for my DS standardized testing is like another class test. He doesn’t dread them or like them and he scores are always within a point or two from what he gets @ home. On the other hand, my niece was dreaded standardized testing even though she is a very studious and focused kid and always ended up getting lower scores than practice tests. Yes, different strokes!
@CT1417 There is a lot of misinformation regarding the FERPA waiver on CC. Taking the “I Waive” option does not preclude viewing the recommendation, only precludes you from viewing it on application website or at the college. You can always ask the teacher to show it to you. Some may, some won’t.
The whole GPA vs SAT scores.
So many different angles to this one. My two boys’ SAT scores were only 60 points apart but the younger son is so much more of a student than the older one, and his GPA and course rigor reflect that. His entire make-up is different. Looking at this minuscule sample size of two, no one should ever look at SAT scores. However…the # of different GPA scales in this country is dizzying. I realize that state schools probably do have a decent handle on the reputations of all high schools within their own states, but beyond that, it has to be very difficult for the Ad Coms to tease out the subtle differences among schools.
There really should be one format for the school profiles. Some are fantastic and include almost every piece of info you would want on two pages, and some are garbage, fluff pieces designed to reveal nothing.
Small example: our HS weights honors and AP courses with a +.5 bump, but generally not until sophomore year. (One or two exceptions for 9th grade honors courses.) Top grade is an A, so the highest one can earn in a given class if 4.5. The Val’s GPA is usually around 4.35, but that is creeping up annually as those seeking the Val position petition to take AP Econ as sophomores and avoid taking any class that does not have an honors option. (The three year independent science research class is not honors, so if you want to be Val, you cannot take that course.)
Compare this to a very comparable nearby school. They bump +.67 and offer an A+ of 4.3, so the highest possible grade is a 5.0 vs a 4.5 at our HS. It would be very easy for an AdCom to group all of these similar CT towns under the same heading, but the school that offers the A+ and the +.67 bump will have students with GPAs above 4.35, and those students may not even be top ten in the class.
In conclusion, I think standardized tests have to exist to at least offer perspective. A good school profile will include avg SAT scores and AP score distribution, but that requires that the Ad Com drill down on every profile that passes his desk. The student from an underperforming HS who earns a 2000 on his SAT is much more significant than a student from our HS earning that same 2000. Actually, I think 2000 is just about our HS average.
As far as the change in majors go, I like to think about what Eisenhower said: “Plans are useless, but planning is indispensable”.
I’ve seen several “second hand” sources say the majority of students change their major at least once, although I think they are including the entering undecideds.
My D '17 has been quite narrowly focused on her choice, occupational therapy, but I’m trying to steer toward schools with wide offerings. You just never know.
@itsgettingreal17 – thanks for the info. I haven’t looked at CA yet this year. Soon…I keep telling myself!
Interesting talk about standardized test vs grades and prestige vs publics. I had the financial discussion with her and that was a big factor, we also talked about prestige vs the best preparation for grad school admission. @greeny8 I also had the “unhooked” discussion with her, I got a lot of push back on that one since she firmly believed applicants were admitted based solely on merit. She had to hear it from her peers to believe it since she did not want to take the word of this cynical old man. At that point she made the decision to stay in-state for UG.
It is what we have learned since:
Her school is a feeder school for the big in-state publics. It creates an almost unfair advantage because they are so aligned with what those schools are looking for. For example @Mom2aphysicsgeek I did the SSAR for my D yesterday, it took an hour, just cut and paste from the school’s online system. And of course her HS curriculum aligns perfectly with what the SSAR expects.
The school produces the type of graduates the universities want to see:
- Lot’s of AP credits, this increases 4 yr graduation rates and reduces the load in Gen Ed credits which help the facility to student ratio.
- In-state schools do not use SAT IIs so HS is focused on SAT and AP only, helps their stats
- Lot’s of EC opportunities, no reason not be involved in something
- Well supported performing arts and athletics makes it easy for students to find something to be “committed to” for 4 years
So, when a school is a feeder school the process becomes much easier to understand. The universities can rely more on grades and course rigor when they are getting a hundred apps from a HS. Essays and EC are still important to the more selective schools, but there is no need to submit AP scores, SAT IIs or LORs.
@mcdmom, sorry about the SAT score. I know that is very frustrating. I just realized that when S gets his SAT score in July, he will have one each from the old SAT, the new SAT, and the ACT. I am hoping this SAT score meets his (and my) expectation, but I doubt he’d sit for a redo of either the ACT or SAT, and his ACT score is good enough for his choices.
@mdcmom - did your son prep much for the SAT? My daughter did the four practice tests available through the official CB book and did some targeted math drills on Khan academy. She was able to bring her math score up by 40-50 points (from her soph and junior PSAT) and her CR/W was about the same. Her practice tests all fell within a 100 point range and her actual results were within that range.
If your son did much better on practice tests than on the real thing, then he might want to try again. Maybe he just had a bad day. Or he might want to check out the ACT as an alternative.
Sorry, he didn’t get the result that he had hoped. It’s tough when there’s the added stress of qualifying for merit. The good news is that he got a very respectable score and that might provide some confidence for a second attempt.
I am seeing a lot of schools becoming feeder schools for in state public schools. Reasons vary but a big driver is cost. Many of these kids will not get need based aid and thus in-state public becomes a popular option.
My kids hate standardized testing. They only take them until they get the minimum target score they have set for themselves. No desire for perfect.
They are also all pretty focused. Older kids did not/have not changed majors. I don’t see Dd17 foregoing her love of Russian and French any time soon, either. It could be more of a product of how they are educated, though. They are in control of their educations and course selections far more than most high school students.
I’m not too worried about D changing her major. She will end up at a big school that has lots of options if she does change her mind, but she is not one to normally change her mind once she’d decided on something. We are quite alike in that respect. I knew what I wanted to do in the 3rd grade, made a plan to achieve that goal, and executed it. I see her doing the same thing, which is why we have been exploring possible careers for her during high school.
We have an abundance of great QsOTD!
QOTD1: Why XYZ? I agree with what a number of others have said. It’s about you, not about the college. The college already knows why they are great. They want to know why the college is great for you so they can learn more about you and why you would be great for them.
There was some good information on a recent, now-closed thread about this type of essay, but you have to wade though the type of name calling etc that is sometimes common in other CC threads (not us, because we are awesome). Longtime posters like lookingforward had some useful things to say. http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/parents-forum/1895909-how-long-does-it-take-to-write-a-college-application-one-hour-per-college-p1.html A number of people said not to cite a specific professor, as that person may be retiring or going on sabbatical.
I agree with @mamaedefamilia that short essays (250 words) are often much harder to write well than long essays! When you shorten them to fit, they just seem choppy and bland.
QOTD2: LoRs In addition to the GC letter, DS has asked his AP Physics B (from 9th*) and AP English Lang (from 11th) teachers for LoRs. He will also submit a letter from his research professor to any school that takes an extra. All but the English teacher (new recommender) wrote successful recommendations for summer programs.
In looking at my new Spreadsheet to Rule Them All (SRTA), I’d been thinking that most colleges want 1 STEM, 1 Humanities, and one optional “other” recommendation. But, there is actually a lot of variation and a number just say 2 teachers or 1 teacher of any type.
A backup recommender for schools that take more or if he wants 2 STEM recommenders for some colleges is his Math Circle teacher, who he has known since 4th grade. She writes lots of LoRs for homeschoolers and wrote him one for his summer programs.
I’ve heard it is possible to get a LoR from his summer program, but that seems like a lot of LoRs. @Mom2aphysicsgeek did your older son get a LoR from SSP?
@CT1417 I’ve heard that the Common App has made assigning teachers to different schools better, but I don’t know how much better.
- I know it's weird to have a 9th grade teacher as a LoR writer, but he's been in her classroom every year. In 9th he took her class. In 10th, he was in a group in her classroom twice a week studying AP Physics C concepts from the Open Courseware lectures (she's never taught Physics C, so she studied/reviewed with them). In 11th and next year, he is a student teacher in her classroom twice a week (study hall period for entire school) reteaching concepts to small groups of kids who aren't doing as well as they'd like in her AP Physics 1 & 2 classes. The student teacher thing is somewhat prestigious at his school, and they have a luncheon at the end of each semester to thank those students.
@mdcmom Fwiw, my son had some friends that took the new SAT when it 1st came out, and they scored in the 1200’s theirs 1st attempt. I guess they took it again and got 1400 the 2nd time. My son, scored a 1310 the 1st time, and said he felt better about the test the 2nd time too, but we are waiting on scores. For his school choices, his ACT score should suffice. He just took them again. If he doesn’t get his composite up 2 points, he said he might take it again in the fall. He doesn’t seem to mind taking the tests, he just doesn’t love prepping for them. Good luck to your son.
Other topics:
New SAT and Adcoms: I don’t know what colleges will do, but I’m pretty sure they will be less informed than parents here about the intricacies and intrigue in the differences between old and new SAT scores. I don’t think many will be aware of anecdotal evidence for the conversions being off. 
So, I’m guessing that lots will use the calculator in one direction or the other to convert between SATs or to make a table of what level of new scores are good for them.
Limit ECs or Send All Scores: Limiting the EC list would be tough on DS. He’s figured out how to fit most of his ECs into the 10 items allowed on the Common App. Reducing that to 5 for one of his other applications will be tough. He could go for the “send all scores” model though; he has 7 colleges that require that on his list anyway (5 UCs + 2 others).
@Midwest67 Thanks. DS keeps saying Physics, but I’m aware that he could want to switch to CS at some point. Colleges where that switch is difficult (the UCs) could be a problem.
@mcdmom Sorry about the SAT score. Has he tried a practice ACT test? My son took two SATs and then tried a practice ACT test, and it was obvious that the ACT was the test for him. You have to do timed practice tests for the ACT, though, as the timing is tighter. (And, the first fall ACT test is earlier than the first fall SAT test.)
@Ynotgo – question for you and this one has been nagging at the back of my mind…
“I know the UC system does computerized pre-filtering of the 200,000+ applications they receive, but that is filtered on GPA and completion of enough courses in each subject area. There’s no pre-filter on test scores at the UCs as far as I’ve seen.”
Do you know if OOS students are held to the same requirements? That performing arts one is a real problem as CT does not require performing arts for graduation. There is some really loose requirement but CS satisfied it.
Son returned home from last day of school to say he has been bounced from two of the courses he pre-registered for months ago: AP Lit and AP Stats. They have moved him over to AP Lang (that he did not want to take) and he has picked up AP Econ instead of Stats, but is not excited about that as he would prefer to take Econ at the college level, not the watered down HS course. His independent science research class also did not fit but apparently he is trying for an exception where he will be able to skip one of the class meetings each week. He cannot drop that course at it is his passion, and this is his final year of the three year course.
Physics C E&M only meets once, Multivariable Calc only meets once, and Latin only meets once…resulting in many conflicts. Not the end of the world…
@Ynotgo I don’t think colleges need anecdotal evidence of score and conversion issues. I believe it will be evident to them after they’ve received large batches of new SAT scores, which in my opinion, will be low in comparison to old M + CR scores of recent years.
@CT1417 Yes, out of state students need the year of visual or performing arts for the UCs. I believe it can be done at a community college, but cannot be done online. (Edited to add: VPA is also not a graduation requirement for the state of CA. There is a state requirement for a year of either VPA, foreign language, or career technical education.)
Sorry about all the changes for his senior schedule. I hate it when stuff like that happens! I hope things get worked out to his satisfaction. Maybe he’d prefer to take Stats in college, as the AP version is also supposed to be pretty watered down.
Everytime I think I am caught up in reading, there is a new page number popping up. Guys, slow down …
Just wanted to check in as there is no way to catch up on all the QOTDs. I will probably have do a search for a few topics at the end of summer and have my child read the results 
Yesterday DC got SAT I results back and is very happy. Not perfect, not quite as improved as hoped for but presentable. That’s it for the SAT I but there will be one more SAT II in the fall. Kid walked out after first SAT II last week because of doubts about ScoreChoice. Some of the other students insisted that ALL results have to be sent. Oh well, and I had hoped we would be completely done with testing.
Congrats on shorter casts, internships, travel plans for college visits. We’ll do a shorter family trip in July and then a few college visits in August, amidst summer camps out-of-town.
Hopefully, I’ll have more time to read and catch up over the weekend :-h :-h :-h