PhD or MD, concerns with PhD/academia job market

Graduate School
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Hi, I’m a freshman chemistry major at the university of Alabama and was a regular on here in high school. I am currently premed, and I have been since the beginning of high school. However, I’m less sure now. I really love chemistry and physics, especially things that connect the two. I’m currently in general chemistry 2 and physics 2 with calc (electricity and magnetism). I still think I would enjoy the career of medicine, especially doing OB/GYN or pediatrics, but I don’t like biology very much (think small scale like cell bio etc), and I’m much better at understanding concepts and solving problems than memorizing things, so I’m really worried about anatomy classes and med school in general. I also just don’t know which path, grad school or med school, I would enjoy my career in more, so I’ll shadow a lot of doctors this summer! To be clear I still think I could very much enjoy a career as a doctor, I am just less sure about it.

One main concern I have with the grad school track is that I think I would want to become a professor if I did that. A year ago, from what I understand, academia was already a horrible job market with far more qualified individuals than job openings. Now with some…drastic political decisions, it seems like the future of academia in America in general is in question, grad school will be likely insanely competitive because of fewer spots due to reduced funding, and I’m nervous the job market will be even worse.

So my question is, even if I decide I would enjoy being a research professor more than a doctor, if I really value job security, should I just scratch that off the list? Is there a chance that’s not even a viable career path in 4 years? Of course other careers with a grad degree in chemistry and physics are still on the table, but for this thread I’m mainly looking for insight into academia.

Also, if anyone else has been in the med school vs PhD spot and has advice, I’d love to hear it!

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I would not count on PhD funding right now. You still have a ways to go….so who knows.

It is also very difficult to get into academia. I will not say anything else because I do not want to get political.

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That is unfortunately also what I’m thinking

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You can take the premed courses while you decide.

You might decide to do something that does not require medical school and is not in academia. You are still a freshman.

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If you love chemistry and physics there are lots of cool jobs that don’t involve becoming a physician. You could work on a team developing new types of prosthetic devices. You could work in pharma figuring out new delivery mechanisms for drugs. You could work in sustainability developing carbon scrubbing devices to reduce emissions, or get a job with a company that designs systems to save shorelines from erosion, or develop bulwarks that protect marshland from hurricane damage.

You really don’t need to figure this out right now. Your plan to shadow physicians is a good one. At the end of the day, medicine is about patients and if you don’t like patient care, that’s a good insight. The academic job market hasn’t been good for a while, so right now we are seeing it go from bad to horrible. Even if it bounces back by the time it’s relevant for you- it won’t be 1962, that’s for sure. So just focus on taking as many interesting courses as possible right now!

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I echo much of what’s been said so far. But, you might prioritize getting direct patient care experience over shadowing (IMO shadowing can be beneficial, but standing in the corner listening to the physician/patient interaction is not direct patient care.) The idea is to work directly with patients…so look at volunteering/working in an underserved community clinic, hospice, retirement home, hospital, etc. You might also consider becoming a CNA/assistant CNA. Good luck.

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I would spend time deciding whether you enjoy direct patient care and the day-to-day responsibilities of a physician or other health care professional.

As noted above, there are careers out there that involve chemistry and physics without direct patient care. You might want to explore them.

Good luck.

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My impression is that many of my specialist doctors do a lot of research. You could get an MD and also an MPH is your so choose. Personally I would avoid a PhD in science per se.

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There are medical specialties without much patient contact, e.g. pathology, academic research in any specialty, radiology, anesthesiology, toxicology, clinical informatics, public health

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Yes, and these are the years to explore.

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I’m a biomedical research prof at an R1 with a med school. My spouse is a chemistry prof who primarily teaches (we work at different schools). I talk to a lot of undergrads who are deliberating between PhD and MD (please don’t even think about a combined MD/PhD at this point and PM me if you’re considering so I can talk you out of it).

The academic job market is tough, to say the least. It’s not super hard to get a job teaching undergrads, but a lot of primarily undergrad institutions are struggling, and those can be precarious positions these days. Most profs who teach undergrads do love what they do, but the pay and security is highly variable between schools.

As for being a PhD professor leading an academic research lab? Those jobs are very hard to get, and then you have to worry about getting your lab funded with external grants, every year. It never stops. It’s a great gig if you are one of the lucky few who can get the position and get tenured, get grants, etc. I won’t tell someone not to go for it if that’s what they want, but you have to go in with eyes wide open. I have mentees who have gone on to do that successfully, but it’s not an easy or guaranteed path. And the backup options can be really disappointing to some who can’t get the coveted positions.

As you mention, we’re living in, uh… interesting times. Right now pretty much everyone in the academic research world is freaking out. We don’t know how bad things will get nor for how long.

What most people don’t know is that you can have an amazing career in research with an MD. The NIH loves it when MDs apply for research grants. Universities love to hire MDs as research professors because they can do clinic work as a fallback. On average, the pay and job market / security is way better for an MD than a PhD. If you go the MD research route, you’ll have to be proactive about making sure that you get as much research experience as possible, to make up for the lack of traditional PhD training. But it’s certainly do-able.

People have given you good suggestions for exploring clinical work. If you think there’s any chance you might like to be a clinician, don’t rule out med school just yet. Even if you don’t think you want to primarily be a clinician long term, med school could still be the right fit for you.

Being a good doctor AND being a good researcher both are a lot about solving problems. If you’re curious and like science, that’s a good sign. Don’t worry about the memorizing too much.

Honestly, if I had it to do over again, I think I’d become an MD (perhaps specializing in radiology or pathology), and would have still gone into research. Medical research is a huge interdisciplinary field, and people from all backgrounds work on this stuff. My floor in my biomedical research building has biologists, chemists, MDs, veterinarians, engineers, physicists, programmers, etc, all working together to solve interesting problems.

If you want to do research, either degree can definitely get you there. Which one is best for you is going to depend on a lot of specific factors. You don’t need to worry about deciding quite yet, but I encourage you not to shut the door on med school.

You’re doing a great job thinking about all this stuff so early, so you’re way ahead of the game. You might also consider doing some research in a biochem lab and/or with a physician scientist to see how you like it.

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