<p>Shrink: I never said anything about not being normal. You’re reading way too much into this whole thing. I said that it’s not typical. </p>
<p>Maybe this is better----It’s typical for 17-19 year old males to sit at home, smoke pot, not work, disrespect their parents, spend hours playing video games, and not contribute in any way, shape, or form to the family. It’s typical for a parent who has been emotionally abused by a unthankful child to continue to enable his behavior and reward him by paying for not only his private college tuition/costs but also his spending money. Does that work better for you?</p>
<p>All of this because you’re confusing my use of the word Typical!</p>
<p>“It’s typical for 17-19 year old males to sit at home, smoke pot, not work, disrespect their parents, spend hours playing video games, and not contribute in any way, shape, or form to the family. It’s typical for a parent who has been emotionally abused by a unthankful child to continue to enable his behavior and reward him by paying for not only his private college tuition/costs but also his spending money. Does that work better for you?”</p>
<p>What does this have to do with what works for me? We started out on a thread about a mom and kid who seems to have made enormous progress since earlier this year. A kid who has earned admission into a good school. A kid who some people have taken the liberty of diagnosing ( and recommended treatment for (in the old thread), sight unseen. (yes, pushes buttons for me) . I was trying to be reassuring without taking the liberty of giving advice. THAT’S what works for me. Continuing this does not. Sorry if I stepped on your toes.</p>
<p>I never referred to the person as abnormal–never used the word. Never used the word normal. Used the words “not typical”. You wouldn’t let that go. Then I mentioned the fact about summer employment and you wanted statistics. Started a casual poll on CC to see how others handled the idea of summer employment by their teenagers. When it seemed as though the majority of the responses were in support of summer employment for their teenagers, you found fault with the results. Then you post some outdated link from 1998-2000 to try to support the idea that teenagers working summer jobs is not the “norm”. No, I did not use the word normal. Any government statistics on this aren’t relative anyway because it’s not going to include “off the books” jobs that teenagers work like babysitting, mowing lawns, working for cash, etc. It’s just ridiculous.</p>
<p>Funny, that was similar to what a good friend said. She said she absolutely refused to work at any summer job until her third year of college, in response to my complaining about my kids not proactive enough to find summer jobs. She said she told her dad she would be working for the next 30 years or more and she don’t want to start until she is good & ready ! Well, 30 years later she is indeed still working -she’s a senior VP in one of the largest banks in the world. </p>
<p>So I guess the not working at the summer jobs when she was a teenager did not mean she was unmotivated or hurt her chances at a successful career. (My fears about my children)</p>
<p>Like CountingDowns S1, D1 is a rising first year in college and is on her first job this summer. She was offered this job in a medical billing office through my help (I am not particularly proud of that). She just finished HS in a demanding IB program. During past three summer breaks, she went to some prestigious summer camps (earned through competitions), went on a few additional trips (we paid) to more competitions (such as ARML), and did her community services. She is free during this last summer before college. As a typical 17-19 year old, without a job, she would be sleeping until 1:00 everyday, get up and play computer games (my two daughters are avid computer gamers), and waste time chatting online.
The job she has is a starting clerkship position. It is tedious with lots of data entry and quite bit of responsibilities (easy to make mistakes). People hired in such positions usually do not have college degrees. Apparently, D1 is doing very well on that job. She is fast, accurate and very good at spotting mistakes. She has been working full time for 6 weeks now and plans to continue for additional 6 weeks. She saved pretty much everything she earned. People in her department sometimes chat about how they spent their pay checks. D1 was shocked that some of them didnt have plan to save any for emergencies.
Though we do not have a financial need for her to make money, I saw good things coming out of her first job. When she earned her first pay check, D2 (6 years younger) joked with her, asking her to treat the family to a restaurant. She said to her younger sister: you know how much tedious typing I have to do to earn this check? She has another learning opportunity next year when she files her first income tax return. The amount money she will make this summer should be able to cover most of her personal use for her first year in college.</p>
insomniatic - based on your posts, I think you are very privileged and somewhat spoiled --as apparently is the case with many other children of CC parents. </p>
<p>Most parents do not have a lot of extra cash available to give their kids generous allowances or birthday gifts. I am willing to borrow money to put my kids through college, but only if they do their share – that means they borrowed as well, they paid for their own books, out-of-pocket expenses, food, & sometimes even airfare to & from their colleges. My kids have sometimes worked 2 or 3 jobs while attending school, and of course have had summer jobs. </p>
<p>This isn’t a matter of getting “burnt out”. This has to do with growing up and taking responsibility. </p>
<p>Now when that happens “typically” I don’t know. But the one thing I do know is that my kids have really impressive resumes and references when they go job-hunting. For my son, this meant a pretty good job in hand within 2 weeks after his college graduation – I have every reason to believe that it will mean the same for my daughter. </p>
<p>And no… I didn’t “make” my kids get jobs in high school. Both of them went off job hunting and found jobs on their own. I was proud of them when that happened, but I also honestly thought it was a normal part of growing up, like when my son started shaving or my daughter started wearing make up – just a change that came with the territory of being older.</p>
Whoa - please tell me you aren’t serious. You do sound spoiled.
Since you put it in these terms can I assume you spend many hours by the pool? Perhaps for the sake of insomniatic we should start a thread titles “The value of work”.</p>
<p>Shrinkrap - I never saw the “original thread” to which you and nysmile are referring but I understand some of your comments- as far as measuring up.
Now, I feel as though my kids don’t measure up because they work.
They are not and cannot spend their summer traveling to Europe, taking college classes and being otherwise “enriched”.</p>
<p>I will admit it - they work because they HAVE to. My oldest started at the local grocery store at 16 and paid for her own “expenses” - clothes, school lunch, “extras” after that.
My two youngest were into sports - they had a paper route and that paid for their tournaments, equipment and sports camps. They have bought their own clothes since they were 12.
My new high school graduate has two jobs this summer - both part time.
Do I apologize for any of that? No way. They actually like to work.</p>
<p>Shrinkrap - you are right though - this poll does not account for a lot of factors, namely the age of the student and what “just looking” constitutes.</p>
<p>While most kids around here do work - when I ask those who say they “can’t” find a job the answers get interesting. i.e. - I see Wal-Mart is hiring - did you apply there? A. (From a really smart college bound kid) - Wal-Mart? No way, I don’t think I could handle that.
LOL. Job snobbery exists.</p>
<p>BTW - I would count babysitting and reffing as work. I know some kids who have made considerable amounts of money off both.</p>
<p>I dunno if you’re interested, but this is just a student perspective. I just finished senior year, and I’m taking a year off before I go to university.</p>
<p>I’m leaving my first job next week, after working there for a little over two years. The summer before junior year my parents encouraged me to find a job, and I can honestly say that it was one of the most defining experiences of my HS career.</p>
<p>I worked at a fast food restaurant, pretty much the only in kid in my affluent suburb to do so. Nothing glamorous or exciting, but in a lot of ways it prepared me more for college and “real life” than anything academic. It was the subject that came up in the most in my college interviews, and it was one of the ways that I distinguished myself from my peers. Learning productive employment skills, learning to take direction, and getting to work with people from different economic and ethnic backgrounds was a huge bonus of working, which I never got from school.</p>
<p>I don’t want to say that it’s the best option for everyone, but I think in a lot of ways it makes more sense to devote a summer to a job than to more ECs or academic opportunities. I worked summers and during the school year, even for just 8hr/week when crunch time came up for college apps. I think a lot of people are quick to dismiss “work for the sake of work” while promoting the exact same strategy in terms of academics–ECs, APs, etc.</p>
<p>I honestly believe that there are things that you can only learn by working–not by volunteering, interning, or studying. I wouldn’t trade my work experience for anything else, even when people make fun of it or insinuate that it’s somehow “beneath” me.</p>
<p>We’ve had these threads on work before. Perhaps because the question was asked differently, I remember a lot of cc parents saying they believed school was their kids’ full time job. Many of those parents may not be posting on this thread. The relative importance of holding menial labor jobs versus other activities is a value judgment unique to each family and to some extent unique to each child. Almost any value judgment will become a hot button topic like the threads on how to keep your high schooler from drinking. What works in one family or neighborhood culture may not be doable in another. </p>
<p>I know my kids can be lazy and unmotivated one minute and hardworking scholars the next, depending on my mood–or the thread.</p>
<p>I don’t know if insomniatic is spoiled or not. I am a parent and I was one of those kids who put herself through college by working many jobs. For a couple of years I also contributed to the family financially by working at their business. By the time third & last year of college I was exhausted. I always wondered if my GPA would be much better if I didn’t work so much. The last years of college and two years after graduation were one of the worse times in my life.</p>
<p>The possibility of burnout all depends on the individual person, their strengths and ability.</p>
<p>calmom – When I was growing up, we all wanted to work, we wanted to earn more spending money than mom or dad gave us, we wanted the independence – it was, as you put it, what one just did when you reached 16. All our friends did. It gave us independence. I guess I carried that over to my kids.<br>
We also couldn’t wait to move out of the house. But that’s a discussion for another day.</p>
<p>I have three kids. None of them have done anything the same. All are great kids with the same parents. Yes, they are all probably spoiled in one way or another. I don’t know that any of them are typical.</p>
<p>My “economist” son worked in HS and ever since, except for a summer abroad, and an unpaid internship one summer. His first job, a summer landscaping crew in Hotlanta, cemented his desire for an office job! He is a hard worker and an ideal employee. Steady employment “fits” this kid.</p>
<p>My “musician” son is currently spending his summer performing in Santa Barbara (unpaid, but full scholarship). Definitely a “spoiled” lifestyle to those who think playing music full time isn’t “work.” All his money-making ventures have been music-related, and relatively lucrative. We believe as a family that it has been the right path for this kid, as opposed to a steady job at minimum wage in a field in which he has no lasting interest.</p>
<p>Both my boys had work-study jobs in college as well.</p>
<p>My D (just finished freshman year) has never held a regular job, for various reasons (no work visa, year-round high school, doesn’t qualify for work-study, etc) - but she also doesn’t drive much, seldom buys clothes or goes out. She tends to spend what money she has on books. She earned a little money recently and promptly spent it to take a two-day seminar she was interested in. She will be starting a job in the fall - hired by her college to tutor German students, and is really looking forward to it. I am hoping the idea of earning her own money will be exciting and stimulating to her. She is behind the “typical”, I think, in terms of both her work experience and her consumerism.</p>
<p>I’ve often felt that if I have any particular strength as a parent, it is my ability to flex with the individual kid.</p>
<p>Rising Sr. D is working at her first summer job at a restaurant (not really fast food, but sort of) She’s always been very busy in the summer with her sport before. She may/may not continue when school starts. We’ll have to decide then. Her first priority will be maintaining her grades. She is enjoying earning her own money, although I’ve noticed a bit more reluctance on her part to go to movies, etc. with friends since it’s now her money. The ironic part is that she has a friend that recently graduated. This “friend” was said that our D would never get a summer job–she didn’t need to as M and D would just give her money (not really what happens.) So called friend still hasn’t managed to find employment. It’s not because jobs aren’t available, but because she really hasn’t put in the time to look.</p>
<p>I am very, very far from spoiled. I don’t drive a new car or attend a “prestigious” university. Mommy and daddy don’t hand over money to me. Besides room, board, and tutition, everything is paid for by ME. If that is spolied, that I guess the definition has changed.</p>
<p>S2 just handed H a check to cash. Turns out he has been tutoring one of his football teammates in math this summer, so I am officially moving him from the unemployed to the employed column. Said he hadn’t mentioned this before because his friend was in summer school and didn’t want anybody to know, but I think he just loves that surprise factor on H’s face. H used to tutor football players in math when he was in college, so got all misty eyed.</p>
(My fears about my children)</p>