The schools we visited for business all recommended Calculus. Some even required it for admission or at least to be competitive.
When you are talking about admission to Smeal or other competitive business undergrad you really need to be thinking about taking as many AP classes as possible and in all the difficult subjects such as Calc. I don’t think A/B and B/C are necessary but at least AP Calc A/B
If I understand correctly, this student WOULD be taking Calculus, but as part of the summer session at a local college.
In terms of TO or not: EMS, Eberly, Smeal,Engineering, IST would really want to see your SAT or ACT score, especially your Math score, because many students get their math grades thanks to retakes, extra credits, etc. and it can be difficult to evaluate mastery and how “calculus-ready” applicants are.
Correct. She would take Calculus the summer between 11th and 12th at local college but report it on her SRAR. If instead she takes Calculus during 12th she would take regular college prep level (not AP or Honors) She is not applying business or engineering, but rather thinking pre-health (pre-PA, OT/PT, SLP)
This year for Smeal many were test optional that got into it and with precalc senior year as well. For EMS, IST, and engineering they may like SAT scores but know many admitted over last few years that were test optional. Unfortunately, with so few kids reporting SATs the scores are skewed very high and if you do not have a really strong SAT score it actually hurts you to report it. Now if you have a decent SAT and so so grades it can help you. I will say engineering seems to be the one college that they seem to like SATs, but again know of students admitted without them. There was an admissions officer for PSU who did a videoed info session last year and he mentioned that about 1/2 of kids do not report SATs and they actually find that grades and course rigor are more reflective of ability of students to succeed at Penn State and that they are truly test optional. Now if you have a 1500 plus SAT and apply engineering with strong grades you will probably be an early admit to COE. Probably will also be the students who can definitely succeed in the rigorous engineering curriculum as well. I should add grade inflation happens at some schools and others not. In our area the private schools seem to have grade inflation, but the large public schools not as much. You can’t retake a calculus test because you got a C. The second chance learning is really geared towards kids failing and then they allow a limited number of test retakes in very specific circumstances. So can say that the kids grades are truly what they earn for the better students and those who tend to apply to Penn State.
How do you know many were test optional?
As mentioned, an admissions officer from Penn State did a virtual information session that was recorded end of last summer. He specifically stated about half of applicants do not submit test scores and it will not harm you if you do not submit them. Additionally, a Google search will bring up some specific articles from Penn State supporting that information. I have a engineering student there now who did submit scores as his SATs were in the 1500s, also have incoming freshman to university park for this fall who did not submit scores as didn’t feel it enhanced his application.
The official line from admissions is that TO will not hurt you. I’m not so sure. There is a human bias to assume if applied TO, it must be really bad.
I will share - anecdotally - that I know of multiple cases where kids with similar (or in some cases - identical) stats, the TO kid was given a less desirable outcome. For example, the test-submitted kid was given fall and the TO kid was given summer.
I know for a fact that admissions did a study a few years ago comparing freshman year gpa’s of kids who were TO vs. test-submitted. They broke it into STEM-related majors (engineering, science, etc) vs non-STEM. They found that it was statistically significant and TO freshman gpa’s were lower than test-submitted gpa’s.
I think - trying to remember - if we saw batches of students released at same time where TO were reviewed against each other and test-submitted reviewed against each other. Almost treating them like two different pools?
My opinion would be to submit if possible. Go back to historical data and find the averages before TO - that should determine a better range of scores than the years when TO became an option.
Admitted freshman to UP for this year both fall and summer admits for IST, engineering, Smeal, HHD, Ag College, Undecided that over 1/2 didn’t submit scores. Strong grades and rigor but not 4.0 and they were admitted to UP. Our large PA public school sends many kids to Penn State. Now those with borderline gpas (think 3.5 or lower unweighted) and lower rigor got 2 plus 2. But of those I know admitted to main campus, I’d actually say it was under 50% that reported SATs. Kids with 1200s didn’t report them. Know some with low 1300s that didn’t report them either (personally I would submit a 1300 plus).
My fall 2025 admit was borderline gpa (3.55 UW) and TO and admitted fall UP to HHD / nutritional sciences. She did have heavy amount of d/e coursework to earn associate’s degree with hs diploma. My fall 2027 applicant has a very similar profile and likely TO as well. Has this most recent admission cycle gotten tougher? Should she plan for summer or even a 2+2 outcome? She’s likely applying undecided or something pre-health (OT/PT/SLP)
Most of the students I know that had good rigor with 3.5 or higher unweighted but much higher weighted gpas, but decent amount of honors, AP, and/or DE got into main campus with mix of fall and summer admits depending on major. I did see kids get into Smeal with those stats this year, but seemed engineering needed slightly higher gpa from the ones I spoke to. Students below 3.5 unweighted with maybe lower rigor seemed to get 2 plus 2. Know a few who were successful with reconsideration that were just a bit below 3.5 unweighted. It has gotten more competitive over last several years with just the sheer number of applications. Junior year grades are important. I know I reminded my student not to get summer fever end of the school year and let grades slip. The difference between an A and B plus or even B is definitely noticeable in their gpa and that is very important to admissions for Penn State. Additionally, if the school offers honors, AP, and dual enrollment and your student took none or very little that will also negatively impact you. You don’t need 8 APs, but having a mix of honors, AP, and DE helps your application. I should say that the minimum it seems that admissions likes is multiple honors classes and maybe 1 or 2 APs and 1 or 2 DEs. Many students will have more than that but seems to be the low end of what admissions likes to see. Gpa and rigor are the most important items for admissions to Penn State based on last couple years.
Gpa and rigor have always been more important. Penn state has always treated test scores as a lower weight than gpa. That is nothing new.
Oh, ok. Yes the CDS states 50% and has for a few years. I believe this years is produced in Mid-May.
I’m seeing some students have invitation to Schreyer reception on their portal. Almost like an early way to see admissions decision for Schreyer.
yes, my son did not receive an invitation 
i am assuming this means he was not accepted
I would wait till decisions post as this could just be a snafu. I remember distinctly my son not finding his decision 2 years ago. He was panicking. I’m betting it’s somewhere in the Schreyer portal not the PSU portal. Additionally, Schreyer is extremely competitive and they do put students on waitlists as well. If not admitted freshman year there is always sophomore year which is a bit easier admittance.
We are in his My Penn State Schreyer portal/page. I am seeing a few students who found their acceptance on this page….unless I am looking in the wrong place
Don’t remember where my son went but it wasn’t immediately seen two years ago. Had to follow a certain path to get to the decision.
interesting that they released acceptances the day before the scheduled release date. could they be doing them in batches?
I wish they didn’t send them out this way. They advised it would be all at once at 3:00 tomorrow. It’s stressful to see some students getting theirs today.