Hi everyone,
Planning to visit following acceptances for DD, from southern California. Would love to hear your advice about which college stats provides maximum chances to matriculate to md program.
University of Toledo bacc2md
Saint Luis University med scholar
Creighton , also in med scholar program
Case ( this is more expensive by 20-25k per year than above choices)
Thanks sm!
Your daughter can complete the required courses for medical school applicants at any of these listed colleges.
She should choose the one where she can see herself living and being happy for the next four years. Happy students get better grades, and she will need to be at the top of her game for a medical school application.
In my opinion, her feel of fit should define her choice.
I’m a huge fan of CWRU. If the cost is affordable for your family (something only you can decide) that’s fine.
Do keep in mind a few things:
@WayOutWestMom can tell you if any of these colleges use committee letters…because that might be a consideration.
In my opinion, there is no college that “provides maximum chances to matriculate to MD schools”. Really, that’s on the student. Great grades, shadowing, volunteering with underprivileged populations, patient facing work, great MCAT score, LOR, interviewing skills. That all matters!
Thanks, agree but Case this year COA went upto 90k..she got some scholarship,
committee letter will do some research
D has other DO option with lecom but not sure should we lock down the program at this point with another feeder college
thanks!
@momsearcheng can you give some input here since you have a student doing undergrad as part of the LECOM BS/DO program?
Congratulations on these acceptances. Your D will be able to get into med school from any of these colleges, I don’t think her chances are meaningfully greater at any of these schools.
Has she visited these schools?
What is the backup plan if your D doesn’t achieve the requirements to apply to Toledo’s MD school? Baccalaureate 2 MD Pathway Program (BACC2MD)
That’s the rub with some of the combined BSMD programs…the student can find themselves at a less resourced undergrad school than some others they had been accepted to if they leave the pre-med path for whatever reason. One thing I do like about this program is that students can apply to other med schools, which means she’s not locked in to Toledo MD school.
Note your D will need backup plan no matter which school she selects, as most first years who say they are pre-med don’t end up going to med school. Does that potentially impact/change her choice?
Can parents affordably cover COA at Case? Even so, I would hesitate to choose Case considering the other acceptances in hand. Will parents be able to partially/fully fund med school and if so, how much will undergrad $ impact that?
None of the BA/MD pathway programs your daughter has been accepted to guarantee a med school admission. They only guarantee an early interview for the associated med school and an early decision at the beginning of her senior undergrad year about admission into the associated med school.
Of the 3 programs, St Louis’s Med Scholars program probably has the highest acceptance rate into its associated med school. Creighton is second and Toledo is 3rd.
Students in the programs will get an annual assessment and review of their progress toward meeting the requirement for getting their med school interview.
St. Louis U and Creighton U are both Catholic colleges. Your daughter will be required to take a minimum number of religion/religious philosophy classes as part of her graduation requirements. There will be religious symbolism all over campus, such as crucifixes in classrooms and a prominent chapel. Assemblies, convocations, etc will start with a Catholic prayer. Religion classes are NOT indoctrinate or dogmatic in nature, but will generally assume a belief in a higher power. If she finds any of that a deal breaker–then you have your answer about which school to choose.
Creighton and SLU both emphasize service to others (It’s a Jesuit value) in their pre-meds so if your daughter should choose to attend either of those programs, she should definitely aim for more than the minimums expected of students in the program.
While Case is great school, I would be very hesitant about spending $90K/year on a college, particularly if med school is in the picture.
Currently the funding of medical education is uncertain. A bill currently under very seriously consideration in Congress will cap the amount of student loans a med student can take out (for both undergrad AND professional education) to $135K over a lifetime. This will make paying for medical school more…complicated. Minimizing any undergrad debt will be very important should she attend med school.
It’s awfully late in the application cycle to be hunting for an undergrad. IIRC, LECOM limits the number of students it will accept from each feeder school. Be sure to ask when looking into various feeders if they still have BA/DO slots available. They may have already used up their allotment.
Here’s the list of LECOM partner schools. There are several CalStates listed.
Since your daughter has so many BA/MD options and must be a strong & dedicated student who will likely be a strong med school applicant in 4 years, I’d recommend she pursue a MD program instead of LECOM.
No shade to DOs, but a MD opens more doors and keeps more options open for a pre med than a DO does. DOs are significantly less likely to match into procedural specialties than MDs. Mostly because most DO med school do not have a home hospital where students get plenty of early exposure to participating in procedural medicine. (Procedure = anything invasive, like surgery)
Less likely doesn’t mean never, It just means it harder and requires more effort to get there for DOs. Now if your D is looking at a primary care specialty or EM, then DO programs are just fine.
RE: committee letter. The BA/MD programs have a committee letter baked into the process. However, the student will be informed well ahead of time if they haven’t met the minimums required to progress to the med school interview stage. The committee letter isn’t the same kind of screening process that students outside of the programs undergo.
Case uses a committee letter to pre-screen students before allowing them to apply to med school.
One last comment: southern CA (in fact, ALL of California) is bad place to be a pre-med. There are way too many pre-meds and not enough med school seats to accommodate all of them. (The pre-meds graduating from UCB alone could fill every single CA public AND privat med school seat and still have pre-meds left over.) The majority of successful CA pre-med will attend an OOS med school.
Since your daughter has 3 good early admission options on her list, pick one and run with it. Be the best pre med she can at one of those schools and she’ll likely be able to beat out the California curse.
I would cross out the UToledo program - odds aren’t very good and the undergraduate experience there wouldn’t match the other choices’.
SLU and Creighton: she would need to visit because they’d be very different from California in culture and environment. Not bad - just different from each other and different from her normal environment.
College is a time for growth and discovering new places so this would be a fantastic opportunity to do so but she needs to make sure she’ll feel like she belongs, at least some of the time. 
I assume she’s comfortable with Catholic imagery, if not she needs to think whether it will bother her (I know that some students are bothered by the crucifixes more than by plain crosses, for instance). As mentioned above, the required courses are more Philosophy, History of religion, Great books/enduring questions. This and the emphasis on service would help her structure some things she needs for med school.
Once she’s visited she should have a favorite.
Case would be the best choice if (like 90% would be premeds) she grows and discovers fields of greater interest because they admit students to the university not to a major (all majors are thus open to her, as well as double majors, major&minor in totally different fields..) However if the cost difference would mean parental loans choose one of the 2 above, after visiting to make sure they’re good fits.
What kind of comments are you intested in?
I can’t comment on LECOM feeders. They are all different.
Is DD regretting to go to LECOM feeder? So far no. Remember, LECOM doesn’t allow to apply out or take MCAT. The moment you do it, you are out.
Why we went with LECOM path?
I second this. There’s FB CWRU Student Parent discussions and a lot of parents complained how Case uses Committee Letters to eliminate many decent potential applicants. I forgot what the minimum GPA was, it seemed quite high. It’s a great school in terms of medical resources, however if their committee decides not to further your candidacy based on GPA all those resources mean very little.
FYI LECOM does not require committee letter, but it is one of 3 options. Students can have rec from 2 science teachers (that is what DD will get from her Chem professors.)
In fact DD almost not envolved with premed program at her school. She just follows LECOM requirements. That is another plus of LECOM program.
Here’s my thoughts on BSMD programs. Just don’t. Of all the premed hopefuls coming out of high school only about 5-10% actually apply to medical school. It’s a setup for failure, especially when, chances are, she’ll change her mind on what to major in. I recommend an affordable in-state school. This way, if she decides against medical school, there’s lots of flexibility.
Actually I disagree with that approach. DD said that if she would not have LECOM, she probably would already give up. There are students who almost do not sleep because they work in medical facilities at night and study during day. I am very happy that my daughter does not need to do it. I know that it is very hard during medical school and residency years. However, if students can suffer for 6-7 years instead of 10-11 that is a win in my books.
If students are “suffering” as pre-meds during undergrad, they’re doing something wrong.
Yes, you need to work hard. Yes, you need to manage your time well.
But “suffer”? I don’t think so…
If sleeping 4 hours a day is not suffering, then I guess it is fun? It is very difficult to find day jobs for students who have classes during the day, as a result some premeds choose evening/night shifts (like 7pm -4am) to work as scribes or nurse assistants. Dd was considering doing it. I told her No, or we will stop to pay for tuition. I am not financing suicides or mental breakdown. You can call me crazy protective mom.
I’m not discounting your daughter’s experience, but I don’t believe we should make blanket statements applied to all schools and students. That may be some students’ experience but has not been my premed D’s experience at all at a different school. And neither of our daughters attend a school on the OP’s list. Nevertheless it is good they are aware of the struggles of some so they can ask questions as they make their decision.
Agree. I think it’s fine to offer students perspective on a wide range of experiences- some premeds are stressed out and don’t sleep enough; others are actually majoring in music or art history while covering off their premed requirements and are having a less anxious college experiences. Some med students find the pace exhausting, others find it energizing. In my experience, ALL residents find the lifestyle challenging to balance, but for some, it’s the first time in their education/training that they are experiencing sleep deprivation.
But some HS students find HS challenging/anxiety provoking/not enough sleep. So YMMV.
planning to visit next week, where she thinks she belongs.
back up plan, I know Creighton has good business and Nursing schools
I think SLU also known for business & law
Toledo, not sure what their strengths are if not premed, for plan B
at this point Case with 65k+ COA, is at back burner
thank you… i think DD seems ok with Jesuit school culture, will know more when we visit…lecom is already accepted with feeder school ( Juniata college, PA), any feedback on Juniata?
yeah ..kind of feel same…with 3 options these pathway programs requires to maintain certain gpa (SLU - 3.65, Creighton - 3.6, Toledo - 3.7) plus all requires min MCAT..any insight on where its less challenging to keep up higher gpa? tks!