as she hoped and now her testing was pushed into her senior year. She fell in love with a college and wanted to apply ED but couldn’t because she needed to add more subject tests–which were difficult to fit in now that she had to re-take the SAT 1. (Said college abandoned the extra subject test requirement AND added EDII the year after D applied grrrr)</p>
<p>The other issue for D#3 is that our state schools allow for rolling admissions and decisions are given in order of application with scholarships and honors programs offered to those who apply in the first wave. Since these are a potential option for her, I want to make sure she is able to apply on time.</p>
<p>I wish these tests were offered over the summer.</p>
<p>mihcal1,</p>
<p>I’m thinking of testing the waters for my 2015er just to see if I can actually find a place that gives accommodations and just to see what it’s like since he’s never taken a standardized test outside of my home. Hopefully, a bad SAT sophomore year won’t be a deal breaker.</p>
<p>The thing is, this kid’s got so many issues, he’s getting further behind in math. He did algebra the summer before 9th grade and he’s still on geometry. Ugh. He was supposed to be in Alg. II beginning in the fall or even December, but he’s had too many health issues. :-(</p>
<p>On the upside, he’s done some at home PSAT testing and he got a 71 on CR and a 74 on W. (Hasn’t finished the math yet!) This was without any studying. I think with practice and a little more familiarity (his verbal skills are one of his strong suites), he could probably get high 70s (maybe high 700s??) without too much trouble. </p>
<p>It’s just that darn math…sigh. Time to get him a tutor. I think I need to beg my oldest son at MIT to skype tutor him! LOL</p>
<p>Not to take anything away from mihcal’s excellent and thorough explanation, but I will present a counter position. Just food for thought.</p>
<p>My son has never performed consistently on standardized tests. He is allowed to use additional time in school for exams and does take advantage of it periodically, but usually for only an additional ten minutes or so. I did not know how he would perform on the SATs but I knew that CB would not grant him additional testing time w/o undergoing the full series of testing that takes hours and costs thousands. I also wondered if he would want to sit for 45 minutes for a 30 minute section. It seemed that it would be an exhaustingly long day.</p>
<p>So, he prepped the summer after 10th grade, planning to take the Oct and Dec SATs his Jr year. Summer practice test scores were better than I would have expected given his soph year PSAT scores, so we plowed forward. If the practice scores had not been strong, then I would have reconsidered the timing, but I really wanted to have the SAT out of the way in case he needed to try the ACT. And, if needed, I would then consider pursuing additional time for the ACT, even though I wanted to avoid it.</p>
<p>His total score increased 180 points from Oct to Dec but 100 points was due to the Writing section. He hadn’t actually prepped for Writing as I bought into the whole “colleges don’t care about writing scores”, but when writing is 100 points below the others, the score is just too glaring. The timed essay was his problem each time as he never managed to complete the full five paragraph and he didn’t enjoy practicing for that the way he ‘enjoyed’ answering multiple choice questions. </p>
<p>One unexpected benefit of prepping for the Oct SAT is that he managed to achieve Nat’l Merit Commended level on his PSAT. And, I have to say that scoring as well as he did seems to have focused him more on his regular coursework. His grades are better than they have ever been. </p>
<p>As we were leaving a swim meet tonight, I was very grateful that he would not be taking the SAT exam tomorrow morning along with almost every other Jr in his HS. Each student and each family must decide what will work best given the student’s academic and EC demands. This is not to take anything away from mihcal’s excellent post, but just to provide a different perspective. </p>
<p>sbjdorlo–those are excellent PSAT scores. Is your child one who could learn by watching Kahn Academy? My younger son found it when trying to teach himself math that he needed to know for programming languages. The entire Algebra curriculum is on-line at Kahn Academy. SAT Math was my older son’s lowest score also, but from what I can tell looking at the PSAT questions and the QAS from the Oct SAT, his mistakes were mostly careless errors. The math curve is very unforgiving, at least compared to the CR curve.</p>
<p>3girls3cats–No, not missing anything in the mail. I am not sure what screening criteria the schools use, but he has received mail/email ranging from Hofstra to Dartmouth. </p>
<p>I am sure you know to do this since you have one through already, but I had my son create a college email account that is only used for colleges. It is easier for him to filter this way.</p>
<p>making my head spin reading about the SAT and other test info. October of Jr year seems early to me?
I believe D1 did the January SAT in Jr year and then another that June which seemed to work for her.
Of course each kid is different, D2 seems more driven typeA --took the PSAT this past October as a sophomore and did very, very well. SO we’ll see what might work for her.
Unfortunately she put our family email on that, lots coming in that box and some snailmail also–set up her “college” account after that for a college showcase soccer tournament.
D1 did not take any subject tests, wasn’t interested in colleges that required them. so that whole area will be new to us if D2 needs to take any.</p>
<p>Collegemaw–if D2 will be a soccer recruit, she may need to have these scores in hand earlier than D1 did. Have you visited the Athletic Recruiting site under College Admissions on CC? Excellent advice there by some parents who have been through this process. I do not know the soccer recruiting cycle, but if you post on that forum, someone will certainly know the answer. (Or you may be able to search there and find it.)</p>
<p>If she plans to look at the Ivies, she will need SAT IIs. They are administered each time the SAT I is administered with the exception of March. Also, language tests with listening may only be administered in Nov (confirm that, as I am not certain).</p>
<p>Many schools will accept the ACT in place of SAT Subject tests.</p>
<p>^^^<br>
The most commonly taken of the subject tests (EngLit, BioE/M, Chem, Physics, Math1 & Math2) are offered each time the SAT is offered (Oct, Nov, Dec, Jan, May, June).</p>
<p>World History is offered only in Dec & June. Ditto Latin.
French and Spanish are offered almost every test date, the other languages less frequently.
CT1417 is correct that languages with listening are only offered in Nov.</p>
<p>The full schedule for 2012-13 is [url=<a href=“The SAT – SAT Suite | College Board”>The SAT – SAT Suite | College Board]here[/url</a>].<br>
I don’t know when CB will post 2013-2014 dates, but the schedule seems fairly consistent year to year.</p>
<p>mihcal1 has great advice. I would just like to comment on one thing about EA/ED:
" (Yes, EA/ED applicants may face an earlier deadline. But is EA/ED really a good idea for your kid? EA/ED is most suitable for a kid who is firmly decided on what they want. A kid like this probably also has an earlier-maturing go-getter type of personality, and they might also be ready to take the SAT or ACT earlier. If your kid isn’t like that, then maybe they shouldn’t apply EA/ED … and should also hold back on the standardized tests.)"</p>
<p>This is all true except for one difference between EA/ED. ED is binding so you do really need to be sure that is the school for you. However an EA acceptance is not binding so there is no need to be firmly decided. A lot of kids apply EA (or early for schools that do rolling acceptances) so they have a school acceptance in hand early in the process. Sure makes things less stressful in the spring!</p>
<p>That said, even for EA, you are making the decision that junior/early senior year test scores and GPA only through end of junior year are what you are willing to have the admission decision based on.</p>
<p>Marching band is always problematic here for fall test dates so we will probably start testing December of junior year. Also, our school offers one practice ACT session every session done at the school by a local prep company. It provides a real test atmosphere (except that it is done after school) for a minimal fee and nothing on an official record. I think there other local tutoring agencies that will let you pay for a single simulated test session with no obligation, mostly because it is a way to identify potential new clients.</p>
<p>DD has received mailings from about 30 different schools over the last few days. I asked her did she want to look at them or did she want me to file them for later. She said that she would look at the later when she was ready. So the agreement now is that I’m her admin. asst. and I’ll collect and categorize her information until she’s interested. I’m perfectly fine with this. She has too much to concentrate on in school and ECs. </p>
<p>It seems that most of the schools send out the same type of letter. I found that Wake Forest, Wesleyan and Washington& Lee were a little different form the generic letter. Has anyone started making plans for summer? DD just finished her application to LEAD Global South Africa or Canada.</p>
<p>STEMfamily, do you have experience with those simulated tests? I have to wonder if they are more difficult than the real thing in order to create a false sense that there is a need for private tutoring. We just received a mailer from the school about one of these and I’m equivocating as to whether this would be helpful or too discouraging.</p>
<p>3girls—even though you asked STEM, I will hop in here to share my son’s experience. (Hope that is OK!)</p>
<p>We have also received countless mailings from an unbelievable # of prep/tutoring companies offering free assessments. My son did not try any of them but he did complete many Blue Book practice tests, both at home and under timed conditions with the tutoring company we used. His scores on the second sitting of his real SAT were almost exactly the same as his best practice SAT. The tutoring companies all have old copies of the Jan, May & Oct SAT exams. </p>
<p>If the assessment is free, I would try it b/c it can’t hurt, as long as you will not be under any obligation. The tutoring company I hired suggested I have my son complete two full-length SAT and ACT practice tests before deciding to proceed with either the SAT and ACT. He believed that the student should just choose the one he is naturally more comfortable with and only study for one. As he said, I could pay him to administer practice tests or I could do it at home for free.</p>
<p>I didn’t bother and just started him on SAT prep and it worked out fine. Four practice tests seemed crazy before we had started but now that we are through it, I do see his point. (And, I should not say ‘we’ as my total involvement was writing checks, driving and reminding.)</p>
<p>D. decided not to do marching band in the junior year for the sake of testing. last year she tested PSAT in October. She wants to take PSAT and SAT this year in October. Hopefully if she scores high enough she’ll be done with general SAT. But she remembers last year how marching band made it absolutely impossible for her to do any study at all for PSAT. The night before PSAT, there was a game. She didn’t finish band until almost 10pm, then there was a ton of homework. She didn’t go to bed until 1am. She did ok in PSAT but next time she definitely wants to do better. She wants to study for PSAT. She also wants to be able to go to bed at a reasonable time the night before the test.</p>
<p>3girls3cats: It is the environment that is simulated (ie taking it under timed conditions). I would make sure the tests themselves are actual ACT/SAT tests from previous years. I agree with CT1417 that I would only do it under the condition that there is no obligation to do subsequent tutoring sessions. The person we went with for our D13 and probably will use for S15 also did an initial, free session with no obligation. And we knew he had very good credentials because he taught a summer class at a local private school that D had taken immediately after her freshman year.</p>
<p>herandhisMom: At least our school gives the PSAT on Wednesday so no chance there will be a football game the night before! I also let my older D skip zero hour that morning so she lost a few band attendance points but it was worth it!</p>
<p>Thanks CT1417 (sorry for butchering your name before, I got mixed up with a different poster’s name) and STEMfamily. It sounds like the practice tests are based on actual tests and should be a reasonably good approximation of the real thing. I assume these should be treated as diagnostic and taken without looking at a sample test beforehand? D scored well on the PSAT this year but the stamina required for the much lengthier SAT as well as the essay are extra challenges that could affect that scoring.</p>
<p>This is just my opinion and I have no expertise on this subject…but, I think it would be useful to take one practice test w/o prep in order to provide direction to your D. As in, to show her where her innate strengths and weaknesses are. </p>
<p>But, if you are concerned that taking the test blind might undermine her confidence, then instead have her complete sections of the practice tests from the BB. (Work from only one test so that you leave more of the tests complete as future practice tests. And I think I read somewhere to leave tests 1 through 3 for later.)</p>
<p>Initially, have her complete w/o regard for time but after the first few practice sections, move on to timing just so that she can get the feel for the timing as that is a huge part of the SAT.</p>
<p>Now, if you plan to have her take a diagnostic SAT and ACT, then I would advise not doing any prep, just so that she can figure out which one is more natural. (I am sure you have received mailings from more than one test center. It depends on how much time you want to put into this.)</p>
<p>The essay is the most difficult part to simulate. As such, there is much written about it on CC. Students post their 12 scored essays and I even recall reading one student who had summarized all of the essay prompts from the past several years. I think it would be difficult to score 10 or above without some practice, but my son had on interest in practicing an essay. </p>
<p>Any prep for the SAT will help her Jr year PSAT. My son’s tutoring company advised not to bother tutoring for PSAT as he felt the SAT prep would accomplish the same purpose. Having said that, there is no harm in working through the practice test that is given to the students when they register for the PSAT.</p>
<p>I really liked Mihcal’s post. We all do it differently. We waited until June of Junior year to take the SAT and ACT with older S. We wanted to have as much school behind him as we could. We will do the same with younger S. I totally understand though people wanting to take the tests earlier who have test taking issues.</p>