<p>My S did do the PSAT practice test before the real thing but with no studying or follow-up coaching on strategy. The reason I wanted him to do some beforehand was just to familiarize himself with the test format, the directions, and the grid-in math section. I thought we would get a better understanding of true weaknesses without having them exacerbated by lack of familiarity with the test itself. And he did do miserably on one section of the practice test where he wasn’t totally clear on the directions. He did quite a bit better a few days later on that section so I think it would have been misleading if he hadn’t done the practice.</p>
<p>Just want to be sure I am clear…I completely agree with STEM that a glancing familiarity with the test is important. I was speaking directly to 3girls’ question about taking these complimentary diagnostic SATs offered by the various prep firms. </p>
<p>My son’s prep for the sophomore PSAT was simply completing the one practice test the school gave him when he registered. I think it is worth prepping for the Jr year test, at least if the student is in range for NMF.</p>
<p>CT1417 good point about D2’s possible soccer recruitment and getting tests done earlier,
thanks!</p>
<p>I have browsed and posted a bit in the Athletic CC section, and all THAT makes my head spin also,my goodness all the rules about coach contacts etc etc.</p>
<p>Agree with you that PSAT is worth studying for if in possible range for NMF.</p>
<p>My D.'s PSAT this year is 5 points below our states NSF this year. Of course she is a sophomore so there is no chance for her anyway. But that really brought her hope up. She wants to study for it and try NSF next year. She didn’t really study this year. She did two sample tests back in August and said she was going to study some. Then marching band started and out went the study plan.</p>
<p>herandhis–that should be easily achievable, given that her score was that high as a soph w/o prep. I think working through the CB BB practice tests this summer will help. Also, she will have had another full year of school, another year of math and more exposure to vocabulary. I look forward to your post next Dec reporting that she has scored well above your state’s cutoff.</p>
<p>herandhisMom – My S is in the same position here and I have the exact same worry about what will happen when marching band starts. The only thing I can think to do is start early and keep the pace slow but steady, and I’m hoping that by seeing some early improvement, he will be more motivated to squeeze in some September/October practice tests.</p>
<p>I also agree with STEM and CT that familiarity with the test protocol is important. I would not send my kid into any test, not least a test that goes on her permanent record, without having read the syllabus and test rules and having at least one run-through of a sample test. I’m a firm believer of the scout motto “Be Prepared!” </p>
<p>However, you don’t have to take an official College Board sitting, nor pay a test-prep company to do a sample test. Many schools and test-prep centers offer free tests (but find a reputable one that uses real CB tests and not artificially difficult ones to scare you into signing up for expensive tutoring.) There are sample tests available on line and in test-prep books. You can arrange a test-like-setting in your own home, or any other place where your kid can sit at a desk for a few hours of uninterrupted quiet work-time.</p>
<p>I also agree with CT that it is worth prepping for the Jr year PSAT if the student is in range for NMF. Indeed, not only should such a student study (if they’re willing), but they should target their studying specifically for the PSAT (separately from the SAT) because the two tests are different). However, that only works if the student is willing to study, since nagging an recalcitrant teenager can backfire spectacularly.</p>
<p>I also agree that we have a lot of bright kids on this list who seem highly invested in maximizing their education both inside and outside the classroom. I look forward to a whole bunch of really good news when junior year PSAT scores come out, and even more good news in the winter and spring of senior year when our kids all gain acceptances to their best-fit colleges. :)</p>
<p>Mihcal, that’s my worry. Revolution test prep offers free testing all over my area and our school guidance department recently sent a mailer to inform all sophomores and juniors that the free tests will be offered on campus. I did a little reading and it seems that there’s a lot of suspicion that the tests offered from this company are more difficult than the real thing. It doesn’t help that they offer a guarantee of a certain point boost on the real thing because the incentive would seem to be to deflate the score on the practice test.</p>
<p>Now some kids, like my eldest, would do well with such a set up. It would galvanize that kid to “beat” the test. Middle and youngest generally assume they are the ones not up to the difficulty of the test and beat themselves up rather than the test. </p>
<p>This year was wonderful for youngest D. She took one practice PSAT at home before the sophomore test and felt no stress because we emphasized for her that it didn’t count for anything. She scored at the semifinalist level of NMF in our state and in all but the 2 or 3 most competitive states but thinks this must be a pretty typical score notwithstanding the percentiles and clear evidence to the contrary. The last thing I want is to have her preparing needlessly and crazily because she thinks she must clear some extraordinary and artificially high bar.</p>
<p>The only reason I’d still want some sort of formal prep is the writing section. My understanding and experience is that this is the most coachable section of the SAT and that it’s very typical for scores to shoot way up after the kids learn the tricks and rules. I also think it would be quite helpful for D to get some guidance on putting together a good essay under the time constraints of the test. She’s a very strong writer who too often needs a lot of time to craft even a single paragraph.</p>
<p>Re. post 2125:</p>
<p>CT, </p>
<p>Yes, I am going to have my son watch the Khan Academy videos. We’ve been borrowing Video Aided Instruction SAT math videos and he’s watched a good number of these. (I’m not actually sure how much it helps if he’s not working the problems) I will begin to work through problems with him more and will get my older S involved.</p>
<p>Because we’re in Ca. which has one of the highest cutoffs for NM (in my older son’s year it was 221; last year, it was 219), I don’t have my hopes too high because of the math. But, given that I think my son could do very well in CR and W, and given that he’ll have extra time on the math section, who knows?</p>
<p>The PSAT and NM were the ticket to my oldest being able to afford his college, so I recognize the importance of it. But, I also know with this son, community college would be a very acceptable alternative to four year college if we don’t have the means or he doesn’t have the ability.</p>
<p>3girls,</p>
<p>My son begins work this week again with his writing tutor (we homeschool and I am bartering lessons for help on college apps) on crafting the essay. His verbal skills are great; his grasp of punctuation and spelling are not. :-(</p>
<p>About writing part of SAT - D. took the SAT in 8th grade with CTY. She got 710 in the writing part. As a sophomore, she took the PSAT, got 68 in writing. According to what I’ve heard, that translates to 680 in SAT. She is two grades higher and 30 points lower in writing. I don’t know how to interpret that? She has always been a crazy reader, and her English grade in school has always been As.</p>
<p>I agree with what mihcal1 says, except that I have a slightly different view on the applicability of SAT studying to the PSAT. It is true that the two tests are different but only in a couple very specific ways. First, the PSAT has no essay, so any work on preparing for the SAT essay is completely irrelevant to the PSAT. Second, the SAT math is at a slightly higher level than the PSAT but I’m not sure where that line is. Neither has trigonometry or above. I would guess that the main difference may be in the more advanced topics of algebra like series and logarithms but I’m speculating here.
However, all of the multiple choice questions in the Reading and Writing sections are the same form between the PSAT and SAT. This means that, although the vocabulary of the SAT may be at a slightly more advanced level than the SAT, the strategies one would use to arrive at the correct answer are the same. In my opinion, for my S, learning to use these strategies will be of far more benefit than studying a list of vocabulary words appropriate to one test or the other. Plus I have no idea whether a particular word would be a junior/senior level versus a sophomore level.<br>
For my kids, most suggested math strategies weren’t really helpful. For kids who have already had math at or above the level of the test, I think the best strategy is just solving the problem in the fastest way they can. This does mean that practice is still very important. I will say that I think that the best math prep my kids had other than the actual classes was MathCounts in middle school but that probably isn’t helpful here unless people have younger kids.
Also, I have not been able to find old PSAT tests, whereas several old SAT tests are readily available. If anyone knows how to get old PSAT tests please post.
For these reasons, I do think that learning and practicing strategies on old SAT tests will be beneficial for the PSAT.
One caveat though, the differences between the two tests do indicate one should be careful in using PSAT scores as predictions for SAT.</p>
<p>herandhisMom – The SAT writing score includes the essay. Did your D have a high essay score on the 8th grade SAT? If that is the case, the subscore on the multiple choice questions of the 8th grade SAT Writing score could have been the same or worse than the PSAT score but still have resulted in a higher total Writing score. You should be able to look at the SAT results to find the multiple choice (mc) subscore on the Writing section.</p>
<p>Also, within the bounds of how the same student would be predicted to score on any particular day, there may be no significant difference between 68 and a 71 (or between 680 and 710) Although I understand that one would definitely like to see a significant difference occur over a year and a half.</p>
<p>This has been a very interesting discussion and I really appreciate all of the advice offered here. I’m still torn on whether D should take the SAT in October. Her PSAT score this year would have qualified her for NMSF, so I do want to see her concentrate on studying for that. Her lowest score was in Math, and I think part of that is attributable to her having forgotten some formulas - she did not study. So I’m hoping that a tune-up over the summer, concentrating in math, with help with that.</p>
<p>She also took the PLAN test (pre-ACT) and we should get her scores back this week. This may help us figure out whether to concentrate on the SAT or ACT, but I imagine she’ll take both at least once. It’s hard to get her motivated to study for any standardized test.</p>
<p>On a completely different note, a friend of mine sent me this article and I thought I’d share it. It scares me a little, but it’s really very interesting stuff. [Why</a> You Never Truly Leave High School – New York Magazine](<a href=“http://nymag.com/news/features/high-school-2013-1/]Why”>Why You Never Truly Leave High School -- New York Magazine - Nymag)</p>
<p>@STEMFamily, Thank you for explaining that to me. I think she got 11 in essay. (not bad for a 12 year old at that time.) so maybe the essay score made her writing overall high. She still has room to improve her writing score for sure, for next year. and I agree with you on this -
</p>
<p>herandhisMom – seconding what STEM said regarding the writing scores. Note that the PSAT “writing” section contains no actual writing, but instead tests grammar, vocabulary, and word usage rules.</p>
<p>I do the back-office filing at our HS, so I see a lot of test score reports. It’s not the least bit unusual for a kid’s scores to vary by 100+ points on a single section, even for tests taken 1mo apart. Writing sub-section scores seem more variable than math or CR scores. Considering [how</a> they’re scored](herandhisMom – seconding what STEM said regarding the writing score. Note that the PSAT “writing” section contains no actual writing, but instead tests grammar, vocabulary, and word usage rules.</p>
<p>I do the back-office filing at our HS, so I see a lot of test score reports. It’s not the least bit unusual for a kid’s scores to vary by 100+ points on a single section, even for tests taken 1mo apart. Writing sub-section scores seem more variable than math or CR scores. Considering [url=herandhisMom – seconding what STEM said regarding the writing score. Note that the PSAT “writing” section contains no actual writing, but instead tests grammar, vocabulary, and word usage rules.</p>
<p>I do the back-office filing at our HS, so I see a lot of test score reports. It’s not the least bit unusual for a kid’s scores to vary by 100+ points on a single section, even for tests taken 1mo apart. Writing sub-section scores seem more variable than math or CR scores. Considering [url=<a href=“http://professionals.collegeboard.com/testing/sat-reasoning/scores/essay]how”>Understanding SAT Scores – SAT Suite | College Board) it’s not surprising that there would be a lot of variability on the essay scores.</p>
<p>herandhisMom – That is an incredible essay score for a 12-year old!</p>
<p>3girls – Your plan on getting coaching on the essay is what we did for my D13. She also scored within NMSF range on the PSAT as a sophomore. I think she is a decent writer but scored 7 on the first ACT essay she took December of junior year. So we hired a tutor before she took the SAT. I thought the coaching was helpful and she did do much better on the SAT essay. For kids who aren’t naturally expressive, getting a good score on these essays is all about following a formula and having preconceived general ideas and even specific vocabulary words so they can get things down on paper FAST. </p>
<p>Also the type of essay question is one of the significant differences between the ACT and SAT. ACT questions are more about experiences of typical high school life while the SAT questions are quite a bit more abstract and intellectual.</p>
<p><a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/college-search-selection/1450220-suggestions-organizing-college-search-notebook.html[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/college-search-selection/1450220-suggestions-organizing-college-search-notebook.html</a></p>
<p>Havent posted here since early November 2012, but have been keeping up with this thread among others. Congrats are owed to so many kids/parents for everything from awards in music and academics to great 10th-grade PSAT scores! I hope to post more often in 2013, once life calms down a bit. And I’ve continued to get Great advice here, so thank you.</p>
<p>And, on that note, heres a good thread on organizing a college search notebook/materials useful for students and parents alike. I didnt start the thread, but I did ask The Experts on the Parents of HS Class 2013 thread if they would be kind enough to post suggestions there. Sure enough, they came through. Thanks to their advice, and the input of others, this is a very useful thread. </p>
<p>For those parents who are already experienced in the college search process via older kids, please consider adding to the thread.</p>
<p>For those of us who are Newbies, check it out!</p>
<p>Thanks!</p>
<p>Suzy, thanks for that link–very interesting and yes, a little scary. </p>
<p>Goaskdad, I bookmarked that link for next year. Thanks very much for sharing that. Even though I’ve been through this before I think I’m one of those “Don’t Let This Happen to You” models. The only thing I did right was to step out of the way when asked to do so. Maybe I can share some of my missteps on that thread. </p>
<p>STEMfamily, I have to laugh about the SAT/ACT essays. Yes, they are very different and what may seem like an easier prompt for the ACT may end up being more difficult for some kids. D '07 took the SAT I and did perfectly on everything but math. At my insistence, she took the ACT and she did beautifully on the math and everything else…except the essay. I don’t remember the score–no doubt I’ve blocked it out–but it was pitiful.</p>
<p>I feel that I abandoned the thread for the day—a thread where I don’t even belong but I keep butting in! I agree with all of the posts I missed, and echo what STEM said about just going ahead and studying for SAT b/c you really can’t locate old PSAT exams. I mean, they must be out there b/c the CB sends a blank practice test upon registration and then returns the student’s own marked-up copy with the scores, but they are not floating around the web the way the Jan, May & Oct SAT exams are.</p>
<p>Also agree with STEM about the importance of practice. I don’t think that my son learned many new concepts when prepping for the SAT and rote memorization of vocab was not something he wanted to do, but repeated exposure to the actual test questions under timed conditions really helped. </p>
<p>I also agree with the essay discussions. There will always be some students who can just pull out the essay prompt supports, but there are far more who would benefit from outlining responses to several old SAT essay prompts. (Those are widely available over on the SAT prep section of CC.) </p>
<p>Suzy–take a look at Gruber’s book to see if it is of any use for your D. My son said he liked how it was organized. Since I have never looked inside the CB BB or Gruber’s, I cannot comment. And, yes, that NY Mag cover article was fascinating. NY Mag is good bedtime reading as it doesn’t weigh much and the articles are not too terribly long.</p>