TwinMom2023, you mention " I agree that state flagships need to balance in-state and geographic diversity." Seems to me that the %OOS is about higher tuition not diversity at the college level. Why would they need geographic diversity? I understand the desirability of it in general and its certainly a desirable characteristic of private schools-and it signals the school is a “national” school. But seems like the mission of public state schools should be primarily to provide an education to state residents.
On the other hand, it speaks to the quality of the flagships that OOS students are clamoring to attend. Mediocre systems don’t attract many OOS. Despite being a bargain, accepting OOS students with lower scores and grades than those they accept instate, and more than a willingness to increase its % OOS, SUNY does not attract many OOS students.
I’m sorry, @momzilla2D - I hope she can get things straightened out with UMD.
I am losing hope that S19 will get in to MD despite Naviance indicating he has a good shot. - I’m not really seeing many accepted GPAs below 4.0. I guess we’ll know in two weeks.
I remember naively thinking when my kids were little how great it was to have UVA and W&M as instate college options. As it turned out, my kids were eliminated from those schools once they had a couple of Bs on the transcript! Neither one applied. S19’s instate apps are GMU and JMU. (He’s about to make the 18 minute trek to GMU for his audition. He does not want to go to school 18 minutes from home and I don’t really blame him.)
I’m sorry @DCNatFan – the competition to get into the area state flagships is simply crazed.
Oh no @momzilla2D ! I hope your D gets good news on Monday. (Sounds to me, based on a quick scan of the UMD thread, that phones will be ringing off the hook @ UMD on Monday.)
Sorry about the UVA news, @Turquoise52 – and even if it’s viewed as a “lottery” it still stings.
@orangefish Thank you! He auditions at JMU in two weeks and I think he would be happy to end up there (and I would be happy with the price tag). There are one or two places he would rather go, but at least he isn’t turning his nose up at it.
Ouch on the denials @DCNatFan and @Turquoise52 . I finished high school in NOVA and could not get into UVA or W&M at that time (similar GPA to this thread, but good SAT). So these schools have been going that direction for a while. Funny though, at that time (80’s), UMD did not have a good reputation on our side of the river and no one I know applied. Things have certainly changed on that front.
@lostaccount I believe there is pressure coming from private schools who market their geographic diversity to students.The data point ‘X states represented’ is common to see. There appears to be a trend of schools breaking out of the regional category and (like you said) competing for students nationally.
With UNC CH capped at 18% oos and having such a great reputation, it is a tough oos ticket. With the cap though, I don’t know that the oos kids are related to the budget. They will fill every slot of oos tuition consistently. The stats of the oos students are pretty staggering and I wonder if that is the driving force.
I think it is the nature of the beast. A state flagship’s star is on the rise and becomes harder to get into, which is wonderful. At the same time, it is sad for in-state kids who don’t make the cut when they grew up loving that school and going to games, etc. It is a conundrum as the SATs/GPAs explode. Schools want high rankings and should strive to grow, but if the mission is to educate in-state students how do you find the balance? At least in NC, we have many excellent state schools. NC State has certainly grown its reputation in the past 20 years and (anecdotally) is starting to fill that role of the go-to school for avg. to above avg. kids.
Although one could certainly argue that low acceptance rates are trending across the nation - more students applying, population growth, new colleges not being built?? Some of the acceptance rates are crazy–especially when compare to 20 years ago. Media outlets that predict the downfall of colleges don’t have a senior in high school this year.
UMD, JMU, Elon are stretches for kids in our school that have stats appropriate for this thread. In fact, our GA called Elon “a 3.8 school”. It doesn’t take the sting out of the rejection, but rather puts it into perspective a bit I hope.
Here is GA UGA and GT are also not available to the “a few Bs” students anymore. GT does take many more in state than out of state, but for EA, I heard it was still Brutal In state. I will never know if my S19 had a shot because we had to pull his app due to getting in ED in a match school OOS. AT this point at best he would would have been deferred. I know many great kids who also in state get rejected by UGA. One got into NYU! The kicker in all this, is if you want engineering. The only other real option is KSU, which years ago took over Southern Poly. Because of how hard our state flagships are to get into, KSU is actually rising in the ranks. The other option for those in GA is neighboring schools. UA is very popular as well as USC.
I believe acceptance rates will continue to drop as students continue to apply to more schools. It’s not unheard of taht students apply to dozens or more schools. There will always be the “it” schools that everyone applies to driving acceptances lower and lower. The same students are being selected at multiple schools, shutting others out who truly want to attend. People often say" I need to have options in case I get denied or deferred" when in reality, they are increasing the likelihood by applying to a lot of schools. At some point, it becomes a trophy grab, and not about finding the right fit. In the 2016 group , one student applied to 21 schools, many very selective schools, and was accepted at all of them. That’s if they were being truthful which to me is very doubtful. JMO.
@carolinamom2boys excellent point. Twenty years ago we applied to one or two schools. Although it was sad to withdrawal applications after the twins received their ED decisions, it is definitely the right thing to do.
@carolinamom2boys ITA! And it’s not just the “it”schools where this is happening, but also at schools (JMU, Elon, etc) that used to be a pretty safe match for kids with stats on this thread.
My S19 got his acceptance to Concordia in Montreal this week…what I think is his top choice. He probably won’t hear from McGill until late in February, but I think he believes (and I agree) that Concordia is a better fit for him and what he wants to do. I’m thrilled as my S17 is a second year at McGill…so my logistics are going to be pretty easy. He is my youngest so I’m done with the college admissions game…so very, very glad to be done!
@carolinamom2boys I totally agree with you. It is also why I do not understand all of the negativity around schools increasing their acceptances through early decision (not on this thread but others). It’s the students who are driving the schools to do this. The schools can’t handle over enrollment like some have seen because they are so unsure of who will actually attend. They also cannot risk under enrollment.
I understand the negative sides of ED but it gives the students who are truly committed to attending their best chance while colleges can better plan. The biggest argument I have seen is related to students needing financial aid or the ability to compare offers. With online calculators being pretty accurate I think it really just comes down to merit.
@carolinamom2boys I think, sadly, that there is something of a catch-22 there. If you have bright, but not standout, kids - and schools that SHOULD be matches are now a gamble, then it becomes important to apply to more schools than you might have done if things were more certain, in order to give yourself a safety net with more options. That in itself seems to compound the problem. i know I made my boys apply to more than any of us wanted to - because schools they expected to be able to get into are not predictable any more.
@Britmom5
That is our position as well. We are relying on merit and that is not easy to predict hence why my D applied to 10 schools (had some thoughts about an 11th). Also it was good we did that because some schools have little to no merit and her two referrals were very random (both around 5-6th most selective of the 10, she has been admitted to six and waiting on other 2).
Admissions is such a complex process with aid/yield protection/rankings. I wonder would it be less stressful if there were just three release dates - ED - EA - RD across the nation. Do the random release dates add to the enrollment angst because rather than have all of your cards by mid February, kids have to wait for all of their acceptances and some won’t come until later in March? That doesn’t give much time for admitted students to visit and commit by May 1. Just a thought. Also, I think it was UVM that had clear metrics for merit aid using GPA/SAT scores.
