Pre-med Struggles

Applying to College
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Some state schools have programs in place where premeds are paired with a current medical student. They meet up on a monthly basis to ask questions, help with the process etc. Premeds are also invited to events sponsored by the med school where they can ask questions etc. Of course this assumes that the state school has a medical school.

Paid internships with housing can be found at state schools as well…and is worth investigating.

Private schools/LACs come with many resources and supports- hopefully the NPCs find some to be affordable.

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Here’s my advice…SLOW DOWN! You’re still in high school. Right now is too soon to even be thinking about medical school. To put it in perspective, out of all the “premed” hopefuls coming out of high school, very few actually go to medical school. It’s because as students mature, they find out where their real passions are.

Here’s what you do…find an affordable university, and go in with an open mind. Explore what you like. If medicine is right, go for it. For now enjoy being a teenager. Have fun, go to prom, just don’t blow anything up :slight_smile:

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43

I wonder if things are moving too fast here. YWhen a lot of HS kids start thinking about a career in medicine it becomes “I’m pre-med!” and they embark on a path that will take 11+ years of school/training plus enormous debt.

Doctors are far from the only ones that help people. Physical therapists, radiology techs, nurses, speech pathologists, physician assistants, nurse practitioners, to name but just a few. as you can see on http://explorehealthcareers.org (already posted above by @thumper1)

Unless you have carefully considered the alternatives and have spent time working in a health care setting (an unwritten requirement to get into med school BTW) its better to think of yourself as interested in exploring a career as a doctor rather than someone who has already made the decision.

As far as where to go should premed be right for you, any college in the country offers the dozen or so lower-division science and math needed by premeds and is capable of teaching those classes. Don’t look at how successful applicants are from a given college. Some start with top students like you and they do well. At the rest, admit rates are easily manipulated by colleges that have committee letters; only back the strongest kids and your admit rate will be dazzling. Publics don’t have committee letters; anyone who wants can apply to med school.

Whether a kid works for good grades, get to know some profs so they get strong recs, take part in appropriate ECs, and develops compelling essays is up to them. Twenty years ago attending a college with a well-informed premed counselor could be of great help instead of relying on rumors from college friends, but these days there is plenty of info online as well as advice forums so kids can be equally informed no matter where they go.

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44

There are a good many free resources for pre- meds. National and campus level clubs and organizations that offer advice, internships, mentoring, networking with current med students and med school admission officers. You can find them on most state campuses and they offer great opportunities for pre-meds.

AMSA has undergrad branches. There are also organizations for pre-meds who come from UIM groups, or from low Ses backgrounds.

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45

so my guidance counsellor basically said that I should not apply premed to matches or reaches due to the extremely high set of requirements (she called it being “strategic”) and to just switch to a premed track later. after some thought, I’m realising she’s obviously saying this to help me get into college, but it’s not her job to see whether I get through college or Bowdoin premed, for instance. so, I’m definitely doing honours college at one of the state school’s that my school usually uses as a safety. so many benefits: saving money, much higher chance of keeping GPA up, and also the college has this cool botanical major, and the location is actually nice. thanks everyone for all your help! I now have a whole spreadsheet with possible majors and a plan b thanks to this forum :slight_smile: I love being organised

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46

Pre med is advising, not a major. You take advantage once you are there - so I’m not sure of the strategy they are talking about.

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47

I am confused by what your guidance counselor is telling you. Premed is not a major.

Sounds like you found a great safety!

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48

If you will be targeting state schools then besides the honors colleges look a little deeper to see if there are any other cohort type programs. Some of the cohorts pull together students and come with a nice scholarship, others are living learning communities or scholars programs designed around a specific theme like pre-health professionals, etc. These programs tend to have special advisors and are how students are able to make a big school small by helping the students make connections. Sometimes special programs like the Biomedical Science major at Ohio State might require an early supplemental application. Pay attention to the early action deadlines and dig into the websites of the large state schools to learn about special opportunities.

https://honors-scholars.osu.edu/future-students

You haven’t given a budget, so not sure Ohio State would be affordable without one of their full tuition or full ride scholarships for your family.

https://www.stampsscholars.org/our-program/partner-schools/

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49

Some private schools can be very generous with financial aid. I’d run the net price calculator at more reaches, they may be cheaper for you than your state school depending on your family’s finances and the cost and available aid at your state school.

Run the net price calculators at Harvard, Rice, and Notre Dame (these tend to be very generous).

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50

Premed is just a box you check on your application. Your college counselor is asking you not to check it because at most selective colleges 1/3 applicants check it, generally because they like science.
You need to have a major you’re well-suited for. (Premed pre-reqs are just a bunch of 1st year classes for the most part, the trick is taking the course meant for majors and doing better than 80% of them).
Also, depending on your income, private universities may be cheaper and more supportive. Run the NPC on every single college (each calculates in their own way).
Applying to your state university’s honors college is just ONE element of a successful college strategy. Sounds like it’s a great safety. Check that it’s affordable and if it is, you only need one more like this before moving on to finding good matches.

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51

There are also highly competitive BS/MD programs and the one at Wayne State is incredibly generous with theirs.

Summary of program benefits

  • Admission to College of Liberal Arts and Sciences and Irvin D. Reid Honors College
  • Admission to WSU School of Medicine*
  • Four years of paid undergraduate tuition**
  • Four years of paid undergraduate room and board in university housing**
  • Four years of paid School of Medicine tuition**
  • Participation in specially designed pre-freshman summer program
  • Cutting-edge research and field experiences with renowned faculty mentors
  • Participation in curricular enhancements such as community service and clinical experiences
  • Participation in a Learning Community focused on leadership training and health disparities education
  • Dedicated academic advising, MCAT preparation help, and medical school application support

*Subject to matriculation criteria and holistic admissions process

**Subject to scholarship eligibility criteria and maintaining satisfactory academic progress

from Wayne Med-Direct - Wayne State University

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52

Do you think it would be best to apply to the colleges which my counsellor says I can apply to on the actual premed track (checking off the premed box) rather than being “strategic” and applying for an “easier” major with less requirements and then switching? The colleges in that list are cheaper and I’m assuming if I can’t get in as a premed, my likelihood of actually surviving premed classes is really low (they’re not going to admit me as a premed if they don’t think I can handle it, right?) The other thing is that Bowdoin doesn’t have a premed track box—I think, correct meif wrong—and one other girl from my school w/ similar stats went there with intentions of being premed (majoring in bio) so I was thinking I could maybe be Bowdoin for ED1 and then state honours/school I can click premed box on for ED2?

Bowdoin article I referred to: Becoming Doctors, but First Studying the Liberal Arts | Bowdoin College

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You are still fundamentally not understanding “pre-med.”

It is NOT a thing.

You can apply to med school no matter where you go to school or what your major is, AS LONG AS you have fulfilled course requirements, taken the MCAT and did whatever bogus volunteering stuff you need (being cynical here).

I am curious as to who your advisor is. Is this person someone at the school? Given a lot of people now have “paid” advisors / counselor, I hope you are not actually paying for bad advice.

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54

school counsellor :see_no_evil:

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You should scroll back on many advice posted on this thread. All of them are better than what you have been told by your school counsellor.

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56

OP- the only strategy you need to worry about right now is finding a range of colleges where you can be admitted and which your family can afford. Some can be “sure bets”, some can be “I’m a solid admit but not a lock” and some can be reaches. Or just all sure bets as long as they are affordable.

Worrying about checking boxes and treating the process like a game is not in your best interests. You can major in art history and be “pre med”; you can major in linguistics and be “pre med”. There are few advantages to actually “majoring” in premed. And the biggest downside- most HS kids who think they want to become doctors don’t actually end up in med school. So finding something you are good at and which gives you backup options in case med school doesn’t happen is MORE important than which box you check.

“they’re not going to admit me as a premed if they don’t think I can handle it, right?”

That’s not how admissions works. A significant majority of applicants to every college can “handle it”, i.e. do the work. You need to show the adcom’s that not only are you well prepared for college level work, you add something to the university community.

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57

This is what you should do:
Apply to any major that is easy to you and that you find interesting. Do not check the premed box. (I explain why below).
It can be any major though I’d recommend not Biology, unless paired with, say, stats or Data Science etc. But really ANY subject you’re good at and like, works.
Once in college, take Gen chem1 with Lab for your science 1st semester alongside your Freshman seminar, Calculus1 or 2, your foreign language (or Spanish1), perhaps Sociology 1.
Your goal should be to get As in all (using office hours and tutoring - in college, most students need thar to go from B+ to A).
Second semester, take Gen Chem2 with lab, Psychology 1, General biology 1 with lab, Statistics or Biostats, one major-related class.
If your GPA is 3.7-4.0, congratulations, you’re premed AND you’ve taken all typical gen eds AND you’re on track for whatever major.
At that point you declare you want to be premed. Not before. As a high school senior? Yeah, lots of kids want to, but it’s really premature.

Now run the NPC on Bowdoin. Is it affordable ? Do you like the school? Have you visited (along with Colby and Bates, and do you have a preference)? Are you on these 3s mailing list?
If the NPC shows it’s affordable and you like Bowdoin, sure, apply ED.
You’ll need to apply to a bunch of EA/Priority universities in August, too - your state school, Pitt, etc.

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58

Modern Jazz Musician
Concert pianist
English literature connoisseur
Wall Street Investment Banker
Chemistry Professor
News paper reporter
MTV executive
Lab technician
Nurse

Do you know what these people have in common? They are people who ended up going to med school to become MDs and enjoy successful careers in medicine. There is not fixed path. There is no check box. The beauty of this is you actually CAN choose what you want and enjoy the flexibility and I think that’s what people are trying to tell you.

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Most students who can get admitted (for any major) to a school on the level of Bowdoin, and also the majority of students that top schools at this level reject, are smart enough to make it through premed classes, get accepted to medical school, and get through medical school. However, being smart is not enough. It is not even close to enough. It takes a great deal of hard work and a great deal of determination to make it to medical school and again to graduate from medical school. You need to put in the long hours day (and night) after day (and night) after day (and night). You need compassion. You need to put up with some unpleasant patients. You need to memorize a lot, and read a lot, there will be long hours, and I am sure that there is a lot more that I have missed. You will be tested at a level that you do not see in high school. You need to find it inside yourself to keep putting in the effort over an extended period of time. You also need to figure out how to pay for 8 years of university.

Also, when you get to university you will be exposed to things that you just haven’t yet had an opportunity to see. You will be taking lab classes. You might decide that lab work is the thing for you. You will be taking some math and physics and chemistry classes. You might decide that math or physics or chemistry is the thing for you. You might decide that you do not want to deal with patients, but you like to deal with cancer cells, grow them, and find ways to stop their growth or to kill them (what could be more fun that killing cancer cells?). You might be fascinated by gene related diseases and decide to instead go into research to find ways to deal with them.

As an undergraduate student I saw a couple of other students drop out, and one change his major (from computer science to history). All of them were smart enough to do the work. They basically either decided that they didn’t want to work that hard, or they didn’t want to deal with the stress, or they just could not handle the stress, or (in one case) they couldn’t get themselves to class consistently when their parents weren’t there to keep them together.

Based on your stats at the beginning of this thread, I think that you quite likely can handle it. I do not know whether you will decide that you want to once you get into the middle of it and get exposed to other options for a major and for a career.

@cy7878 listed some undergraduate majors of students who went on to medical school. These students completed the requirements for their major, and also completed the requirements that were needed to apply to medical school. I can add one more example of a major of a successful premed student. Years ago I had robot assisted surgery (it worked out well). Before having the surgery, I found a video of a surgeon painting a tiny picture of the hospital where he worked, using the Da Vinci Robotic Surgery system. He specialized in robot assisted surgery. However, his undergraduate major had been art. I do not know whether this is the same video that I found back then, but I think that this video from YouTube is probably the same surgeon painting that same picture. This is actually pretty cool IMHO, and makes the point that you can even major in art and go on to medical school:

Also, you do not need to apply ED anywhere, and probably shouldn’t apply ED anywhere unless both (i) you have a clear first choice, and (ii) you know that you will be able to afford it if you get in. If you do not have well over $300,000 for a bachelor’s degree plus well over $400,000 more for an MD, then you probably shouldn’t apply ED without first running the NPC (Net Price Calculator) on whatever university or college you are considering applying to ED. If you do not apply ED anywhere, then you will get to see what offers you receive and compare them before you decide where to attend.

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60

OP I feel you are making this more complicated than it needs to be as a HS student. I would put medical school to the side for now.

Apply to a range of schools, consider costs, and find a college where you can be happy for 4 years. ED…IF you find an affordable school that you love.

Pick a major that you find interesting and take the prerequisites for medical school. While you are in college make sure to do well academically, get involved, volunteer, make new friends etc. Maybe you will shadow at school, maybe you will shadow at home during breaks.

This is not a race to the finish line. Medical school will be there if you decide to apply as a junior, or if you decide to take a few gap years to work, strengthen your application etc. Maybe you will even discover a new path that you never even knew existed.

Right now? Enjoy the rest of HS and develop an appropriate list of schools to apply to. That’s it.

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