Welcome to the world of rational thinkers, Sanjay!
The “viola” path to an Ivy was what cracked me up.
JustoneMom wrote: ‘Can you tell me what it takes to get into each individual Ivy? Then I will be all ears.’
If ANYONE had the answer to that question, he’d make millions of dollars being an adviser to Ivy wannabees. There is no answer to how to get into an Ivy because all are so different. Some people have been accepted to all 8 Ivies, but they are usually URM with very high stats and some other hook. Does your son fit in that category?
If your son only wants an Ivy, be it Cornell or Penn or Dartmouth, good luck. They have many similarities, but are also different, There is no formula for a sure admit to one Ivy, never mind all 8. Perfect scores, gpa, letters of rec, winning the science prize, being a legacy are al good, but not a guarantee. Unless he’s a great hockey player that any Ivy would die to have with a high AI score, he’ll be taking a big risk applying “Ivy or Bust” but he can certainly make that decision. If ‘bust’ he can take a gap year or apply at a late admit to a school that still has room in May (and there are many good schools that do).
Many students set their sights on just one school, be it Notre Dame, USC, Cal, or one of the Ivies. They are told by GC and experienced people on CC not to do that. They do it anyway, and maybe for them, it is the right decision to put all their eggs in one basket. I think there are people who’d rather go to no school than to go to a lesser school, and it sounds like JustOneMom and family are in that group.
I don’t think the kid has weighed in. Heck, he may react the same way the OP’s kid on this thread did if he burns out in the next couple of years.
OP - Great progress! Glad to hear it. Now you are one your way 
I don’t know about “each individual Ivy,” but I do have a relative who graduated from a local cc then went to a state school before going on to med school in MA. If you follow that path, I guess it starts by enrolling in community college.
@SanjayinSanJose From your first post, I thought your son sounded like an intelligent young man who was taking a thoughtful approach to his college decisions. From the way you have responded and summarized your own takeaway from this sometimes contentious thread, I can see that the acorn doesn’t fall far from the tree. I’m looking forward to hearing more about your family’s experiences during the next few years. I have a feeling both you and your son will succeed not just in finding a great college for him but in providing him with a great education that will serve him well for the rest of his life. 
You can transfer to another spouse, albeit at some expense and trauma. There could also be the equivalent of a summer school, a semester abroad, an evening course, or even online, if you just want a diversity of experiences.
This thread is making me grateful that my parents didn’t helicopter me through undergrad/grad school admissions. Sometimes you just need to let your kid do what they want. If you helicopter them through, they will either end up incompetent in the real world and/or resent you. They are going to move out into the real world some day, and whether they come home for Christmas depends partly on how controlled they feel - just saying.
Note that Berkeley does not have an honors program of the kind normally discussed here (unless one counts the perks of the Regents’ scholarship as such), although there are honors courses offered in some subjects (particularly math and physics), and most or all majors have an honors program within the major available to those who do well in previously taken courses for the major.
Make sure that you have made your financial plan before he makes his application list, so that he can know whether each school that he may put on his application list is likely to be within budget without compromising your retirement or contribution to your younger daughter’s college.
On the first day of grad school, one professor said “Half of you will be in the bottom half of the class. There is no other way to do the math. Most of you are probably used to being at the top of the class, and you have to accept that.” It’s hard to believe that most of us hadn’t even thought of that.
OP’s son is so far ahead of most students. He’s considering everything.
My nephew started at the flagship U about 30 miles from home. He’s extremely happy there. I’ve been shocked how many of his friends went farther away to college and are already back, now also going to this flagship. They either didn’t like the schools, or didn’t like being far away, figured out that they were spending a lot for schools that were no better (or worse) than the flagship. One guy had been home 4 times during the fall semester, and his mother was just tired of it. Even those who went away to play a sport weren’t necessarily happy, and I know at least 2 who drop that school and now they are at the flagship, not playing or playing club. For my own kids, they have enjoyed being able to visit me or a grandparent or high school friends occasionally, which wasn’t an absolute requirement when picking schools, but has been a nice perk.
Great thread. I’m glad OP and family will be approaching the process with eyes WIDE open now, and looking for fit. I’m feeling optimistic that the son will end up with terrific choices.
@SanjayinSanJose thank you so much for checking in. It gives me hope that CC is still a place where people can come and get the benefit of other people’s experiences and use that to help them work with their children to make this an exciting and rewarding time in everyone’s life.
I know because of CC and the great people I met here my son is in a good place at this moment and I am excited about the prospects for my second one as decision time fast approaches.
@BiglawLawyer I love the Christmas test-it is true though! I hope my kids want to come home and visit us from time to time so try my best to not be too over the top with my controlling behaviors!
I have learned far more from my children about how to be a better person than I have ever been able to teach them. OP you have listened to your child and are willing to change your views-how awesome is that? What school can teach that? What an example that is to your son!
You are developing a very nice plan-stick around CC and you will find there are people here and a lot of them-the vast majority of them-who want to help you. They want to give back what they have been given. It’s easy to get discouraged by some of the drama around here-the noise! Just like real life with less filters…
"I've been shocked how many of his friends went farther away to college and are already back, now also going to this flagship. They either didn't like the schools, or didn't like being far away, figured out that they were spending a lot for schools that were no better (or worse) "
I’ve discussed this possibility with D. Her final choices are all out of state and I’m fine with this. This is her first time to try something kind of scary on her own. We came to the conclusion if she loves her OOS school, that’s great! If she decides, after a year, she wants to transfer to a school closer to home, that’s great! She would learn something new about herself either way.
@SlackerMomMD I have also seen what @twoinanddone describes. It happens. I know there were several kid from my oldest one’s HS class who transferred after the first year to the state U-for a variety of reasons. He told me that once a few of them got where they were going and sat in on a class and thought wow this is costing 4K they decided it wasn’t worth it. Others wanted more of a traditional college campus. A couple wanted to be closer to home due to family issues. He is still friendly with a lot of them and they all seem to have managed quite well no matter how they got started!
@Pepper03, I’ve heard the same thing. I ran into D’s preschool teacher whose ddaughters are a few years older than D. Both are very brIght. The younger one was accepted to a great seven sister college, but for whatever reason, she didn’t feel the fit after she started and maybe cost was a big factor. So she transferred back to a respectable instate university that is less than half the cost of the first school where she is thriving. This may sound odd, but I was actually encouraged by this story because it showed me that any misstep in college choice isn’t a huge life mistake and it can end well for student and parents.
I have a couple of comments. One thing I think it’s good for posters–especially new ones–to learn here on CC is that you are going to get certain predictable reactions if you ask specifically about getting into Ivy League schools. Some of these reactions are more helpful than others, but it seems to me that some of them are worth thinking about, such as:
- There are other highly selective colleges that are just as good (and selective) as the specific Ivy League schools. So broaden your horizons and refer to “highly selective schools like the Ivies, Stanford, etc.” and you will get better answers to your questions.
- The Ivies are not all the same, and several of them are more similar to some non-Ivies than to other Ivies.
- The Ivies are just an athletic league. Yeah, right. Ignore this comment.
Which leads me to:
As others have noted, parents tend to be a bit more realistic about the big picture–more likely to understand the importance of finances, and the fact that really great educations are available at many colleges. But I do think that those of us who are Ivy grads and/or Ivy parents are a bit reticent to praise them too much–after all, there are many very fine students who won’t get in. It seems a but unfeeling to claim that they are the greatest schools around. So we tend to emphasize that yes, they are great, but so are a lot of other schools.
Well, the son described in the OP was NOT considering everything, or at least not correctly. There is a high chance that he might in the future as he sits with his parents and does … indeed evaluate everything in the proper light and with the required attention and understanding. There is a good chance that the outcome will not be “that” different, but al least the son might have learned that his assumptions were hardly “on the money.”
Again, this is not to say that the son isn’t smart about his choices. It merely reinforces that he did not have all the answers (none do) but that he was reducing his choices for … few good reasons.
Also, this is not about being right or wrong. It is all about looking at the big picture with an open mind. And that open mind might help finding that elusive “best fit!”
Aren’t there fifty shades of helicoptering?
Over the years, I have had the opportunity to work with students from my neck-of-the-woods and I can share that the students who do not have strong parental support or interest are NOT the winners! In many cases, the lack of interest or support is a direct result of having no experience in tertiary education in the United States, or when it exists the experience was at the very large schools that had easy admissions. For instance, a lot of the “understanding” in my region is that the couple of colleges that are in driving distance accept … almost everyone and that attending is a factor of playing the financial aid game well enough to spend a couple of years at the school and see what happens. THAT is the message also often repeated by the local GCs as it works for the majority of the students.
On the other hand, teenagers DO benefit from the involvement of parents when they are educated enough in the finer points of the next steps in life. I do not understand the logic behind the expectation that parents, having spent the last 16 to 19 years, taking care of their children should abdicate the right to offer advice and support to a group of strangers, or even worse, let the young make all the decisions. Take a good look at what happens at our colleges and you might wonder how responsible kids without supervision really are.
The long and short versions are the same: extreme are undistinguishable and equally poor. In the middle, there is a lot of good things happening. Leaving all the decisions to the kids is squarely one of the extremes.
I could not agree at this more.
BTW, I remember that mini once mentioned here that the successes of students at most of these ivies (and many other top colleges?) rely more on their previously obtained reading/writing skills (and maybe foreign languages at some Ivies - they won’t allow any students to skip them with APs) than anything else.
I guess there may be a more limited form of such differences between a elite private high school and a public high school also. I haven seen some kids who had done relatively well in the public high school could be struggling at first when they are in these elite colleges - Once at these elite private collegee, some of these public high school kids could adapt well in a short time but some could not.
I heard (but not sure) that there are some differences between the very top law schools and non-top law schools as well (in the way they teach.)