Hi, I dont know where to post this, hence doing it here. My child is a junior in a very competitive public school, has a 4.0 gpa, wants to go to a top 10 school. She is a high performer, has decent extracurricular activities, but is extremely advanced in her academics, specifically math. She has completed Multivariable Calculus & Differential Equations as a 10th grader from a local CC & is currently enrolled in Linear Algebra. The professor she has this time is extremely unreasonable, has tests outside of the core area, there are chemistry & Physics questions & several upper division math stuff & is a harsh grader, she is at risk to get a B or C which would drop her GPA. She can drop the course & it would show as a W on her transcript or make it Pass/fail which would show that way on her transcript. Which of these options should she choose? What would be viewed more favorably by elite schools? She can also stay & try her best for an A, but we are worried the insane amount of time it would take to make sure all her bases are covered could impact her in other areas where she has significant commitments too. Please advise what would be her best options - she is extremely hardworking & would not like to diminish her chances in any way. Thanks!
That’s everyone 
btw - what’s a top 10? A US News Top 10? A top 10 in a major which might be a Michigan State or Arizona State? A top 10 in football? A US News, WSJ, or Forbes top 10? There’s lots of top 10s.
So she’s a 12th grader that’s multiple levels above where she should be?
You know, believe it or not, there’s kids at Harvard and Stanford that don’t have straight As. And may not have gotten past pre-calc.
Waaaaaaaaay too much pressure.
A B of a C, especially in a class this level, isn’t going to impact chances. I would not go pass fail because it implies she just squeaked by.
And please don’t make excuses - like fill in the additional info - “The professor she has this time is extremely unreasonable, has tests outside of the core area”
No one wants to hear that.
Do her best and she’ll be fine.
Will she get into a top 10?
I don’t know - but my answer wouldn’t change based on your question - a student is more than a gpa and any school with a 5% or less acceptance rate is a reach for pretty much everyone.
Good luck.
Is this a DE course, so one semester? Based on what you’ve shared, which isn’t much, I lean towards P/F, assuming P/F won’t require so much time as to negatively impact study time for other classes and/or quality of life.
What does her HS counselor recommend?
What math will she take next semester and in 12th grade?
I would go P/F if at risk for a C. I would say suck it up and continue graded if “at risk” for a B
You refer to the “professor”. Is this a college course, a high school course, or . . .?
So the only math class she’s taking this year is at a community college, correct? And it will show up as just a class on her transcript or will specifically show it’s a CC class?
To me, this seems like a crazy amount of pressure on a HS kid so I’d be HIGHLY supportive of just dropping the class. If she needs a math class for the year- has she taken stats yet? She’s clearly advanced in math, so catching up on a HS class isn’t going to kill her. Some work- but not a back-breaking class in most high schools. If her guidance counselor can pull some strings to get her in to a stats class- it counts as math, it won’t be as time consuming as a college Linear Algebra class– that seems like a good solution.
What was the math plan for next year?
Again, if it were me- I’d try to dial back the college talk for now. First she needs to get through HS- hopefully with time for sleep, a social life, performing in the HS musical or volunteer work or whatever her outside interests are. College isn’t running away, and it is healthy to identify your limits and react appropriately. College level class was too hard and too demanding- so she dropped it. Case closed.
She’s now had a taste of college btw. Professors in a Linear Algebra class are going to assume that the students have already had physics, chem, etc. So it’s not unreasonable to include “adjacent material”. If she took a college seminar on the Russian Revolution, the professor would assume she’d already taken the two semester sequence of “European History from Charlemagne to the Fall of the Berlin Wall”. That’s how college works. You don’t advance until you’ve covered off the foundational courses. Really good lesson for her about not getting ahead of your skis!
She will be taking Discrete next semester.
OOH. Maybe reconsider. Why the rush to get through college level math if the current semester is proving too much?
Thank you for your feedback. We are fully supportive of her decisions, and have always been supportive. I agree a taste of college has been good for her, but the course contents have been evaluated by a UC Math professor & he agrees the course content for a introductory Linear algebra should not be including abstract algebra & normal analysis which are typically upper division math courses. The professors words “ the materials are wildly inappropriate”. I dont know squat about math, so to me it all sounds the same. She is speaking to the counsellor to see best options. The main concern is pass/fail versus drop. Thanks again, appreciate your feedback.
Discrete math contains topics mostly of interest to computer science majors, but also includes instruction and practice in proof techniques that will be useful for math majors. However, these topics tend to be significantly different from the computationally focused continuous math that most previous math courses (algebra, trigonometry, calculus, multivariable calculus, differential equations) cover, so some students find difficulty adjusting to the topics.
Thank you, appreciate your feedback! I agree most college admissions are a reach for most students today!
Even though the student is advanced in math, they need math in junior year S2 and senior year. (At least for selective school admissions.)
This is one of the risks of accelerating math this quickly. The vast majority of people top out in math somewhere and/or hit the point where math doesn’t come as easily as it once did, sometimes requiring significant time and effort.
What math is planned for senior year?
Actually, most colleges are not that selective, and even most “more selective” colleges are not so selective to be automatic reaches for high school students with 4.0 or 3.9 GPA.
She loves math & has been breezing through most of her math at all grades. We just are trying to support her interests, but also balance her aspirations & social development. She was identified as a high performer but we still have tried to keep her at normal age/peer level so she doesn’t miss out growing with like aged kids. I agree she has all the time in the world to learn all that she wants, math or otherwise Parenting is hard, does not come with a manual on how to deal with kids & that’s why i lean on the support of like minded parents like you, so thank you!
We dont know beyond discrete, because the local community college does not offer anything further. Maybe some other elective courses at school that interests her.
Does she currently have a career path in mind? I’m sure you’re aware that most likely none of these classes will transfer to a “top 10 school.” If she has any premed aspirations, do be aware that all college courses will be reported even if she was just 15 or 16 when she took them.
We actually ran into a very similar problem my daughter’s junior year. She was driving to the local flagship (30+ minutes away) to take Calc 3 and it was a disaster for completely different reasons. We overlooked the reality of leaving high school, driving and PARKING at the university and returning in the middle of the day. Then snow hit. She was an utter wreck within weeks. Leaving high school classes early, stressing about extra curriculars. She took the W. She did obtain a letter from the professor stating she was doing fine in the class as we were also worried how it would look.
If it provides reassurance, she had excellent admission results. She did actually take stats as someone above mentioned (I’ll also say it was not a rigorous class). She ended up going for a full IB diploma which dictated her math choice senior year.
It’s great to show rigor, but at a certain point it does become counterproductive. I really wish we had recognized earlier the amount of stress our daughter was piling on herself. Best of luck in navigating.
If the student keeps linear algebra and then takes discrete math, the only remaining option available at community colleges would be some sort of introductory statistics (which is usually at the AP statistics level, although a few community colleges may offer calculus based introductory statistics as well). Additional math courses would be those offered at four year schools to math majors.
I encourage her to take a math class senior year. Do not sub an elective for core math.
Does the HS offer AP stats (if she hasn’t taken it already?) AP Stats would be a drop in rigor, but at least a math class. There are many virtual math classes thru colleges that she can take next year too.
Have her talk with her HS counselor to see what they recommend.
She doesn’t need AP stats. She needs a math class once she drops her current CC class. Regular old stats is just fine. No adcom is going to look at her transcript and think “What a dope…. she took Stats instead of Linear Algebra junior year”.
OP- it’s great you’ve been so supportive of her interests. Sometimes being supportive means sitting your kid down and explaining- against the protests- “you’ve bitten off more than you can chew”. OR- “it’s perfectly fine if you get a C in the class”. OR “Do YOU want to drop the class? If so we support you. Do YOU want to take it pass/fail? If so, we support you”.
No single grade is going to define the rest of her life!
Thank you, we have done that & she has our unequivocal support for most of her life choices. We are working with the counsellor to chart her best & feasible option. Thanks again!