Thanks for this info, it’s very helpful. This is a friend of S21’s, I referred them to a counselor who does law school admissions. I am more familiar with MBA admissions and didn’t realize law schools also like to see post-college work experience…is any type of professional type job helpful? Or something like Peace Corps? Paralegal? Thanks again for your insights!
I think any type of professional job. It’s not a requirement, of course, just something law schools and future employers may appreciate. Goes to maturity and perspective re: client operations and needs. The extent to which post-college work experience is considered would vary by law school, with some favoring more heavily than others. Back in the day, half my law school class had post college work experience and it’s likely a greater proportion now. A law school admissions consultant would be aware of this factor.
My guess is that it’s the sort of factor that might help applicants on the edge for stats (possibly like the student you know with 3.6 and likely high LSAT), but not in and of itself overcoming stats that are clearly in a denial range.
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I’m sure the law school counselor will be valuable. I don’t think this student thinks they are going to Yale, but I’m sure there will be some decent options if that’s the path they choose. (Of course they need to deliver on the lsat!)
One of the most successful lawyers I know, likely with a net worth in the $30M range, went to John Marshall law school, back in the day (it’s UIC’s law school now since 2019 or so.)
Ok everyone, I got my wish 
. You never know how any given person’s practice tests will compare to the experience of doing the real thing. D isn’t a bad test-taker, nor is it her strongest suit.
So, she got a really solid score, especially for the first time, but not yet her desired score. She’s optimistic because it’s higher than the plateau she hit for a long time though two points lower than her very highest practice scores of the last week of prep. Her legal scholar’s advisor was excited and thought it gives her a decent shot for some of her most-hoped for schools along with her gpa and soft factors, though I think any merit money at those schools may be unrealistic at that score unless she gets merit based on gpa. (One video we watched from a law dean from a T-14 said that their school bases merit and admissions often on one or the other as long as there is other evidence in the application that the student is capable). There are lots of good schools for which merit should be possible or likely but she’s gunning for some that will be competitive, mostly in the lower part of the T14 so a bump in the lsat would help. Not interested in Yale, Columbia, Stanford, U Chicago…too urban, likely too cutthroat for her taste or needs and I highly doubt she’d gain admission. She’d be personally happy with a lot of non-elite schools except that there’s so much talk out there that legal jobs are getting more and more competitive and will become moreso when AI starts doing a lot of the legal research grunt work. If you know where you want to settle and know what kind of law you want to practice it’s probably just fine to go to the regional state schools in that area…may even be advantageous, with networking. But my D does not know where she’ll go, nor what kind of law and so she feels she needs a nationally-known school to feel secure that she can find work anywhere.
I hoped she’d take a short break and prep/ re-test in the spring or summer and apply after graduating. But, nope, she feels energized by this decent but not quite “there” score and will prep throughout the busy summer, take it again in early September and apply asap in the fall. She had some technical computer issues getting into the test on test day, started testing 20 minutes later than scheduled and got a frazzled start that affected her focus for awhile. She’s hoping that that difference alone might result in a point or two higher if she gets a smoother start.
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Hi, @Mwfan1921,
My D (and I, I confess) have watched a bunch of YouTube videos of “Dean Z”, the Dean of admissions of U Michigan. She’s incredibly informative, accessible and fun to watch, as well. It seems she has quite a reputation for her videos, and there are many. Even if this student doesn’t apply to Michigan, I think her advice would be great for a lot of schools although she acknowledges that every law school has its own nuances about the process and how it evaluates applicants. She has quite a few videos in which she goes though real past application with a fine-toothed comb (keeping it totally anonymous, vague about identifying characteristics) and shows, point by granular point, what she finds positive, concerning or neutral about every ( and I mean every) part of the application and what could be possibly be strengthened by more precise information. I think the student you know would find these helpful even if Michigan isn’t on the radar.
You mentioned Peace Corps…I noticed in one of her analyses she said law school admissions have a check-list for various soft factors that may be viewed mildly or strongly favorable. I was happy to see that Peace Corps is ranked in this system as one of the stronger soft factors. As a former volunteer myself, I’d say though, it’s not something a person should do to help with admissions! It takes more than two years and can be life-changing, fantastic experience but ONLY for those people who really, really want to do it for intrinsic reasons.
One thing you’ll be happy to hear. Dean Z is impressed by college athletes, especially varsity, because of the dedication involved. I’m not sure if she’s too good to be true (and over-encourages would-be applicants to increase yield) but if she really likes an applicant overall, she seems quite forgiving of some flaws (I.e. lower grades in the first year or two) if there is a reason for them and there is evidence that the student is capable and would be an asset to the school community. She comes across as much more holistic than law school admissions is said to be. She does analyze some past applicants with some notable flaws (low gpa, low lsat etc, that she was happy to admit because of strong evidence of character traits and abilities, so maybe your student in question might have a chance? Don’t know how often that happens but Dean Z seems to try to find reasons to like any given applicant. She is also the one who said she is looking for either a high GPA or high score to maintain or raise the school’s rankings for any given applicant but she does not require both. Also, she sometimes admits some applicants who show strong abilities in other ways and may not have especially high scores in either as long as she thinks they can do the work. Hoping that is not false encouragement because my kid (or, should I say, young adult) is now VERY intrigued with Michigan (GO BLUE!)
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Thank you so much for this info! I will check out Dean Z’s videos which sound quite helpful and will also send them to this student.
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Yes, my Capital One 360 is a MasterCard tapcard.
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There is also a DeanZ Elvis impersonator on YouTube but I’m sure you won’t confuse them 
. I had to do a double-take because the dean is lively enough in some of her videos that it seems that it might not be so terribly far-fetched.
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@burghdad, that LawSchoolTransparency website has the most information I have ever seen for law schools all in one place, and a way to compare up to four schools’ data side-by-side. I had seen some other sites, but not yet this one. I thought it was especially interesting that you can see where recent graduates from any given school have moved for employment, and the breakdown of percentages of what kind of employment (public service, federal clerkships, big law firm, regional law firm, etc). So much data! Thank you!
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Wishing all of our 2021 kids a solid and joyful start to their senior year. 
It’s easy to recall moving S21 into his dorm (with staggered times bc of Covid precautions…and while wearing masks). 
And now, I’m thankful for the (mostly) smooth and very full three years S has experienced in DC.
I hope senior year is meaningful but also brings more clarity to S’s post grad plans.
(S21 completed a fed govt summer internship just last week, and they would welcome him back after graduation….but…he thinks grad school, or traveling a bit is his preferred next path.) 
I’m trying to be chill with his ambiguity. 
Thankfully, he uses the many resources available to him. (Academic counselor, personal life coach, thesis mentor, peers, and former coworkers.) I’d just prefer him to make a decision more quickly than I know he will. I want to know now. Not later.
My very best wishes to each of you and your kiddos. 
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I did not realize that this thread is active and visit CC once in a while to keep up. DD21 is a senior at UNC and thriving. She decided that health sciences was not for her and is now majoring in Economics with a Data Science minor. Wrapped up her internship in NYC and is actively looking to break into finance/banking. Boyfriend #3 has stuck around for a year now. Really nice kid too! So thankful for this community and it is so great to hear about these updates.
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Haven’t been on here in a while. I down sized to a sweet garden home. Single momma that will be an 100% empty nester. D has accepted a job 5 hours away when she graduates from
this past summer internship. Still an electrical engineering major. Have been buying little things here and there for a first apartment. (She has been in the on campus upper level dorm for 3 years now). Hope all our kiddos enjoy their senior year.
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Checking in!! My son is graduating Dec 14!! Still a Finance major with a minor/certificate in Data Analytics. Since he took classes these last two summers, he’s graduating a semester early. No job lined up yet 
, but he’s put in apps for his Masters so looks like that’s the route he’s going to go. He will be moving back home and probably be doing his MS in Business Analytics from UTD.
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It’s great to hear the updates! I hope all of our kiddos are finding their way.
Mine is in her final semester of BME and is planning on applying to med school while taking a gap year. I think the stress level is going to be at maximum!!!
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Daughter ready to graduate with BS in Analytics and Statistics. Applying for jobs and Ms in Business Analytics. Accepted to UW with a scholarship. Waiting on UT Austin but has an interview tomorrow which we took as a good sign. Her first choice is a job…. But her last choice is living at home with mom and dad with no job and no grad school
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D21 will be graduating in June with a minor from Cal Poly SLO.
The plan is taking a gap year, working and applying to grad schools, and then with any luck, grad school in the Fall of 2026. 
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S21 graduating from University of Maryland with his degree in finance in May and then his second degree in accounting in December. He will then sit for the CPA. He has a job lined up for after graduation too!
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I have been wondering when/if this thread would jumpstart again! My D is set to graduate in May with a double major and an honors thesis. She has been on pins and needles every day for months, worrying about the future and whether or not (or when) she should forgo her PLAN A (law school) for PLAN B (get a job, any job, but preferably a paralegal-ish or non-profit position and try again). Law school applications have been up 25% this year over last year (as much as 50% at some schools). She was about to lose hope for anything other than a waitlist when she got a call on Friday: an acceptance from Cornell Law School! She has two other applications pending but she is so thrilled and relieved it really doesn’t matter. Cornell is a very small program with some great legal clinics for hands-on work right away. She is open to many areas of law but right now interested in immigration law, labor law and health care. Cornell is especially strong in labor law and she’s excited about that. Right now I am grateful she will be able to focus on enjoying her last semester of college (which has been a wonderful experience for her).
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Love the updates!! Congratulations to your kids!
My D will graduate in May. She will sit for the MCAT in the spring with the plan to apply to med school after a gap year. She’s been accepted to a funded fellowship at a top children’s hospital and med school… so she has a plan that allows her to support herself (yay 
) while gaining additional research and clinical experience during the gap.
Keep the updates coming. I can’t believe how quickly these four years flew by.
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Congrats to your D! That is so awesome!
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